Skidpan Training
Discussion
Well I already have an idea of what to do in the event of a skid, but I don't have any practical experience of this happening in a car, obviously you try and avoid it where possible. I've done a fair amount of competitive karting but obviously this isn't the same, especially since the car I drive day-to-day is FWD and it's only been slow speeds in the snow where the car has stepped out.
Basically just want a safe environment where the car will spin and I can try and correct it and gain experience. Preferably without an arrogant instructor who will stereotype a 20 year old male..
Basically just want a safe environment where the car will spin and I can try and correct it and gain experience. Preferably without an arrogant instructor who will stereotype a 20 year old male..
I quite enjoyed this one:
http://www.donpalmer.co.uk/car-control.html
Real-world speeds in your own car and plenty of scope for exploring near, at and beyond the limit of grip with huge run-offs.
Chris
http://www.donpalmer.co.uk/car-control.html
Real-world speeds in your own car and plenty of scope for exploring near, at and beyond the limit of grip with huge run-offs.
Chris
I haven't done anything like this since a couple of goes in a car on a cradle back in the 90s, so please don't just take my word for it.
However, I've got the impression that simple skid control is not necessarily the best thing to learn. I'm sure it's an entertaining afternoon (if you're not prone to motion sickness), but there's a debate to be had about how well you'll retain the learning in the future, and whether there's actually enough space on the road to catch a skid even if you know how.
The more dynamics-based training like Don Palmer seems a bit different, in that you learn much more about how to manage and recognise when you're getting near the limit of grip. These skills are readily transferrable to everyday driving, and will probably result in not getting into skids in the first place, rather than rescuing you from a situation where you're not sure how or why it happened.
Do you want to have an afternoon of fun throwing the car around, or do you want to learn to drive faster and safer?
However, I've got the impression that simple skid control is not necessarily the best thing to learn. I'm sure it's an entertaining afternoon (if you're not prone to motion sickness), but there's a debate to be had about how well you'll retain the learning in the future, and whether there's actually enough space on the road to catch a skid even if you know how.
The more dynamics-based training like Don Palmer seems a bit different, in that you learn much more about how to manage and recognise when you're getting near the limit of grip. These skills are readily transferrable to everyday driving, and will probably result in not getting into skids in the first place, rather than rescuing you from a situation where you're not sure how or why it happened.
Do you want to have an afternoon of fun throwing the car around, or do you want to learn to drive faster and safer?
I know I said to post up things of all prices but I think the Don Palmer might be a little too much. I understand some people have found it very good but not looking to drop £450 on it at all. £200 and under would be better, but if its just not possible to get anything decent then I guess I will have to pass.
Carlimits run a similar sort of day and if you share the day with 3 other people, you can drop the cost down to £220:
http://www.carlimits.com/script/viewEvents.php?typ...
They also run car club days where the cost comes down significantly if you get, say 20 people together, but as a result so does time with an instructor.
Chris
http://www.carlimits.com/script/viewEvents.php?typ...
They also run car club days where the cost comes down significantly if you get, say 20 people together, but as a result so does time with an instructor.
Chris
I had a session in a cradle-mounted skid car, on a gravel car park.
I've sought-out and experienced many low-grip situations in the past, but it was an enjoyable experience.
The chronic understeer scenario, although not particularly fun, was quite useful, although it did demonstrate that it would be easy to run out of road before you managed to rescue it. You may manage to avoid hitting a large object though.
The oversteer scenario allowed for a bit of show-boating drifting if you knew what to do, whilst the instructor tried to catch you out, which was a laugh.
It was interesting to note that the other customers I saw generally didn't really have an understanding of the principles involved. The same is probably true for almost all drivers.
I've sought-out and experienced many low-grip situations in the past, but it was an enjoyable experience.
The chronic understeer scenario, although not particularly fun, was quite useful, although it did demonstrate that it would be easy to run out of road before you managed to rescue it. You may manage to avoid hitting a large object though.
The oversteer scenario allowed for a bit of show-boating drifting if you knew what to do, whilst the instructor tried to catch you out, which was a laugh.
It was interesting to note that the other customers I saw generally didn't really have an understanding of the principles involved. The same is probably true for almost all drivers.
Edited by MC Bodge on Tuesday 30th April 15:46
I can personally recommend trying a Skidcar session, SKIDCAR allows you to simulate ALL types of low grip identification and recover/prevention scenarios at manageable speeds, I have used low grip surfaces of many types in the past and vehicles with articulated axles and have real reservations with them, a number of them we have ended up at fairly high speed not losing grip then all of a sudden no grip at all and happening at a speed that is all but unrecoverable, skidcar frame allows reduced grip to any wheels to simulate driving on all surfaces, front rear and any combo including all 4 wheels off if desired, well worth the money in my opinion, enjoy...
Gary
Gary
Dixy said:
"shockingly inconsistent grip" just like the real world then
I'm sure there is meant to be a smiley of some kind there but going round a skid pan at nearly 30mph with slicks on the driven wheels with 50 plus psi in them and still not losing grip then when it does go it goes so quick that nobody can catch it is what I meant, very limited learning can take place in that scenario in my view... just thinking about value for money for the OP,Gary
Fancy getting on a cheapo flight to Gothenburg?
Learn where I did (except it was part of my licence training here): http://storaholm.se/eng/continuationcourse/rangeof...
Skid control in wet and dry, high-speed skid, low-speed skid, elk avoidance in wet and dry, cars not dollied but watered course, and great instructors (in my experience).
Under 200 notes, trouble is a flight would take it over that figure. Places like this all over Sweden since it's compulsory training for a driving licence.
ETA: they had both RWD and FWD cars too when I was there (a while ago now, 2008).
Learn where I did (except it was part of my licence training here): http://storaholm.se/eng/continuationcourse/rangeof...
Skid control in wet and dry, high-speed skid, low-speed skid, elk avoidance in wet and dry, cars not dollied but watered course, and great instructors (in my experience).
Under 200 notes, trouble is a flight would take it over that figure. Places like this all over Sweden since it's compulsory training for a driving licence.
ETA: they had both RWD and FWD cars too when I was there (a while ago now, 2008).
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