Very short sliproad...
Discussion
Driving home from Liverpool today, I was driving along the A380 nearing home.
Travelling at a reasonable pace round a very wide left hander when about 5 cars were trying to join the road from the sliproad. They were being led by a learner.
The road is here... http://goo.gl/maps/eJ6mn
There was a Mercedes CL overtaking me at the time, around the position of my blind spot.
Anyway, I rounded this corner to find a learner driver heading to pull into my lane. No chance of the learner stopping and there was also a French registered Prius behind also going for the lane I was in.
I went HARD on the brakes as did Mr. Mercedes and the learner to some extent. The learner ended up in front of me and the Prius almost in the side of me.
Was there anything else I could have done. The CL was slightly beside me so there was no way I could have swerved.
I was trying to explain this to my dad and I know that it is my right of way and the learners responsibility to merge properly but I would not be typing this if I have not have jumped on the brakes.
Anyone else had anything similar?
Travelling at a reasonable pace round a very wide left hander when about 5 cars were trying to join the road from the sliproad. They were being led by a learner.
The road is here... http://goo.gl/maps/eJ6mn
There was a Mercedes CL overtaking me at the time, around the position of my blind spot.
Anyway, I rounded this corner to find a learner driver heading to pull into my lane. No chance of the learner stopping and there was also a French registered Prius behind also going for the lane I was in.
I went HARD on the brakes as did Mr. Mercedes and the learner to some extent. The learner ended up in front of me and the Prius almost in the side of me.
Was there anything else I could have done. The CL was slightly beside me so there was no way I could have swerved.
I was trying to explain this to my dad and I know that it is my right of way and the learners responsibility to merge properly but I would not be typing this if I have not have jumped on the brakes.
Anyone else had anything similar?
lankybob said:
Was there anything else I could have done. The CL was slightly beside me so there was no way I could have swerved.
I try not to be side by side with anything in situations where a distress lane change may become an issue.If I'd been driving the CL I'd have avoided being next to you passing the slip, either by scooting past or hanging back. Since it wasn't me in the CL a wee lift to increase separation might have been in order...
lankybob said:
I was trying to explain this to my dad and I know that it is my right of way and the learners responsibility to merge properly but I would not be typing this if I have not have jumped on the brakes.
Indeed. there's nothing going for being right but dead.Instructor and Prius driver need slapped/specs all the same.
Plan for idiots and ingenues, always.
lankybob said:
Anyone else had anything similar?
Not in a long time, I always (intend to) have an escape plan approaching junctions.Always plan to have an escape route if the vehicles around you do something mental.
But, hey, you were able to stop. You might have needed to brake hard but you were at a speed where this was possible without an accident. So you did OK!
One always wants to try and do better but any day you aren't a part of the accident is a good one!
But, hey, you were able to stop. You might have needed to brake hard but you were at a speed where this was possible without an accident. So you did OK!
One always wants to try and do better but any day you aren't a part of the accident is a good one!
I knew where you meant without even having to look at the link! It's a hideous setup there with the slip road being curtailed by the bridge section, no way of making it longer.
I always aim to drift out into lane 2 before I arrive at the danger zone but I appreciate you didn't have that chance. You will in future!
On a side note, have you ever joined the DC from that slip road? It is truly quite scary. Very poor over the shoulder vision as you are trying to set up and build speed after the 270 degree approach and contend with the short slip road.
On a quiet Sunday morning try it from their position and you will see where it all got tangled up. It is not nice.
Come to think of it, a few years ago I very nearly joined the DC on opposite lock after I hit gravel or diesel in the final approaches!
I always aim to drift out into lane 2 before I arrive at the danger zone but I appreciate you didn't have that chance. You will in future!
On a side note, have you ever joined the DC from that slip road? It is truly quite scary. Very poor over the shoulder vision as you are trying to set up and build speed after the 270 degree approach and contend with the short slip road.
On a quiet Sunday morning try it from their position and you will see where it all got tangled up. It is not nice.
Come to think of it, a few years ago I very nearly joined the DC on opposite lock after I hit gravel or diesel in the final approaches!
As you were near home, I assume that you know this junction. If this is the case, you should approach it expecting this kind of event. Did you, or were you just lucky?
This type of thing happens to me everyday at Lenton Lane / Clifton Boulevard (Nottingham) and I always prepare for the "unexpected". Admittedly, my approach is straight and I can see the cars on the sliproad, but the scenario is similar.
Ultimately, it is a case of "always have a Plan B / Plan C, etc.". You had reduced your options to braking only, and luckily that proved to be enough.
Is there anything else that YOU think that YOU could have done to make the situation easier?
This type of thing happens to me everyday at Lenton Lane / Clifton Boulevard (Nottingham) and I always prepare for the "unexpected". Admittedly, my approach is straight and I can see the cars on the sliproad, but the scenario is similar.
Ultimately, it is a case of "always have a Plan B / Plan C, etc.". You had reduced your options to braking only, and luckily that proved to be enough.
Is there anything else that YOU think that YOU could have done to make the situation easier?
https://maps.google.co.uk/maps?q=A380&hl=en&am...
If I saw this I probably wouldn't hang around in lane 1. Or make sure to drop a gear & ensure I could adjust me speed to ensure a gap to my right whilst I approached the slip road (which is what others have already said)
If I saw this I probably wouldn't hang around in lane 1. Or make sure to drop a gear & ensure I could adjust me speed to ensure a gap to my right whilst I approached the slip road (which is what others have already said)
7mike said:
https://maps.google.co.uk/maps?q=A380&hl=en&am...
If I saw this I probably wouldn't hang around in lane 1. Or make sure to drop a gear & ensure I could adjust me speed to ensure a gap to my right whilst I approached the slip road (which is what others have already said)
Sadly I couldn't remember the exact position of the slip road. What I will say though is that the junction does appear rather quickly at the speeds on this road, however in future I will make sure I am in lane 2 out of harms way. I think I have probably learnt my lesson.If I saw this I probably wouldn't hang around in lane 1. Or make sure to drop a gear & ensure I could adjust me speed to ensure a gap to my right whilst I approached the slip road (which is what others have already said)
pingu393 said:
As you were near home, I assume that you know this junction. If this is the case, you should approach it expecting this kind of event. Did you, or were you just lucky?
This type of thing happens to me everyday at Lenton Lane / Clifton Boulevard (Nottingham) and I always prepare for the "unexpected". Admittedly, my approach is straight and I can see the cars on the sliproad, but the scenario is similar.
Ultimately, it is a case of "always have a Plan B / Plan C, etc.". You had reduced your options to braking only, and luckily that proved to be enough.
Is there anything else that YOU think that YOU could have done to make the situation easier?
The only thing that could have made the situation easier would be if I had slowed and let the Mercedes past when he was overtaking.This type of thing happens to me everyday at Lenton Lane / Clifton Boulevard (Nottingham) and I always prepare for the "unexpected". Admittedly, my approach is straight and I can see the cars on the sliproad, but the scenario is similar.
Ultimately, it is a case of "always have a Plan B / Plan C, etc.". You had reduced your options to braking only, and luckily that proved to be enough.
Is there anything else that YOU think that YOU could have done to make the situation easier?
Plan A is usually to get into lane 2 but that was not possible so heavy braking was my last option.
I certainly got lucky here but I still do think that the learner came down too fast and pulled out. I'm not looking to place blame here, just wondering what everyone would do in the situation.
Don said:
But, hey, you were able to stop. You might have needed to brake hard but you were at a speed where this was possible without an accident. So you did OK!
...and you're wondering how to do better, which is the path to learning.
The magic word is "separation"; avoid being side by side, especially near junctions: keep well back from anyone who might need to brake...
lankybob said:
The only thing that could have made the situation easier would be if I had slowed and let the Mercedes past when he was overtaking.
A momentary lift as someone is passing usually makes things better...The less time you spend side by side the better; poke when passing, lift when being passed.
ETA: derestricted Autobahnen are different, differentials can be too big!
Edited by fluffnik on Thursday 8th August 00:11
lankybob said:
...in future I will make sure I am in lane 2 out of harms way.
Good option as long as no-one is on your left. They may panic and move right, leaving you with nowhere to go.lankybob said:
The only thing that could have made the situation easier would be if I had slowed and let the Mercedes past when he was overtaking.
As some posters above have said a little lift-off would leave you with a possible merge behind the Mercedes as another alternative. It would also allow you to continue progressively with minimal loss of speed. As an aside, I'm constantly amazed at how many drivers don't know this "trick" and end up blocking themselves in.
pingu393 said:
As an aside, I'm constantly amazed at how many drivers don't know this "trick" and end up blocking themselves in.
On multi-lane roads I always look well ahead for potential conflicts where there will be more vehicles than lanes at any point and minutely adjust my speed accordingly.
This also works at Autobahn speeds.
7mike said:
https://maps.google.co.uk/maps?q=A380&hl=en&am...
If I saw this I probably wouldn't hang around in lane 1. Or make sure to drop a gear & ensure I could adjust me speed to ensure a gap to my right whilst I approached the slip road (which is what others have already said)
Unless you're behind a HGV, that sign is visible from at least back here, if not further. I reckon that gives more than enough warning of the likely need for a move to lane 2. It is obvious from the road configuration and surrounding vegetation that visibility leaves a lot to be desired. Anticipation is the name of the game.If I saw this I probably wouldn't hang around in lane 1. Or make sure to drop a gear & ensure I could adjust me speed to ensure a gap to my right whilst I approached the slip road (which is what others have already said)
Red Devil said:
Unless you're behind a HGV, that sign is visible from at least back here, if not further. I reckon that gives more than enough warning of the likely need for a move to lane 2. It is obvious from the road configuration and surrounding vegetation that visibility leaves a lot to be desired. Anticipation is the name of the game.
Now this one is clearly visible but no one shifts over to L2 because the slip road for Kendal is just past the service station. That bloody great BP sign causes havoc trying to get out!https://maps.google.co.uk/maps?hl=en&ll=54.294...
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