ARE THESE POOR LANE MARKINGS?
Discussion
Would any Advanced Drivers like to comment?
Please forgive the steering wheel holding. Sorry about that, I know it is wrong.
In the first photograph you can see the centre lane markings of a two lane carriageway. On a right hand bend, obviously the best exit view is from the very left of a road, but motorists who keep to the left of the white lines, presumably ought to be a in safe position.
In the second photograph, anyone who had been driving close to the centre white line on the two lane road, suddenly at the exit of the bend, finds themselves positioned in the middle lane of a three lane carriageway.
Many drivers would probably expect the centre of the road white line, to guide them into the inside lane, at the beginning of a three lane section of road, particularly when that follows a right hand bend.
Motorists vary in their experience, and many would probably not be driving cars with perfect weight distribution which can swerve instantly without drama.
Is there a mistake with these road markings, or am I expecting too much help from white lines on the approach to a three lane road?
Both lanes are for traffic in your direction primarily.
I cant see the white lines clearly but it looks like the is a single unbroken white line on your side with a broken white on the other side showing the other driver can cross to overtake. It may well be that where the other driver is it is a double white and he has moved out early but can't see.
As an aside if you were positioning to overtake a slower vehicle and he did that i would expect him to be to blame as you would still be wholly within your lane on the correct side of the carriageway.
I cant see the white lines clearly but it looks like the is a single unbroken white line on your side with a broken white on the other side showing the other driver can cross to overtake. It may well be that where the other driver is it is a double white and he has moved out early but can't see.
As an aside if you were positioning to overtake a slower vehicle and he did that i would expect him to be to blame as you would still be wholly within your lane on the correct side of the carriageway.
Nothing wrong with the markings, though that looks like a poor overtake from the oncoming car.
Worth noting - if you'd been in the correct position for the bend (which you successfully identify as being over to the left), then the overtaking car wouldn't have been an issue at all.
As this demonstrates, it's not as black-and-white as 'motorists who keep to the left of the white lines, presumably ought to be a in safe position'.
Worth noting - if you'd been in the correct position for the bend (which you successfully identify as being over to the left), then the overtaking car wouldn't have been an issue at all.
As this demonstrates, it's not as black-and-white as 'motorists who keep to the left of the white lines, presumably ought to be a in safe position'.
andburg said:
Both lanes are for traffic in your direction primarily.
I cant see the white lines clearly but it looks like the is a single unbroken white line on your side with a broken white on the other side showing the other driver can cross to overtake. It may well be that where the other driver is it is a double white and he has moved out early but can't see.
As an aside if you were positioning to overtake a slower vehicle and he did that i would expect him to be to blame as you would still be wholly within your lane on the correct side of the carriageway.
I cant see the white lines clearly but it looks like the is a single unbroken white line on your side with a broken white on the other side showing the other driver can cross to overtake. It may well be that where the other driver is it is a double white and he has moved out early but can't see.
As an aside if you were positioning to overtake a slower vehicle and he did that i would expect him to be to blame as you would still be wholly within your lane on the correct side of the carriageway.
Here is a third photograph, which shows the 3-lane white lines more clearly. Your interpretation is correct. There are no double whites, so I don't think the other driver is doing anything wrong. He/she also moves away as much as possible from a potential collision.
Your apportionment of blame is interesting. The approach speed of the two vehicles would be about 120 mph (quite legal for the road). A head-on collision was avoided, but with an impact at that speed, I would be '6 feet under'. I don't think being considered blameless would make me better.
Thank you for your comments. My own view is that the way that the 3-lane section commences at the exit of a bend, does probably contribute to some dangerous possibilities and misunderstandings.
Once you know that section of road and the potential danger, keeping to the left is the obvious solution, but for a 'first timer' who may be relying on road markings (ie. the arrow indicates keep left of the centre line), there might be trouble ahead.
Edited by Dewi 1 on Monday 5th January 21:32
That'll be here then.
Does look like it could be better marked...perhaps 'toe-in' arrows to show the centre lane ending or narrowing the single lane before opening out to the shared middle lane with a hashed area in the middle? Views look to be good both ways but I know streetview can be deceptive.
Does look like it could be better marked...perhaps 'toe-in' arrows to show the centre lane ending or narrowing the single lane before opening out to the shared middle lane with a hashed area in the middle? Views look to be good both ways but I know streetview can be deceptive.
Interesting one, that.
Some "move over" arrows at the end (start?) of the middle lane might be useful or I can see people finding themselves hung out to dry when the lane suddenly runs out, which isn't ideal comming up to a corner.
I mean I know they shouldn't, but as we all know, people often don't plan beyond "gottagetpastgottagetpasts
tstst"
Some "move over" arrows at the end (start?) of the middle lane might be useful or I can see people finding themselves hung out to dry when the lane suddenly runs out, which isn't ideal comming up to a corner.
I mean I know they shouldn't, but as we all know, people often don't plan beyond "gottagetpastgottagetpasts
tstst"Dewi 1 said:
Here is a third photograph, which shows the 3-lane white lines more clearly. Your interpretation is correct. There are no double whites, so I don't think the other driver is doing anything wrong. He/she also moves away as much as possible from a potential collision.
There is no "potential collision", unless the person heading in your direction is following the centre line instead of keeping left.You could add some hatchlings, but I really don't think they are needed there as the visibility round the bend is pretty good, so plenty of time to react to oncoming danger.
The main risk is if you commence an overtake in anticipation of the extra lane, only to find it is occupied by a car coming the other way executing a late overtake before the extra lane run our!
Steve
The main risk is if you commence an overtake in anticipation of the extra lane, only to find it is occupied by a car coming the other way executing a late overtake before the extra lane run our!
Steve
Dewi 1 said:
Would any Advanced Drivers like to comment?
Please forgive the steering wheel holding. Sorry about that, I know it is wrong.
In the first photograph you can see the centre lane markings of a two lane carriageway. On a right hand bend, obviously the best exit view is from the very left of a road, but motorists who keep to the left of the white lines, presumably ought to be a in safe position.
In the second photograph, anyone who had been driving close to the centre white line on the two lane road, suddenly at the exit of the bend, finds themselves positioned in the middle lane of a three lane carriageway.
Many drivers would probably expect the centre of the road white line, to guide them into the inside lane, at the beginning of a three lane section of road, particularly when that follows a right hand bend.
Motorists vary in their experience, and many would probably not be driving cars with perfect weight distribution which can swerve instantly without drama.
Is there a mistake with these road markings, or am I expecting too much help from white lines on the approach to a three lane road?
There's clear guidance on the subject of sighting distances for over take manoeuvres as well as road design which govern road markings. Looking at your pics I would say there isn't a fundamental problem but I have been drinking and not really looked at all the photos / google earth images. Please forgive the steering wheel holding. Sorry about that, I know it is wrong.
In the first photograph you can see the centre lane markings of a two lane carriageway. On a right hand bend, obviously the best exit view is from the very left of a road, but motorists who keep to the left of the white lines, presumably ought to be a in safe position.
In the second photograph, anyone who had been driving close to the centre white line on the two lane road, suddenly at the exit of the bend, finds themselves positioned in the middle lane of a three lane carriageway.
Many drivers would probably expect the centre of the road white line, to guide them into the inside lane, at the beginning of a three lane section of road, particularly when that follows a right hand bend.
Motorists vary in their experience, and many would probably not be driving cars with perfect weight distribution which can swerve instantly without drama.
Is there a mistake with these road markings, or am I expecting too much help from white lines on the approach to a three lane road?
It sounds like you've had a near miss because both parties were travelling at speeds above the posted limit?
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