Becoming an ADI...
Discussion
Probably still the RosPA Diploma in Advanced Driving.
https://www.rospa.com/safety-training/on-road/trai...
I passed the Diploma some years ago, it takes a lot of miles, weekends, petrol and qualifying up to Gold standard before taking the Diploma Instructor exam/test at Edgebaston. It also needs to re-test at Gold level to maintain it. The Diploma test requires (did) a Gold standard instructor session in the morning , then a written test. It's no walkover. There are a lot of ex PoPo instructors, and it was usually a fun environment.
Whether you could make a living as an Advanced Instructor is another matter, given the amount of free, or nearly free training from the IAM (and RosPa) but fleet training, plus defensive/evasive security driver training might work. A lot of the Advanced insructors were also DSA ADI's for the main income stream.
On the upside, many of the RosPA groups have some first class people to drive with, and the better ones will organise weekends away, occasionally to France/Belgium.
As to cars or bikes Diploma Instructor, I think the chances of an income stream would be better from cars, as that opens up fleet training, whereas the biker fraternity is a more limited market.
It is also warmer in a car during the winter, as you may have observed.
Uusally the starting point is to track down your local RosPA car group and pop along for a chat.
My info may also be way out of date as RosPA was continuously evolving during my time there.
Best of luck.
https://www.rospa.com/safety-training/on-road/adva...
https://www.rospa.com/safety-training/on-road/trai...
I passed the Diploma some years ago, it takes a lot of miles, weekends, petrol and qualifying up to Gold standard before taking the Diploma Instructor exam/test at Edgebaston. It also needs to re-test at Gold level to maintain it. The Diploma test requires (did) a Gold standard instructor session in the morning , then a written test. It's no walkover. There are a lot of ex PoPo instructors, and it was usually a fun environment.
Whether you could make a living as an Advanced Instructor is another matter, given the amount of free, or nearly free training from the IAM (and RosPa) but fleet training, plus defensive/evasive security driver training might work. A lot of the Advanced insructors were also DSA ADI's for the main income stream.
On the upside, many of the RosPA groups have some first class people to drive with, and the better ones will organise weekends away, occasionally to France/Belgium.
As to cars or bikes Diploma Instructor, I think the chances of an income stream would be better from cars, as that opens up fleet training, whereas the biker fraternity is a more limited market.
It is also warmer in a car during the winter, as you may have observed.
Uusally the starting point is to track down your local RosPA car group and pop along for a chat.
My info may also be way out of date as RosPA was continuously evolving during my time there.
Best of luck.
https://www.rospa.com/safety-training/on-road/adva...
Edited by Slushbox on Wednesday 7th November 16:15
I was under the impression that Hendon (and other forces') instructors were ADIs, so taking up a position there will get you over the first hurdle. But being an ADI has little to do with your abilities as a driver (except if you demonstrate) and far more on your communication skills and ability to identify your student's needs.
anonymous said:
[redacted]
There is very little structure to Advanced Driving Instruction in the UK (or elsewhere in the world!)basically it comes down to RoSPA / IAM (with associated politics etc.) - the High Performance Course (http://www.high-performance-course.com/) and a few small organisations / individuals (best known on here is probably RegLocal)
There is scope for more people to receive this training, but you might want to think through - is there a desire from those people? The biggest issue in the world of AD is simply that the vast majority of drivers think that they are already good enough - and if there is any debate re buying a high performance car it is either about the tyres, or how to get lift-off oversteer around the local Tesco's roundabout
When there is discussion re driving courses for high performance cars, it tends to be around car skills / car control - a la MB World / Porsche Silverstone type of courses - rather than Advanced Driving, which is road skills and a bigger picture than just how you handle the car, but about how you handle the car in the context in which you drive...In reality, every member of Pistonheads could benefit from more training... the better drivers on here are probably already doing that, but are ironically probably the most aware that driving is a life-long skill that no-one fully masters - 95% of PH thinks that they are a driving god who needs no further skills - 4% acknowledge that they are not, but see no need, as it is only about getting from A to B - 1% (probably less) get it, but are already within the above organisations improving their driving...
if you haven't been on it - AD Hub (www.advanceddrivinghub.com) is the main AD forum - caveat - I run it...
Reg Local and the two High Performance Course Managers are all former police advanced driving instructors who do what you would apparently like to do. I don't believe any of those three get enough business to make it a full time job, and the rates they charge are little if any higher than ADI's teaching learners. And they are established top experts. But they love what they do.
Many ex police get involved with IAM or Rospa, most on a voluntary basis but a small handful are employed.
Why not invest in a day with HPC Course Manager Andy Morrison and chat to him about it while also focusing on the differences between police and civilian very advanced driving?
Many ex police get involved with IAM or Rospa, most on a voluntary basis but a small handful are employed.
Why not invest in a day with HPC Course Manager Andy Morrison and chat to him about it while also focusing on the differences between police and civilian very advanced driving?
You would think that high performance car manufacturers and dealerships would promote the sort of training you would like to give. Back in time that was the case. John Lyon longtime HPC Chief Instructor wrote The Porsche Driving Book in 1988 and in the nineties Bernard Aubrey was a Porsche Driving Consultant.
Nowadays I am not aware of any manufacturer involvement in road driving; they have moved to activities on tracks and other specialist facilities. I guess this is because of both the demonisation of quick road driving and the ludicrously increased performance of high performance cars. (Todays warm hatch is quicker than an E type and a plethora of high end sports cars are as quick to 100 as a McLaren F1. How can you exploit the performance of these cars on the road without risking going to jail).
Nowadays I am not aware of any manufacturer involvement in road driving; they have moved to activities on tracks and other specialist facilities. I guess this is because of both the demonisation of quick road driving and the ludicrously increased performance of high performance cars. (Todays warm hatch is quicker than an E type and a plethora of high end sports cars are as quick to 100 as a McLaren F1. How can you exploit the performance of these cars on the road without risking going to jail).
waremark said:
You would think that high performance car manufacturers and dealerships would promote the sort of training you would like to give. Back in time that was the case. John Lyon longtime HPC Chief Instructor wrote The Porsche Driving Book in 1988 and in the nineties Bernard Aubrey was a Porsche Driving Consultant.
Nowadays I am not aware of any manufacturer involvement in road driving; they have moved to activities on tracks and other specialist facilities. I guess this is because of both the demonisation of quick road driving and the ludicrously increased performance of high performance cars. (Todays warm hatch is quicker than an E type and a plethora of high end sports cars are as quick to 100 as a McLaren F1. How can you exploit the performance of these cars on the road without risking going to jail).
I think it is also the prevalence of belief that handling is all about track skills - and that is all you need to learn extra when buying a high performance car... it also validates the car's performance - I buy this car - it is so fast that Porsche give me a day on track...Nowadays I am not aware of any manufacturer involvement in road driving; they have moved to activities on tracks and other specialist facilities. I guess this is because of both the demonisation of quick road driving and the ludicrously increased performance of high performance cars. (Todays warm hatch is quicker than an E type and a plethora of high end sports cars are as quick to 100 as a McLaren F1. How can you exploit the performance of these cars on the road without risking going to jail).
until people realise that most of the errors on road are not directly handling - but misunderstanding how to drive the road at higher speed (which does of course lead to handling issues), then this will be the interest they have - the concept of AD which might include going slower to survive the corner is not exciting - whereas, learning to drift on track so that you can go faster is much more enticing
anonymous said:
[redacted]
A fundamental component of any business plan, for this is what this is, is to identify one’s potential customer base. Based upon the plan noted above you have failed to do so. The plan is wholly focused on you and what you intend to achieve with no thought or indication as to whom you are going to sell your “product”.Unfortunately, as Waremark has quite rightly pointed out, there is an infinitesimally small market for “paid for” advanced driving.
anonymous said:
[redacted]
I seem to recall that police instructors have an exemption, maybe because they aren’t being paid by individual members of the public.I suspect that many police school instructors do their ADI qualification with an eye to their retirement. I know of some ex-police instructor retirees who have gone the ADI learner-driver tuition route after retirement but have soon abandoned it as a career. One even said he gave it up... “because he can’t stand 17 year olds!!!” Not surprising if you’ve just spent 6 years at Hendon instructing traffic cops to drive at 130mph+. Teaching 17 year olds must seem like purgatory.
I think that the plan you have outlined would make eminent sense as a retirement project where you’re not financially dependent upon the limited amount of income available, but you would enjoy what you were doing and you’d be being paid for it.
Good luck with whatever you decide to do.
I am an ADI, also "Fleet registered" which means i did a further course and driving/written exams to qualify.
Getting work for a "Fleet Driving instructor" is not that easy. Some of the companies out there don't pay as well as you might imagine.
But, if you managed to get a contract with a company that requires "Further driving skills" as part of their "Health and safety" policy, or their "Eco" policy the money can be fairly good, however it might come in "batches" and then you have to try and fit that work in around your other base work which will be learners.
Some councils/ large companies with fleets might well welcome an ex Police traffic ADI/FLEET badge person to their staff, but I can earn more money working for myself than for Hants County council in a recent "open day" i attended where they were looking for ADI's to help them.
Being a class 1 Police driver you will have no problems at all with the part 2 ADI test, or ROSPA/IAM tests ( I did the IAM with no further training than the standards to pass and ADI part 2 test, and did 2 two hour sessions with an ROSPA trainer just because I was curious as to how they wanted me to drive, and I suspect it was to the level of a "standard Police course" but having to keep close to the speed limits. For me the ROSPA test was a little more fun. I prefer the ROSPA test as you have to retake it every 3 years. Again I for my second requalification for the Rospa test I did not bother with any training and requalified with a "Gold" pass)
As a "traffic" plod you should have no problems with either, as I have already stated.
For the ADI part one test you just need to pass a tougher theory test than the learners do, you should not have to pay to go on a course for that with your knowledge of traffic law and signs etc... Same for the part 2 driving test, you may however employ an ADI for a couple of hours to help you run through the reverse maneuvers so that you do them the "DSA" way as they are anal about the "safe" way in their eyes to do them. For the part 3 test it is a few years since I did mine, but I would suggest you find an "ordit" ADI trainer near where you live who delivers ADI part 3 training so that when you take a part 3 exam you deliver it the way they want it.....or you will not pass
All ADI's have a "standards" check done by the DSA every 2-4 years depending on your last grading (we are now all grades A or B) so if you get a good score for a grade "A" you can look forward to being left alone for near on 4 years. ALL ADI's hate and fear the standards check as a failure could end with the removal of your ADI badge.
You pay £300 every 4 years I think to keep your ADI registration, and I have just paid £120 for my renewal for my "Fleet" badge
I grossed about £35k last year, it does not look too shabby to some, but there are all the costs of either buying or leasing a car, running it, keeping money aside for the tax man/accountant...etc....
If you want to do "Fleet" "more advanced" stuff then you are going to have to get a decent car, which is going to cost you more = less profit. As not all people hiring you will have a "car" for you to use, so you will have to let them use yours. With fleet work they will expect something decent if they are paying bigger bucks, but if you do the work in their vehicles happy days as less wear and tear on your= more profit
On top of your Police pension you could easily get by as an ADI and not have to work weekends or evenings to get by.
Their are several rewarding things about about being an ADI.....
You are your own boss, you work when you want to, you earn as much as you are prepared to work
You are influencing people to drive in a way you hopefully they will stick to once they pass a test, or if in doing "Fleet" work re educating them to being a safer driver. (Most drivers when I do "Fleet" work, get into a car with thinking they are "good", but most would fail a basic driving test, so they by definition are not!.....hence a death rate of about 5 a day, and many hundreds injured every day in the UK)
It can be slow getting your business going, getting a decent website high up in the search engines is important. It takes a while to get recommendations. Being the cheapest ADI does not always get you more work. Getting good "Fleet" work is harder still, and will involve a lot of foot work to getting a foot in the door. I try to do three 2 hour lessons a day (1 hour lessons are not cost effective if you have to travel a fair distance/time to get to them) Even with only 6 hours actual work a day I am sometimes in the car for near on 7-8 hours. The levels of concentration required are high as if you blink they will try to hit something......there are not many jobs out there were your customers try to kill you 3 or 4 times a day!
good luck
Getting work for a "Fleet Driving instructor" is not that easy. Some of the companies out there don't pay as well as you might imagine.
But, if you managed to get a contract with a company that requires "Further driving skills" as part of their "Health and safety" policy, or their "Eco" policy the money can be fairly good, however it might come in "batches" and then you have to try and fit that work in around your other base work which will be learners.
Some councils/ large companies with fleets might well welcome an ex Police traffic ADI/FLEET badge person to their staff, but I can earn more money working for myself than for Hants County council in a recent "open day" i attended where they were looking for ADI's to help them.
Being a class 1 Police driver you will have no problems at all with the part 2 ADI test, or ROSPA/IAM tests ( I did the IAM with no further training than the standards to pass and ADI part 2 test, and did 2 two hour sessions with an ROSPA trainer just because I was curious as to how they wanted me to drive, and I suspect it was to the level of a "standard Police course" but having to keep close to the speed limits. For me the ROSPA test was a little more fun. I prefer the ROSPA test as you have to retake it every 3 years. Again I for my second requalification for the Rospa test I did not bother with any training and requalified with a "Gold" pass)
As a "traffic" plod you should have no problems with either, as I have already stated.
For the ADI part one test you just need to pass a tougher theory test than the learners do, you should not have to pay to go on a course for that with your knowledge of traffic law and signs etc... Same for the part 2 driving test, you may however employ an ADI for a couple of hours to help you run through the reverse maneuvers so that you do them the "DSA" way as they are anal about the "safe" way in their eyes to do them. For the part 3 test it is a few years since I did mine, but I would suggest you find an "ordit" ADI trainer near where you live who delivers ADI part 3 training so that when you take a part 3 exam you deliver it the way they want it.....or you will not pass
All ADI's have a "standards" check done by the DSA every 2-4 years depending on your last grading (we are now all grades A or B) so if you get a good score for a grade "A" you can look forward to being left alone for near on 4 years. ALL ADI's hate and fear the standards check as a failure could end with the removal of your ADI badge.
You pay £300 every 4 years I think to keep your ADI registration, and I have just paid £120 for my renewal for my "Fleet" badge
I grossed about £35k last year, it does not look too shabby to some, but there are all the costs of either buying or leasing a car, running it, keeping money aside for the tax man/accountant...etc....
If you want to do "Fleet" "more advanced" stuff then you are going to have to get a decent car, which is going to cost you more = less profit. As not all people hiring you will have a "car" for you to use, so you will have to let them use yours. With fleet work they will expect something decent if they are paying bigger bucks, but if you do the work in their vehicles happy days as less wear and tear on your= more profit
On top of your Police pension you could easily get by as an ADI and not have to work weekends or evenings to get by.
Their are several rewarding things about about being an ADI.....
You are your own boss, you work when you want to, you earn as much as you are prepared to work
You are influencing people to drive in a way you hopefully they will stick to once they pass a test, or if in doing "Fleet" work re educating them to being a safer driver. (Most drivers when I do "Fleet" work, get into a car with thinking they are "good", but most would fail a basic driving test, so they by definition are not!.....hence a death rate of about 5 a day, and many hundreds injured every day in the UK)
It can be slow getting your business going, getting a decent website high up in the search engines is important. It takes a while to get recommendations. Being the cheapest ADI does not always get you more work. Getting good "Fleet" work is harder still, and will involve a lot of foot work to getting a foot in the door. I try to do three 2 hour lessons a day (1 hour lessons are not cost effective if you have to travel a fair distance/time to get to them) Even with only 6 hours actual work a day I am sometimes in the car for near on 7-8 hours. The levels of concentration required are high as if you blink they will try to hit something......there are not many jobs out there were your customers try to kill you 3 or 4 times a day!
good luck
If do decide to go head with this the first step is to acquire the adi licence. There are lots of companies offering training for a set fee. Not to criticise what they provide for that fee but personally, if I had to go through the process again I'd find an independent ORDIT registered trainer and pay for the training I need not for some set syllabus.
Incidentally, with your ex-police background have you considered examining for RoSPA/IAM? Maybe a good way to get some practice in developing assessor skills.
Incidentally, with your ex-police background have you considered examining for RoSPA/IAM? Maybe a good way to get some practice in developing assessor skills.
anonymous said:
[redacted]
HPC yes, Rospa no.The idea of how to market is probably the right one - about 40 years ago I took the High Performance Course largely as a result of articles in Motor magazine by the then Chief Instructor, John Lyon. However, the market it is minuscule, and there is already competition.
The most comprehensive set of advanced driving demo videos on Youtube at the moment are from Reg Local - a man already mentioned above, ex Police Advanced Instructor. Reg not his real name) has undoubtedly invested an enormous amount of time for little financial reward. Do you feel that you could make videos different enough or better enough than his? It is by no means easy.
Dizeee
You need to get a lot of training, qualifications & experience.
My advice would be bite the bullet & get a job at Hendon. I know it may not be ideal commuting, or what you really want to do etc ( & I don't know how long you've got to do before you can get at the pension), but you'll be getting paid whilst you acquire all of the above & they are crying out for people.
Being an ADI really is a more realistic proposition for you post retirement, you'll have income for periods where work is lean. You are also pigeonholing yourself with 'on road performance cars'. There is enough work to be had without having to teach learners & you'll find it much easier & lucrative with the experience/qualifications that Hendon will give you. Even if you can't stick it until pension time, I'd still say you would be best doing it for 5 years & re-evaluating your position. I know 5 years sounds like a long time now but it will pass quickly & you will get a lot of experience as well as get a lot of courses/training for yourself in that time.
Opportunities are easier & more numerous in other 'advanced driver training' areas than your chosen pigeon hole.
You need to get a lot of training, qualifications & experience.
My advice would be bite the bullet & get a job at Hendon. I know it may not be ideal commuting, or what you really want to do etc ( & I don't know how long you've got to do before you can get at the pension), but you'll be getting paid whilst you acquire all of the above & they are crying out for people.
Being an ADI really is a more realistic proposition for you post retirement, you'll have income for periods where work is lean. You are also pigeonholing yourself with 'on road performance cars'. There is enough work to be had without having to teach learners & you'll find it much easier & lucrative with the experience/qualifications that Hendon will give you. Even if you can't stick it until pension time, I'd still say you would be best doing it for 5 years & re-evaluating your position. I know 5 years sounds like a long time now but it will pass quickly & you will get a lot of experience as well as get a lot of courses/training for yourself in that time.
Opportunities are easier & more numerous in other 'advanced driver training' areas than your chosen pigeon hole.
Edited by vonhosen on Tuesday 4th December 07:36
Speed limits, higher performance of all cars and congestion on most uk roads are reasons why people who want to explore and exploit their performance car have no alternative but to go on track or certain less congested and policed roads, mostly abroad..
I love driving so I decided to train as an ADI recently, following redundancy and to take a year out of corporate life and see how it goes. I’m realistic that the money is bad but everyone’s circumstances are different. I should pass part 2 by Feb so will have taken 4 months, the test centres get busy.. good luck
I love driving so I decided to train as an ADI recently, following redundancy and to take a year out of corporate life and see how it goes. I’m realistic that the money is bad but everyone’s circumstances are different. I should pass part 2 by Feb so will have taken 4 months, the test centres get busy.. good luck
I’ve been an ADI for 4 years now, easily the best move I made. There’s a specific way you must teach, or at least appear to teach when you do your part 3 and standards check. Ultimately it’s about getting the students to think about what they’re doing, it isn’t always easy as some people just really aren’t natural drivers so it takes time, a lot of patience & near death experiences.
You choose who you work with, when and where. You should be able to charge around £30 an hour. If you want to charge more (£35-40 an hour) teach automatics and have hand controls plus left foot accelerator adaptation. You can then teach disabled people who struggle to get instructors.
I’ve got a website that costs £65 a year and a Facebook page (free) plus the learner box on the car. 90% of my business is word of mouth recommendations and i typically have a 4 week wait for new starters. Don’t go with red or any of the big brand names. They’re nearly £1000 a month franchise costs. Find a small independent company who will charge per student £30 or offer a small franchise fee of around £60 a week. You will need your own car, I’ve got a Ford Focus 1.6tdci titanium which is easily the most perfect car for the job. It’s got nav a bit of power and lights in the footwells.
Don’t forget your taxes, put 10-15% of your earnings to the side for January and July.
What no one has mentioned and is easily the worst part of teaching learners is you’re in a clearly marked learner car. Most other road users now hate you and will bully you, because they can. I got rear ended again 3 weeks ago. I got smashed into badly twice in a 3 month period in 2017. Lost count of how many little love taps we’ve got. People will drive as close to you as they can even if you’ve done nothing wrong, sit an inch from you at junctions, even on hills and overtake needlessly as soon as an opportunity arises regardless of any benefit or danger present. They also force you to slow down, change direction and stop at meet situations even when you have priority, because f
k learners.
You choose who you work with, when and where. You should be able to charge around £30 an hour. If you want to charge more (£35-40 an hour) teach automatics and have hand controls plus left foot accelerator adaptation. You can then teach disabled people who struggle to get instructors.
I’ve got a website that costs £65 a year and a Facebook page (free) plus the learner box on the car. 90% of my business is word of mouth recommendations and i typically have a 4 week wait for new starters. Don’t go with red or any of the big brand names. They’re nearly £1000 a month franchise costs. Find a small independent company who will charge per student £30 or offer a small franchise fee of around £60 a week. You will need your own car, I’ve got a Ford Focus 1.6tdci titanium which is easily the most perfect car for the job. It’s got nav a bit of power and lights in the footwells.
Don’t forget your taxes, put 10-15% of your earnings to the side for January and July.
What no one has mentioned and is easily the worst part of teaching learners is you’re in a clearly marked learner car. Most other road users now hate you and will bully you, because they can. I got rear ended again 3 weeks ago. I got smashed into badly twice in a 3 month period in 2017. Lost count of how many little love taps we’ve got. People will drive as close to you as they can even if you’ve done nothing wrong, sit an inch from you at junctions, even on hills and overtake needlessly as soon as an opportunity arises regardless of any benefit or danger present. They also force you to slow down, change direction and stop at meet situations even when you have priority, because f
k learners. MK4 Slowride said:
What no one has mentioned and is easily the worst part of teaching learners is you’re in a clearly marked learner car. Most other road users now hate you and will bully you, because they can. I got rear ended again 3 weeks ago. I got smashed into badly twice in a 3 month period in 2017. Lost count of how many little love taps we’ve got. People will drive as close to you as they can even if you’ve done nothing wrong, sit an inch from you at junctions, even on hills and overtake needlessly as soon as an opportunity arises regardless of any benefit or danger present. They also force you to slow down, change direction and stop at meet situations even when you have priority, because fk learners.
^^^^This! Although fortunately I've only had one incident in 3 years that involved contact. I have a rogues gallery of dashcam footage of the type of incidents you describe. k learners. As an ADI you can get involved in speed & mobile phone awareness courses so no learners. Also fleet with the likes of Pertemps where you evaluate predominately Royal Mail drivers, although the pay with them is much lower than cat B training. You also don’t need to be fleet registered to do that either.
Or you could train to be an examiner, wether that be for cat B or doing standards checks on ADI’s, no need to be an ADI yourself, your current experience is more than they ask for anyway and you could dicatate your hours I’d Imagine.
Or you could train to be an examiner, wether that be for cat B or doing standards checks on ADI’s, no need to be an ADI yourself, your current experience is more than they ask for anyway and you could dicatate your hours I’d Imagine.
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