Steering

[Eliminator]

Opinions?...

IAM taught me to feed the wheel. In cars with "normal" steering ratio, I do.

In my Imprezza STI the steering is very much faster, to the extent that a R turn can be made with hands at 10:2 and your forarms just touch. Now, I don't do that (except once to see if I could) but I don't feed the wheel in normal driving.

Agree with this or disagree?

[shortshiftin]

When Im on the road i steer like the IAM taught me to. When im on track i steer like Steve Walsh taught me to... at normal raod speeds there is no reason or corner that requires you to steer so quickly that you cant feed the wheel.. IMHO.

You do what ever works for you to be able to steer effectivly and safely for the hazard.
If you've applied enough lock to have your forarms touching what would you do if you need to apply some more??

[leosayer]

shortshiftin said:

If you've applied enough lock to have your forarms touching what would you do if you need to apply some more??

Bring your lower arm above your upper arm and carry on turning the wheel. This is what Andrew Walsh taught me - it enables you to easily get the wheel pointing straight ahead again, especially if your correcting a slide. Although this is only really useful for the track.

[GreenV8S]

I would say you should plan ahead and position your hands so you have enough lock (and suitable margin) to pass the apex. This might mean adjusting your grip at the start and end of the manoeuver. If something unexpected happens and you need more lock then you revert to 'turn the wheel by any means possible' which in practice for me means the right hand stays on the wheel and the left hand is repositioned over it. In my case my right hand very rarely leaves the steering wheel while my left hand is often requisitioned to change gear, adjust the radio, move the mirror etc so it is always the left hand that gets taken off and repositioned.

One of my most alarming in-car experiences recently was a trip across Milton Keynes in a taxi which had a driver's door about to fall off. I assume that was the problem, because the driver spent the whole trip with his arm outside apparently holding it on. This is the first time I've ever seen somebody shuffle-steering with the left hand, while simultaneously changing gears, using the radio etc. We had a few near misses along the way, largely due to his habbit of leaving his braking until the last possible moment and then slamming on hard enough to squeal the tyres. Classic example of how *not* to do it.

[DocJock]

GreenV8S said:

I would say you should plan ahead ............... ............. We had a few near misses along the way, largely due to his habbit of leaving his braking until the last possible moment and then slamming on hard enough to squeal the tyres. Classic example of how *not* to do it.

Surely you should have been looking beyond him and "planning ahead" ?

[tvrgit]

I think Pete was IN the aforementioned taxi?

[Don]

I reckon every driver should have

1) Push pull
2) Rotational
3) Fixed position

steering techniques at his/her disposal. I've tried the Andrew Walsh steering technique too - can't say I've done it anger correcting a slide on track, though.

I use push pull in normal driving in my Vectra. I might use rotational for manouvers where its handy to be able to put on a lot of lock very quickly and remove it again.

In my Porsche or the wife's TVR I tend to drive with fixed position steering most of the time - espcially on track - as the lock is "quick" geared enough to allow it. If I am in a situation where I would run out of lock with fixed position I push pull.

This is what I have worked out is right for me for my cars.

If you have found something that is working that you can guage against push-pull and feel you have at least equal control of the car (if not better) then I reckon go for it - do what you feel is right.

[Rawwr]

Rotational steering: Essential for ridiculously placed mini-roundabouts.

I'm not joking, either. There's a mini-roundabout in St. Neots that is just stupid. In the 340R with an 8-notch rack, and using rotational steering it was possible to get around it properly, just. I know what you're thinking but I swear on my mother's life that's at a sensible (read: very slow) speed.

So yeah, I always use rotational steering -- not quite as necessary now I have the Ka but it's kinda hard to break the habit.

[StressedDave]

Rawwr said:

Rotational steering: Essential for ridiculously placed mini-roundabouts. I'm not joking, either. There's a mini-roundabout in St. Neots that is just stupid. In the 340R with an 8-notch rack, and using rotational steering it was possible to get around it properly, just. I know what you're thinking but I swear on my mother's life that's at a sensible (read: very slow) speed. So yeah, I always use rotational steering -- not quite as necessary now I have the Ka but it's kinda hard to break the habit.

Which one - there's a whole host of candidates.

IMVHO (is there ever such a thing as a 'not humble opinion in anyway shape or form' ) rotational steering makes a lot of sense the better you are at judging entry speed and power. I see too many people who's steering has been compromised under normal driving conditions by having had to relearn pull-push after many comfortable years of doing it any old how.

Simple rule: if you get the steering angle you require at the point you require and the rate of application you require it doesn't matter how you do it.

[Joe911]

StressedDave said:

Simple rule: if you get the steering angle you require at the point you require and the rate of application you require it doesn't matter how you do it.

Don't you also need the proviso that you must be in a position to quickly apply more steering, or less, or even counter-steer, if something unexepected happens?

[Rawwr]

I think the other reason I use rotational steering is due to driving Elises/340Rs for the last 6 years. When a lightweight, MR car's rear-end decides to wave goodbye you've got to be pretty quick to get the opposite lock on. Driving an Elise through the winter with the threat of black ice is enough to encourage this. This was compounded with the 340R's cut slicks.

[Don]

StressedDave said:

Simple rule: if you get the steering angle you require at the point you require and the rate of application you require it doesn't matter how you do it.

This is absolutely right. But you'll have seen the utter mess some people make of it. Enthusiasts are usually in total control of their vehicle - however "unorthodox" their steering technique might be...but, as an Observer, I've done assessment drives with people who genuinely can't steer reliably! (I know, I know, it sounds bonkers BUT ITS TRUE!). For these people re-learning Push-Pull can be quite an improvement!

BTW: If that sounds elitist can I assure you that 1) its factually accurate, 2) these Associates wanted my help, got itm and some went on to pass their IAM test and be much better drivers than they were previously. We can't all be perfect without a little help.

[WildCat]

I use a mix of push pull. rotational und fixed input. I think the golden rule ist to do what's right for you in the circumstances - and to be aware of effectiveness und convenience of the method you used ...is about evaluating the drive ... thinking about it - learning and working on the improvvements all the time. Is what skill development ist about

[DanH]

leosayer said:

shortshiftin said: If you've applied enough lock to have your forarms touching what would you do if you need to apply some more?? Bring your lower arm above your upper arm and carry on turning the wheel. This is what Andrew Walsh taught me - it enables you to easily get the wheel pointing straight ahead again, especially if your correcting a slide. Although this is only really useful for the track.

What he said.

The main think about rotational steering is that your hands are always at the same point on the wheel, so that you know at a subconscious level exactly how much lock you have applied. If you do the shuffle, then its not implicit from your hand positions, and is thus one hell of a lot harder.