I'm a bit crosss...
Discussion
I was involved in a minor, low speed accident that was "the other person's fault", but I was annoyed that the situation developed quite quickly and I read it too slowly.
I was towing the Radical on its trailer. On a 3 lane slip off the A3 southbound at the M25 coming down to the lights at the roundabout.
I was in middle lane, the rh lane had about 8 cars in all stopped. The middle lane had 1 vehicle (horse-box) stopped at the front. The LH lane had one car about 8 vehicles from the lights.
As I got to about half overlapped with the car on the left, it indicated right and started to move into my lane. I instinctively slowed, the driver must have seen me and swerved back, but as I went past (I really couldn't have slowed quickly enough not to go past), she swerved back into my lane and the trailer raked down the side of her car.
Noone hurt, trailer not damaged, but her car had 4 panels damaged.
So she was about 60 and flustered to be in the wrong lane and was really only thinking about getting into the middle lane.
I tried to use my horn, but pressed the bit of the steering wheel which is helpfully not the horn!
It had to have been an avoidable accident, but it happened pretty quickly and I can't work out what I could've done differently (not sure even finding the horn would've helped). I guess there was probably "body language" exhibited, but I didn't see it.
Any thoughts?
Bert
I was towing the Radical on its trailer. On a 3 lane slip off the A3 southbound at the M25 coming down to the lights at the roundabout.
I was in middle lane, the rh lane had about 8 cars in all stopped. The middle lane had 1 vehicle (horse-box) stopped at the front. The LH lane had one car about 8 vehicles from the lights.
As I got to about half overlapped with the car on the left, it indicated right and started to move into my lane. I instinctively slowed, the driver must have seen me and swerved back, but as I went past (I really couldn't have slowed quickly enough not to go past), she swerved back into my lane and the trailer raked down the side of her car.
Noone hurt, trailer not damaged, but her car had 4 panels damaged.
So she was about 60 and flustered to be in the wrong lane and was really only thinking about getting into the middle lane.
I tried to use my horn, but pressed the bit of the steering wheel which is helpfully not the horn!
It had to have been an avoidable accident, but it happened pretty quickly and I can't work out what I could've done differently (not sure even finding the horn would've helped). I guess there was probably "body language" exhibited, but I didn't see it.
Any thoughts?
Bert
The A3/M25 roundabout is always iffy - almost always random people in wrong lanes driving strangely and seemingly thinking they're in the right - I've lost count of the number of times people have swerved across my path without even checking mirrors! I hope it gets resolved properly for you.
parapaul said:
Don't see how it could have been avoided on your part - you saw her swerve into your lane and slowed accordingly. She moved away again, god only knows why she then decided to try and park her car in your trailer...
Old age... Worst disease of all
No it ain't! In any case 60 really isn't old, not these days.Old age... Worst disease of all
Anyhow sorry to hear about your mishap, Bert. Having had a very minor contact myself with another vehicle nearly two years ago I know how upsetting it can be. That one was mostly my fault - failure of observation, plus me not giving a signal because I thought there was no one there to benefit from it!! Had I given a signal I think it very likely the other driver could have taken action to compensate for my mistake and avoid the slight bump.
In your case it sounds as if the other driver really gave you little chance of avoiding this one. It would appear you were misled as to her likely actions, despite trying to be wary. Don't worry about it. We try to do our best but these things are going to happen occasionally.
Best wishes all,
Dave.
Sorry to hear of your mishap but cant see there is anything more you could have done. I guess we have all encountered many similar situations where we ask the question 'Could I have done that any differently?'. Clearly panic set in followed by lack of proper MSM to correct her lane error. We all make mistakes in unfamiliar territory, it is how you handle them which is the test of a good driver ! Anyway, if no one was hurt that far out weighs a bit of bent metal.
I wouldn't worry about it. Sounds like she's just an unobservant baffoon and she payed the price. Obviously make sure you get the trailer properly regalvanised etc from her insurance!
Did you get any witnesses? I also had a clueless old woman drive into my car a few years ago and she wove a very elaborate story about what happened to make me sound guilty. She invented a corner (the accident happened on a straight roman road), the speed (I was in a queue doing 30mph, she said I speeding at "at least 80mph", the circumstances (she actually swerved and hit my door, but she said I was sideways after the 'bend' and hit her front bumper). What she didn't realise is that I was being followed by a solicitor at the time who saw the whole thing, and even ran off down the road after her when she tried to drive off! Shockingly, the insurance company saw that I was a young driver and didn't bother to ask for his version of events. It was all sorted in the end. It's very common though apparently, especially if the innocent party is in a sports car (or towing one!) or is especially young. It's very easy to lie and get away with it unless there are witnesses.
Did you get any witnesses? I also had a clueless old woman drive into my car a few years ago and she wove a very elaborate story about what happened to make me sound guilty. She invented a corner (the accident happened on a straight roman road), the speed (I was in a queue doing 30mph, she said I speeding at "at least 80mph", the circumstances (she actually swerved and hit my door, but she said I was sideways after the 'bend' and hit her front bumper). What she didn't realise is that I was being followed by a solicitor at the time who saw the whole thing, and even ran off down the road after her when she tried to drive off! Shockingly, the insurance company saw that I was a young driver and didn't bother to ask for his version of events. It was all sorted in the end. It's very common though apparently, especially if the innocent party is in a sports car (or towing one!) or is especially young. It's very easy to lie and get away with it unless there are witnesses.
Could you have avoided getting along side at all?
If you were pulling a trailer then you were probably going failry slowly, if she was going even more slowly than you then it might have indicated that she was unsure of the road.
Easy to say this in hindsight however.
Where possible I will try not to get along side other cars on slip roads, but sometimes its unavoidable.
At least no damage was done to your car, lets hope she tells the truth on the insurance claim.
If you were pulling a trailer then you were probably going failry slowly, if she was going even more slowly than you then it might have indicated that she was unsure of the road.
Easy to say this in hindsight however.
Where possible I will try not to get along side other cars on slip roads, but sometimes its unavoidable.
At least no damage was done to your car, lets hope she tells the truth on the insurance claim.
Bert,
Your attitude does you credit.
The lady to your left presumably saw your car (late), swerved away, and then tried to pull into the space immediately after your car. The space unfortunately occupied by your trailor.
From your description, it appears that you couldn't move right or stop. I can't readily think of what you could have done differently. Accelerating out of trouble is sometimes an option, but not in this instance given your proximity to the junction.
Your attitude does you credit.
The lady to your left presumably saw your car (late), swerved away, and then tried to pull into the space immediately after your car. The space unfortunately occupied by your trailor.
From your description, it appears that you couldn't move right or stop. I can't readily think of what you could have done differently. Accelerating out of trouble is sometimes an option, but not in this instance given your proximity to the junction.
BertBert said:
I tried to use my horn, but pressed the bit of the steering wheel which is helpfully not the horn!
I know its not the tone of the post but that line made me 
for a lttle while. Mainly because I have done it myself.On the accident IMO unless you could have seen it happening and moved into another lane then it was unavoidable on your part. Good news really as when I began reading I was scared your track car was going to get hurt.
I think this is simply an incident. No point beating yourself up over a minor collision, sounds like she came off worst.
Only things that I can think of for you to review for future reference:
Was your speed appropriate considering you were moving between two stationary queues of traffic and had a trailer attached?
Would more in depth observation/anticipation have allowed you to prevent the accident?
If you did all you could then so be it, collisions are an inevitable consequence of 30 million people of varying abilities piloting metal boxes within inches of each other.
Only things that I can think of for you to review for future reference:
Was your speed appropriate considering you were moving between two stationary queues of traffic and had a trailer attached?
Would more in depth observation/anticipation have allowed you to prevent the accident?
If you did all you could then so be it, collisions are an inevitable consequence of 30 million people of varying abilities piloting metal boxes within inches of each other.
WeirdNeville said:
....collisions are an inevitable consequence of 30 million people of varying abilities piloting metal boxes within inches of each other.
Exactly; and while it's always upsetting when unwanted contact is made - even if nobody gets hurt - we're actually doing pretty well, I would say.Best wishes all,
David.
Thanks all for the thoughts. I'm not beating myself up about it, just wanted to muse over anything that could be done differently.
As dreamer75 says, people always get in the wrong lane there and I know that, so I could have been thinking about that.
It is possible that my speed was a little too high for the circs (obvious slow car in the lh lane and a queue of 8 or so stopped cars in the rh lane).
So I think I was not assessing the possible hazards properly and modifying my course and speed appropriately.
No big deal, but I feel better having concluded I *could* have been a bit sharper!
Bert
As dreamer75 says, people always get in the wrong lane there and I know that, so I could have been thinking about that.
It is possible that my speed was a little too high for the circs (obvious slow car in the lh lane and a queue of 8 or so stopped cars in the rh lane).
So I think I was not assessing the possible hazards properly and modifying my course and speed appropriately.
No big deal, but I feel better having concluded I *could* have been a bit sharper!
Bert
I have just survived a similar thing. An 'older' lady slowed in front of me to let out a car emerging from the left without a care in the world for what was behind. I checked my mirror and a 'gentleman' on his mobile phone in a Civic had not registered that we had stopped. He actually tried to go around the inside of me AND the car in front of me but I woke him up by having my hand on the horn as he approached the rear of my car. The old woman in front of me thought it was intended for her but soon saw what was going on.
Very close!
Very close!
Thanks for the comments. Having not been in any kind of prang for quite a few years (it was certainly way before I was interested in "advanced driving"). I thought I would try the "would could I have done differently" thought process. Actually it was quite a good exercise and made me re-think some of the ways I do stuff!
BErt
BErt
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