Advanced Driving - recommended text books?

[andyj2]

Hi guys,

Been thinking about starting an Advanced Driving course etc recent;y, and thought it might be an idea to get myself a good text book on the subject.

Can anyone recommend me one or two ?

Christmas is coming, so a good time to suggest to the in-laws what to get me as a present!

Thanks,
Andy

[Don]

Roadcraft - The Police Driver's Handbook. Its the Bible.

For fun get "The Track Day Driver's Guide" by Art Markus. Its not about road stuff but it is still a good read and convers car dynamics at the limit in a way that wouldn't be appropriate in Roadcraft.

The "Bending The Rules" DVD is good fun - seeing Andy Walsh left-foot-brake-then-heel-and-toe-then-left-footbrake is a giggle - since its a skill not many drivers will ever achieve...

Enjoy..

[andyj2]

Funny you should mention the Police Drivers Handbook... I was flicking through it on Saturday in Smiths while I was waiting for the girlfriend to buy some stuff.

Will add it to the Christmas Present list !!

Thanks,
Andy

[Vaux]

andyj2 said:

Funny you should mention the Police Drivers Handbook...
Will add it to the Christmas Present list !!

There's a revised edition due out in I think December.

[andyj2]

ah thanks for the heads-up.... will hang on til just before Christmas then!

[andyj2]

Waterstones are doing the new revision for £10.50!!

http://www.waterstones.com/waterstonesweb/displayP...

[Slacey]

Which is cheaper than Amazon even! My Senior Observer gave me a copy but it's rather old - 1994 in fact, so I've ordered one from Waterstones as above

[OSGrooves]

Anyone know what has changed?

[A - W]

Paul Ripley has published a few books. Might be worth a search.

[Vaux]

A - W said:

Paul Ripley has published a few books. Might be worth a search.

Paul Ripley's: Expert Driving
A. Tom Topper: Very Advanced Driving

The new IAM advanced driving book is worth a look.

[BOF]

Best two I have read...apart from Roadcraft...

Paul Ripley - Expert Driving - ISBN-0-7160-3009-8

But, by far...

Mind Driving - Stephen Haley - ISBN-1-873371-16-0

Both of my DVDs are out with my Associates at present - Google Bespoke Driver Training and get a DVD by young Kendrick...suggest you forget the High Performance and go for the Advanced Roadcraft.

BOF.

PS - Link http://www.bespokedrivertraining.co.uk/DVD_index.h...

Edited by BOF on Tuesday 20th November 18:16

[andyj2]

thanks guys, all your suggestions are much appreciated!!

going to see if I can get my parents to pay for the IAM course as my Christmas present

[WhoseGeneration]

andyj2 said:

thanks guys, all your suggestions are much appreciated!!

going to see if I can get my parents to pay for the IAM course as my Christmas present

Yes, to modify a well known message.
"A Child is for life not just...".
IAM approach, whatever your opinion of the official "limits", can keep you safe, if you drive intelligently.

[theskippy7]

These pages are interesting,depends how deep you want to go into it.
http://phors.locost7.info/contents.htm

[SVS]

Hi there,

No. 1 would have to be Roadcraft. There's also a Roadcraft DVD to accompany the book, available on Amazon.co.uk, if you're keen.

Does anyone know what, if anything, has changed in the new edition of Roadcraft?

Paul Ripley's Expert Driving isn't bad, but it's not as good as Roadcraft.

Tom Topper's Very Advanced Driving ... isn't very advanced at all! I like his writing style, and there's some good stuff in there, but Tom Topper gets some things glaringly wrong. For example, he advocates 50-pence piecing corners, which is plain dangerous

Has anyone seen the new IAM driving book yet? What's it like? I just hope they update the bike version soon, as the present How to be an Advanced Motorcyclist has an apalling moralising tone and advocates wax jackets !

[TripleS]

SVS said:

Hi there,

No. 1 would have to be Roadcraft. There's also a Roadcraft DVD to accompany the book, available on Amazon.co.uk, if you're keen.

Does anyone know what, if anything, has changed in the new edition of Roadcraft?

Paul Ripley's Expert Driving isn't bad, but it's not as good as Roadcraft.

Tom Topper's Very Advanced Driving ... isn't very advanced at all! I like his writing style, and there's some good stuff in there, but Tom Topper gets some things glaringly wrong. For example, he advocates 50-pence piecing corners, which is plain dangerous

I have that book so I'll have another read, but I wonder if he's referring to the 'sawing at the wheel' technique that some people may do when they're feeling their way and trying to establish the degree of grip available? I think this may relate to something Peter (GreenV8S) mentioned a few weeks ago, about smoothness not always being the best way to treat bends and corners if you're checking to see where you are in relation to the limit of grip.

Best wishes all,
Dave.

[RT106]

SVS said:

No. 1 would have to be Roadcraft.

Tom Topper's Very Advanced Driving ... isn't very advanced at all! I like his writing style, and there's some good stuff in there, but Tom Topper gets some things glaringly wrong. For example, he advocates 50-pence piecing corners, which is plain dangerous

I'm not a member of any of the 'Advanced' groups, and have no intention of joining any... but I like to think I'm reasonable behind the wheel and read what I can on the subject. I've never been impressed by Roadcraft; it's either common sense - by which I mean things that if you don't know or couldn't work out for youself, you shouldn't be driving anyway - or just complete and utter nonsense.

I haven't read Tom Topper from cover to cover, but what I have read is insightful and useful. What's wrong with "50-pence-piecing corners"? Plain dangerous? B*llocks.

[waremark]

RT106 said:

I've never been impressed by Roadcraft; it's either common sense - by which I mean things that if you don't know or couldn't work out for youself, you shouldn't be driving anyway - or just complete and utter nonsense.

Help us out here - it would be interesting to have some examples of things in Roadcraft which are complete and utter nonsense.

[SVS]

Hi there,

The problem with Tom Topper's recommendation relates to his advice about how to tackle fast corners. He advocates precisely the opposite of what I've been taught at race school, Lotus driver training, ice driving, track days, etc. Topper's technique unbalances the vehicle by repeatedly and unnecessarily shifting weight distribution mid-corner, which is dangerous at speed.

That's not to say that I disagree with Tom Topper about everything. There is sound advice in his book too, especially his focus on giving yourself safe space.

As for advanced driving groups, there are good and bad. Personally, I believe it's important to keep learning. There's only so much you can do yourself, although good attitude and open mind to reading etc count for a lot. However, like most pursuits, there is no substitute for a top quality instruction.

The IAM and RoSPA generally do a decent job, but don't begin to compare with expert tuition from someone like www.cadence.co.uk or www.ridedrive.co.uk . Until you've experienced expert tuition from someone like Cadence, you won't understand what you're missing

Some things in Roadcraft are good common sense. However, common sense is uncommon on our roads! Many things aren't obvious, such as Limit Point Analysis and the 3-stage overtaking technique.

Edited by SVS on Monday 3rd December 21:00

[RT106]

SVS said:

Many things aren't obvious, such as Limit Point Analysis and the 3-stage overtaking technique.

Limit Point Analysis?! I've been using Limit Point Analysis since I was three and had my first pedal-powered tricycle. I just hadn't realised that someone had made up a pointlessly over-complicated name for it until I read about it in Roadcraft. And then read about it a further four times trying to work out what it was on about; surely I was missing something. So I asked a mate of mine who'd recently passed his IAM test to explain it to me and was dumbstuck by the answer. There's nothing in the slightest bit advanced about it; it's just that people who don't use it are brain-dead.

"3-stage overtaking technique"?! You've got to be kidding me.

As I'm sitting here I'm utilising a highly advanced technique called Continual Repetitive Respiration. Some people might call it Breathing In And Out, others might find they don't actually need to know what it's called because they do it anyway.