Arthur Shelley - 50 years in the Met!
Discussion
MC Bodge said:
Oily skid pans like that (I saw it on a visit to Hendon) strike me as a little too predictable.
I spent a day on that very pan when they were still using the old SD1 Rovers.The surfaces actually change as you go round, so you could be holding a nice slide, then lose it when you hit a section with lower friction.
Obviously its not the perfect way to learn these skills, but it allows you to learn the basics, at a very low speed, and in a relatively restricted space.
Skid pans like Hendon's are now very few and far between.
Merseyside Police still have one at Smithdown Lane Police Station in Liverpool. It has different types of concrete and is greased in certain areas.
The primary purpose of the skid pan is to teach students how to avoid skidding in the first place. If however they do skid, the skid pan allows the students to control the skids at a speed and in conditions where it is safe to do so.
The skid pan training is as much "attitudinal" as anything else.
Front and rear wheel drive cars are used, and a car with stability control is also used showing the difference between skidding with it switched on and off.
The skids themselves are very realistic, except for the fact that they happen at much lower speeds.
The purpose of the different surfaces and the application of grease to some of them replicates a 'microclimate' or area of less grip (black ice, wet leaves, muddy road surface, etc). So that you can drive quite well on one surface and suddenly lose that grip when the surface changes.
In addition to this basic training students are asked to pursue or follow the instructors around the pan. Needless to say this attitudinal lesson requires the students to keep calm, avoid the red mist and use the accelerator and steering appropriately at the correct time.
If you haven't been on a skid pan and get the opportunity then please go. It is so much more realistic than a skid car and will also prove that ABS and stability control aren't as good as you think!
Merseyside Police still have one at Smithdown Lane Police Station in Liverpool. It has different types of concrete and is greased in certain areas.
The primary purpose of the skid pan is to teach students how to avoid skidding in the first place. If however they do skid, the skid pan allows the students to control the skids at a speed and in conditions where it is safe to do so.
The skid pan training is as much "attitudinal" as anything else.
Front and rear wheel drive cars are used, and a car with stability control is also used showing the difference between skidding with it switched on and off.
The skids themselves are very realistic, except for the fact that they happen at much lower speeds.
The purpose of the different surfaces and the application of grease to some of them replicates a 'microclimate' or area of less grip (black ice, wet leaves, muddy road surface, etc). So that you can drive quite well on one surface and suddenly lose that grip when the surface changes.
In addition to this basic training students are asked to pursue or follow the instructors around the pan. Needless to say this attitudinal lesson requires the students to keep calm, avoid the red mist and use the accelerator and steering appropriately at the correct time.
If you haven't been on a skid pan and get the opportunity then please go. It is so much more realistic than a skid car and will also prove that ABS and stability control aren't as good as you think!
Cost cutting is now a big issue for all public services. There is a common misconception developing, that stability control systems are the Panacea for all issues involving skidding / loss of directional control etc....
The truth is they're not, and if as a driver you are relying on the intervention of these control systems to save you from crashing, then surely that suggests that you're driving isn't very good.
As a last resort, the electronic stability systems can be very good and no doubt save lives and injuries, however they are not 'fool proof', and recognising conditions which may cause a skid or loss of control and then avoiding them by good driving technique, is far superior and far safer than a button with an acronym that gives you that false sense of security.
Ultimately if there is no grip left on a road, no amount of individual wheel braking by a computer will put you back on course. It is at that point you cease to be the driver in your own car, and become a passenger in a crash which could potentially have been avoided by an earlier intervention by you, the driver!
The truth is they're not, and if as a driver you are relying on the intervention of these control systems to save you from crashing, then surely that suggests that you're driving isn't very good.
As a last resort, the electronic stability systems can be very good and no doubt save lives and injuries, however they are not 'fool proof', and recognising conditions which may cause a skid or loss of control and then avoiding them by good driving technique, is far superior and far safer than a button with an acronym that gives you that false sense of security.
Ultimately if there is no grip left on a road, no amount of individual wheel braking by a computer will put you back on course. It is at that point you cease to be the driver in your own car, and become a passenger in a crash which could potentially have been avoided by an earlier intervention by you, the driver!
Edited by davidrhyswoods on Sunday 30th December 23:58
Edited by davidrhyswoods on Sunday 30th December 23:59
WeirdNeville said:
Vonhosen> That's a crying shame! I wonder what they use now?
Some just get a classroom input, others are fortunate enough to get some additional practical input on an airfield (at a bit more pace than you would have on the skidpan).National minimal requirements don't require any practical input.
WeirdNeville said:
Environmental concerns, or just cost cutting?
Both & training to reflect current fleet. All vehicles will now have ESP etc & driver's regs state you are not to turn it off.cars on skid cradles are presumably much easier to use and need far less infrastructure than oily pans - actually isn't it some kind of detergent?
I've had a go on a skidpan that I think was in Croydon and the one at Castle Combe on a couple of occasions.
The best way must surely be to go "drifting". I must have a go at that.
Bert
I've had a go on a skidpan that I think was in Croydon and the one at Castle Combe on a couple of occasions.
The best way must surely be to go "drifting". I must have a go at that.
Bert
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