predicting actions of others
Discussion
I haven't done an advanced training course but would still like to consider myself an observational person.
I was thinking today while driving home, what do other people look out for on the roads as a sign a driver/rider/cyclist is about to do something?
We all probably take note of different vehicles speeds and as such who's looking to pull out/over take before they've put indicators on etc
I was once told, when a cyclist stops peddling, it more than likely means they're about to do something, pull out, move over, look over their shoulder etc.
Does anyone else have little observations they've been told or picked up during their driving which they use?
I was thinking today while driving home, what do other people look out for on the roads as a sign a driver/rider/cyclist is about to do something?
We all probably take note of different vehicles speeds and as such who's looking to pull out/over take before they've put indicators on etc
I was once told, when a cyclist stops peddling, it more than likely means they're about to do something, pull out, move over, look over their shoulder etc.
Does anyone else have little observations they've been told or picked up during their driving which they use?
You might like this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_9v6tk1HivI
You definitely get a sixth sense for this kind of thing. Especially people who can't maintain their lane round a roundabout. I try and drive to expect people to cut the lanes a bit, but some I just know some will definitely fail and I haven't worked out how. Maybe they are a bit far to the right of their lane on entry? Maybe it's confirmation bias and I've forgotten the ones that didn't.
I was on a roundabout the other day and noticed another car slightly off line then a second later realised it was my dad who was coming up for a visit.
I was on a roundabout the other day and noticed another car slightly off line then a second later realised it was my dad who was coming up for a visit.
When I’m I slowing/stopping to a queue and I look in rear view and see the driver following looking down, I assume they’re using a phone (could be reading a paper or some other distraction).
As a result I’ll usually brake somewhat differently ... harder at first than I usually would, but not to a complete stop, then coast to a stop. I’ll also leave a bigger gap between the car above to give me some wiggle room if I think they’re not going to stop in time.
As a result I’ll usually brake somewhat differently ... harder at first than I usually would, but not to a complete stop, then coast to a stop. I’ll also leave a bigger gap between the car above to give me some wiggle room if I think they’re not going to stop in time.
Caddyshack said:
Followed a Suzuki Jimmy today with a sticker on the drivers side rear saying "you shall not pass", I would give that a wide berth and a huge power reserve if planning to overtake.
Surely that's a Gandalf joke? Not sure what it says about his driving though!https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mJZZNHekEQw
markyb_lcy said:
When I’m I slowing/stopping to a queue and I look in rear view and see the driver following looking down, I assume they’re using a phone (could be reading a paper or some other distraction).
As a result I’ll usually brake somewhat differently ... harder at first than I usually would, but not to a complete stop, then coast to a stop. I’ll also leave a bigger gap between the car above to give me some wiggle room if I think they’re not going to stop in time.
Agree with that. Braking is giving a signal to those behind. That states the obvious, but you can vary how that signal is given - early perhaps, More than once with early showing of the lights with little retardation, then off, then on again.As a result I’ll usually brake somewhat differently ... harder at first than I usually would, but not to a complete stop, then coast to a stop. I’ll also leave a bigger gap between the car above to give me some wiggle room if I think they’re not going to stop in time.
When preparing to enter a roundabout, take note of front wheel angles in preference to, or as well as signals. Cyclists will move out for debris, manhole covers, often at the last minute. Watch out for a group of teenagers on the path, some have this habit of pretending to push their mate into the road - one day it will happen. Motorcyclists overtaking on a motorway/dual carriageway - have an idea which way the bike will go and which way the rider will go in the event of a spill. Pulling out of a junction - have your window down, passenger side too if needed - clear eye contact counts for a lot.
When pulling out of a junction do not look for cars, you will always see them, look in the near and middle distance for a motor/cyclist. Look up ‘saccades’, and see how they can affect what visual details are taken in.
ALWAYS know what is around you, it is no good looking in the side mirrors when actually in an emergency, you need to know where your escape route is before.
I have lost count of the number of times people have strode along the road, on their phones, then without breaking step, nor looking up from their phone, they have crossed the road.
On Minor A and B roads, in light traffic, a three second gap gives you that extra time to avoid using the brakes; if you are not going to overtake, you are only ever going to take an extra second in total to reach the next junction.
Treat everyone driving as stupid and never assume they drive to the same standard as yourself. Roundabouts especially mini ones look left and right rather than assume all give way to the right. Big roundabouts if you have a car in front waiting for a safe pull away never assume they will otherwise if you are thinking go, you may drive into their rear. Give haphazard drivers plenty of space, no point getting your vehicle damaged just to prove a point. Be aware of cycle lanes ending and filtering on to the road. Time of day can have a massive difference in types of driver, if possible plan long journeys after the evening rush hour or really early before the morning rush hour. The list is truly endless. Main thing is try to keep space around you in case of swerving, sharp braking and let the speeding idiots cut someone else up and don’t be the next statistic, especially in poor visibility. Slow down even if the guy behind in the flash 4x4 thinks they are invincible.
mac96 said:
Caddyshack said:
Followed a Suzuki Jimmy today with a sticker on the drivers side rear saying "you shall not pass", I would give that a wide berth and a huge power reserve if planning to overtake.
Surely that's a Gandalf joke? Not sure what it says about his driving though!https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mJZZNHekEQw
Caddyshack said:
mac96 said:
Caddyshack said:
Followed a Suzuki Jimmy today with a sticker on the drivers side rear saying "you shall not pass", I would give that a wide berth and a huge power reserve if planning to overtake.
Surely that's a Gandalf joke? Not sure what it says about his driving though!https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mJZZNHekEQw
Caddyshack said:
My dad always said to be wary of anyone wearing a hat or driving gloves whilst driving a car...he meant the trilby type hat...I have to say that I have seen enough evidence to think this is a good thing to look out for.
Your Dad was quite right - beware any driver in a hat. Trilby, baseball cap, police cap, crash helmet...
Johnnytheboy said:
Caddyshack said:
mac96 said:
Caddyshack said:
Followed a Suzuki Jimmy today with a sticker on the drivers side rear saying "you shall not pass", I would give that a wide berth and a huge power reserve if planning to overtake.
Surely that's a Gandalf joke? Not sure what it says about his driving though!https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mJZZNHekEQw
Especially when on my motorbike, but also when in the car, I find that the speed someone is driving, how this speed varies in different circumstances, and the kind of line(s) they take at junctions and bends tell you a huge amount about the kind of driver and their level of competence and awareness.
This is by no means exhaustive and is a bit of a stream of consciousness, but here are some types I see every day which you can try a game of 'I Spy' with:
– Under the speed limit, sometimes significantly so, steady speed and direction: old, nervous or both but probably paying attention, although I still give them a wide berth. Sometimes if very slow they may be looking for something like a particular house or turning (depending on location).
– Just under the limit, inconsistent line on the road, inconsistent speed: probably on the phone or otherwise distracted but trying to give the impression of driving normally; wide berth.
– On or just over the limit, consistent and thoughtful lines, speed varying slightly and precisely in response to hazards: good stuff, probably paying attention and driving competently (I find I can spot these ones almost immediately!).
– On or just over the limit, speed maintained regardless of hazards, braking unnecessarily, crap lines through junctions: confident but largely incompetent. Keep well clear.
– Far too fast all the time without the finesse to match: these are usually obvious and just people who are either late or think they like driving fast but lack the skills to do so safely.
– Always slightly too fast when hazards are dense, yet failing to get a move on in absence of hazards and on a clear road, failure to maintain speed up hills or control speed down hills: many, many cases of this. Probably moderate attention level but generally a lack of awareness of laws of physics and doesn't really care about driving well or thoughtfully.
– A bit too fast but clearly responding to hazards, indicating, and being courteous and pre-emptive: I like these guys and am probably one of them.
When I'm on my bike and so passing most traffic unlike when I'm in the car, the car drivers who get full marks for hazard awareness, indications of intentions, courtesy, anticipation and positioning, probably make up about 2% of total car traffic. When in the car and so part of the traffic flow the proportion of these guys I see is probably under 0.5%.
Other more immediate signals of 'something about to happen':
– Repeated braking
– Indicator coming on then going off
– Slowing down in the absence of obvious hazards
– Head turning to look in wing or rear-view mirror
– Hazard lights come on: used by some goods vehicle drivers and taxis to mean 'I'm about to pull a manoeuvre but you'll have to guess what it is until I do it'
– Cyclists and motorcyclists: head turning to check blind-spot: probably about to turn somewhere (but this should be obvious).
This is by no means exhaustive and is a bit of a stream of consciousness, but here are some types I see every day which you can try a game of 'I Spy' with:
– Under the speed limit, sometimes significantly so, steady speed and direction: old, nervous or both but probably paying attention, although I still give them a wide berth. Sometimes if very slow they may be looking for something like a particular house or turning (depending on location).
– Just under the limit, inconsistent line on the road, inconsistent speed: probably on the phone or otherwise distracted but trying to give the impression of driving normally; wide berth.
– On or just over the limit, consistent and thoughtful lines, speed varying slightly and precisely in response to hazards: good stuff, probably paying attention and driving competently (I find I can spot these ones almost immediately!).
– On or just over the limit, speed maintained regardless of hazards, braking unnecessarily, crap lines through junctions: confident but largely incompetent. Keep well clear.
– Far too fast all the time without the finesse to match: these are usually obvious and just people who are either late or think they like driving fast but lack the skills to do so safely.
– Always slightly too fast when hazards are dense, yet failing to get a move on in absence of hazards and on a clear road, failure to maintain speed up hills or control speed down hills: many, many cases of this. Probably moderate attention level but generally a lack of awareness of laws of physics and doesn't really care about driving well or thoughtfully.
– A bit too fast but clearly responding to hazards, indicating, and being courteous and pre-emptive: I like these guys and am probably one of them.
When I'm on my bike and so passing most traffic unlike when I'm in the car, the car drivers who get full marks for hazard awareness, indications of intentions, courtesy, anticipation and positioning, probably make up about 2% of total car traffic. When in the car and so part of the traffic flow the proportion of these guys I see is probably under 0.5%.
Other more immediate signals of 'something about to happen':
– Repeated braking
– Indicator coming on then going off
– Slowing down in the absence of obvious hazards
– Head turning to look in wing or rear-view mirror
– Hazard lights come on: used by some goods vehicle drivers and taxis to mean 'I'm about to pull a manoeuvre but you'll have to guess what it is until I do it'
– Cyclists and motorcyclists: head turning to check blind-spot: probably about to turn somewhere (but this should be obvious).
Edited by jchesh on Friday 14th February 11:08
Yes, agree with all of that! Essentially trying to evaluate someones situational awareness. I'd like to add to your list, the drivers who'll do 40 in a 60 but will continue at 40 in a 30. To me showing a lack of ability to take in changing environments, to them 40 feels safe so regardless of the situation they'll do it!
jchesh said:
Especially when on my motorbike, but also when in the car, I find that the speed someone is driving, how this speed varies in different circumstances, and the kind of line(s) they take at junctions and bends tell you a huge amount about the kind of driver and their level of competence and awareness.
This is by no means exhaustive and is a bit of a stream of consciousness, but here are some types I see every day which you can try a game of 'I Spy' with:
– Under the speed limit, sometimes significantly so, steady speed and direction: old, nervous or both but probably paying attention, although I still give them a wide berth. Sometimes if very slow they may be looking for something like a particular house or turning (depending on location).
– Just under the limit, inconsistent line on the road, inconsistent speed: probably on the phone or otherwise distracted but trying to give the impression of driving normally; wide berth.
– On or just over the limit, consistent and thoughtful lines, speed varying slightly and precisely in response to hazards: good stuff, probably paying attention and driving competently (I find I can spot these ones almost immediately!).
– On or just over the limit, speed maintained regardless of hazards, braking unnecessarily, crap lines through junctions: confident but largely incompetent. Keep well clear.
– Far too fast all the time without the finesse to match: these are usually obvious and just people who are either late or think they like driving fast but lack the skills to do so safely.
– Always slightly too fast when hazards are dense, yet failing to get a move on in absence of hazards and on a clear road, failure to maintain speed up hills or control speed down hills: many, many cases of this. Probably moderate attention level but generally a lack of awareness of laws of physics and doesn't really care about driving well or thoughtfully.
– A bit too fast but clearly responding to hazards, indicating, and being courteous and pre-emptive: I like these guys and am probably one of them.
When I'm on my bike and so passing most traffic unlike when I'm in the car, the car drivers who get full marks for hazard awareness, indications of intentions, courtesy, anticipation and positioning, probably make up about 2% of total car traffic. When in the car and so part of the traffic flow the proportion of these guys I see is probably under 0.5%.
Other more immediate signals of 'something about to happen':
– Repeated braking
– Indicator coming on then going off
– Slowing down in the absence of obvious hazards
– Head turning to look in wing or rear-view mirror
– Hazard lights come on: used by some goods vehicle drivers and taxis to mean 'I'm about to pull a manoeuvre but you'll have to guess what it is until I do it'
– Cyclists and motorcyclists: head turning to check blind-spot: probably about to turn somewhere (but this should be obvious).
This is by no means exhaustive and is a bit of a stream of consciousness, but here are some types I see every day which you can try a game of 'I Spy' with:
– Under the speed limit, sometimes significantly so, steady speed and direction: old, nervous or both but probably paying attention, although I still give them a wide berth. Sometimes if very slow they may be looking for something like a particular house or turning (depending on location).
– Just under the limit, inconsistent line on the road, inconsistent speed: probably on the phone or otherwise distracted but trying to give the impression of driving normally; wide berth.
– On or just over the limit, consistent and thoughtful lines, speed varying slightly and precisely in response to hazards: good stuff, probably paying attention and driving competently (I find I can spot these ones almost immediately!).
– On or just over the limit, speed maintained regardless of hazards, braking unnecessarily, crap lines through junctions: confident but largely incompetent. Keep well clear.
– Far too fast all the time without the finesse to match: these are usually obvious and just people who are either late or think they like driving fast but lack the skills to do so safely.
– Always slightly too fast when hazards are dense, yet failing to get a move on in absence of hazards and on a clear road, failure to maintain speed up hills or control speed down hills: many, many cases of this. Probably moderate attention level but generally a lack of awareness of laws of physics and doesn't really care about driving well or thoughtfully.
– A bit too fast but clearly responding to hazards, indicating, and being courteous and pre-emptive: I like these guys and am probably one of them.
When I'm on my bike and so passing most traffic unlike when I'm in the car, the car drivers who get full marks for hazard awareness, indications of intentions, courtesy, anticipation and positioning, probably make up about 2% of total car traffic. When in the car and so part of the traffic flow the proportion of these guys I see is probably under 0.5%.
Other more immediate signals of 'something about to happen':
– Repeated braking
– Indicator coming on then going off
– Slowing down in the absence of obvious hazards
– Head turning to look in wing or rear-view mirror
– Hazard lights come on: used by some goods vehicle drivers and taxis to mean 'I'm about to pull a manoeuvre but you'll have to guess what it is until I do it'
– Cyclists and motorcyclists: head turning to check blind-spot: probably about to turn somewhere (but this should be obvious).
Edited by jchesh on Friday 14th February 11:08
jchesh said:
– Indicator coming on then going off
This means the rider's on a Ducati whose indicators were assembled on a Friday afternoon 
Pica-Pica said:
Motorcyclists overtaking on a motorway/dual carriageway - have an idea which way the bike will go and which way the rider will go in the event of a spill.
Seriously? 
Salted_Peanut said:
jchesh said:
– Indicator coming on then going off
This means the rider's on a Ducati whose indicators were assembled on a Friday afternoon Salted_Peanut said:
Pica-Pica said:
Motorcyclists overtaking on a motorway/dual carriageway - have an idea which way the bike will go and which way the rider will go in the event of a spill.
Seriously? Car full of luggage - driver probably unfamiliar with the area and likely to be erratic at junctions.
Red Kites circling overhead - roadkill deer round the next blind bend. (Possibly south Bucks specific).
Left hand drive truck - driver can't see what's overtaking them.
Canal near the road - if the next bend is towards it, expect a narrow hump backed bridge just out of sight.
Family with young children walking along a country lane - car parked just round the next bend.
Bloke in high viz cutting the hedge - van or truck parked just round the next bend.
Red Kites circling overhead - roadkill deer round the next blind bend. (Possibly south Bucks specific).
Left hand drive truck - driver can't see what's overtaking them.
Canal near the road - if the next bend is towards it, expect a narrow hump backed bridge just out of sight.
Family with young children walking along a country lane - car parked just round the next bend.
Bloke in high viz cutting the hedge - van or truck parked just round the next bend.
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