What could I have done different (better)?

[MagicalTrevor]

Came into work this morning, coincidentally I was giving a commentary in my head so 'on the ball' however I had a little 'near-miss' and I don't know how I could have handled it any better.

The incident happened here: Google Maps Link

I was following the green route from the M5 junction to the roundabout and right into the Aztec West estate. The road markings clearly show the southbound 'Gloucester Road' as having the right lanes (as I see them on the road) both turning right.
The right-most lane (that I was in) then splits with one lane going back around to the North and other lane that I remained in going into Aztec West. The photo below probably explains things better.


Anyway, I'm well aware that there are slight changes to the layout here and I'm very careful watching anyone to my left hand side but today I came round the roundabout and the other car following the orange route evidentally wanted to be in my lane (assuming that my lane went 180deg around the roundabout?) and nearly collided with my rear-left side of the car.

• I knew he was there, right from when he was heading onto the roundabout, I could see him in my mirrors and peripheral vision
• I didn't move over to the right-most lane (giving the false impression that I was going around)
• I didn't react in an aggressive manner, despite his aggressive response (beeping, tailgating)

I tend to over-analyse these things so I'm just trying to work out what I should/could have done different or better.

Thanks

[BertBert]

Those lane manipulation things on roundabouts where the dotted line moves you over are completely prone to this. I have the same every day on the A3/M25 jcn. There's little you can specifically do other than be aware of where the other car is, perhaps looking out for impatient car-body-language. I don't think that indicating is strictly called for, but a big fat early indication can help stake your claim to the road position.

If you think you have Mr Impatient, then if you see early enough you can try to adjust your position relative to theirs by changing speed.

HTH
Bert

[R0G]

My guess -
The driver on your left knows that the markings at the next roundabout only allow the right lane to go straight ahead and right so wanted that lane to line up for it - NOW!!

You cannot prevent another driver doing something stupid but you can be aware that it could happen and so be prepared for it

Basically its thinking of every 'what if' senario

Edited by R0G on Monday 6th February 10:18

[MagicalTrevor]

Righty or wrongly (you decide) I deliberately don't indicated on that roundabout. It's a dedicated lane that I'm in a I feel that indicating would give the wrong, or confusing, message.
If I indicate right (when on the roundabout) then I could be going right around (doing a 180) however if I indicate left then I could give the impression that I'm change lanes to the left. By not indication and staying in lane then I'm showing my intentions more clearly IMO.

[Dave Hedgehog]

i have marked up the correct route, the hashed bits are the option drift zone for RWD cars

[R0G]

boleszzb said:

Someone driving mistake this isn't you of wrong, good luck

EH??!!

[ScoobyChris]

Not familiar with the junction, but it looks like the only indication of lanes is painted on the road and so it's not obvious which lane is required. From your diagram, perhaps the other person is unfamiliar with the junction and only realised they were in the wrong lane when they left the roundabout (there's a nice left arrow on the road just before they changed lanes) and this led to them trying to change lanes.

Without being there, it's impossible to say why they reacted badly to you. Perhaps you (inadvertently?) slowed down which meant it was difficult for him to change lanes? Perhaps he thought you were continuining around the roundabout and a left signal would have kept him happy? Was he driving like he knew where was going, ie trying to make use of an empty lane and push in to the straight-ahead queue?

Or perhaps he was just having a bad day

Chris

[BertBert]

MagicalTrevor said:

Righty or wrongly (you decide) I deliberately don't indicated on that roundabout. It's a dedicated lane that I'm in a I feel that indicating would give the wrong, or confusing, message.
If I indicate right (when on the roundabout) then I could be going right around (doing a 180) however if I indicate left then I could give the impression that I'm change lanes to the left. By not indication and staying in lane then I'm showing my intentions more clearly IMO.

It's hard to see, but you are effectively changing lanes to move over to come off the roundabout (following the "dotted" line). I'm guessing that it's a game of "stake your claim" to take that lane and that the other driver knows full well what the layout is and is trying to muscle his way in rather than happily merging behind you. I don't think that the use of the LH indicator is as bad you think!

Bert

[MagicalTrevor]

BertBert said:

MagicalTrevor said:

Righty or wrongly (you decide) I deliberately don't indicated on that roundabout. It's a dedicated lane that I'm in a I feel that indicating would give the wrong, or confusing, message.
If I indicate right (when on the roundabout) then I could be going right around (doing a 180) however if I indicate left then I could give the impression that I'm change lanes to the left. By not indication and staying in lane then I'm showing my intentions more clearly IMO.

It's hard to see, but you are effectively changing lanes to move over to come off the roundabout (following the "dotted" line). I'm guessing that it's a game of "stake your claim" to take that lane and that the other driver knows full well what the layout is and is trying to muscle his way in rather than happily merging behind you. I don't think that the use of the LH indicator is as bad you think!

Bert

It is hard to see but at no point did I, or need to, change lanes. The lane I started on was the one I came off on if that makes sense. Maybe you're right, maybe the LH indicator isn't that bad but I think he confusion started much earlier.

He didn't give the impression that he was unfamilar with the junction. That time of day (7.30am) you don't get many people who don't know the area and he was quite direct in the way he went into the estate.

[R0G]

I know that roundabout very very well as I was instructing trainee LGV drivers on it

It is on the Gloucester LGV test routes

Never a problem to get the correct lane on the approach if the driver is observant

[Piersman2]

MagicalTrevor said:

I tend to over-analyse these things...Thanks

I think you are, a lot.

You did nothing wrong and the other guy needed to move over. Just let him in and move on with life.

Just keep yours eyes peeled at all times and be prepared to let the idiots do their thing. Not worth any more effort or thought than that usually.

[MagicalTrevor]

Piersman2 said:

I think you are, a lot.

You did nothing wrong and the other guy needed to move over. Just let him in and move on with life.

Just keep yours eyes peeled at all times and be prepared to let the idiots do their thing. Not worth any more effort or thought than that usually.

I wasn't obstructing him from getting in, he nearly hit the back LHS of my car and I was maintaining a steady speed. He could have easily tucked in behind me.

[kaf]

If you want to be Hyper critical of yourself.

1. Did you get a sense that the idiot was going to try this?
2. If so was there any way you could have safely increased your distance in front of him?
3. Was there any room to move closer to the right side of your lane so maximising your safety bubble?

The answer may well be 'no' but they are about the only questions you might have been able to ask yourself from a defensive driving standpoint.

Sometimes the other guy can be such a tt and the escape options so limited that there is little you can do.

[MagicalTrevor]

kaf said:

If you want to be Hyper critical of yourself.

1. Did you get a sense that the idiot was going to try this?
2. If so was there any way you could have safely increased your distance in front of him?
3. Was there any room to move closer to the right side of your lane so maximising your safety bubble?

The answer may well be 'no' but they are about the only questions you might have been able to ask yourself from a defensive driving standpoint.

Sometimes the other guy can be such a tt and the escape options so limited that there is little you can do.

Thank you, the answer is indeed 'No'.

Thanks guys, I'm pretty reassured that there was nothing I could possibly have done. I drove and reacted responsibly, without lowering myself to his level.

[Reindeer]

Dave Hedgehog said:

i have marked up the correct route, the hashed bits are the option drift zone for RWD cars

That's properly funny!

[BertBert]

MagicalTrevor said:

It is hard to see but at no point did I, or need to, change lanes.

I don't see it that way! If you are on the inside lane of the roundabout and took an exit, you have to cross the lane by definition. If you think you didn't change lane, what would you have said you'd done if you'd carried on round? I think that a LH indicator is absolutely called for when coming off there. I'm putting the point for debating purposes, but that's the only thing I can see that you might have done differently other than speeded up to give the guy behind more space.

BErt

[kaf]

BertBert said:

I don't see it that way! If you are on the inside lane of the roundabout and took an exit, you have to cross the lane by definition. If you think you didn't change lane, what would you have said you'd done if you'd carried on round? I think that a LH indicator is absolutely called for when coming off there. I'm putting the point for debating purposes, but that's the only thing I can see that you might have done differently other than speeded up to give the guy behind more space.

BErt

No you don't, it is a spiral design, lane 3 on the roundabout spirals out to lane two and lane two feeds out to the required exit, at no time does the OP cross a lane line, so no signal is required.

[MagicalTrevor]

kaf said:

BertBert said:

I don't see it that way! If you are on the inside lane of the roundabout and took an exit, you have to cross the lane by definition. If you think you didn't change lane, what would you have said you'd done if you'd carried on round? I think that a LH indicator is absolutely called for when coming off there. I'm putting the point for debating purposes, but that's the only thing I can see that you might have done differently other than speeded up to give the guy behind more space.

BErt

No you don't, it is a spiral design, lane 3 on the roundabout spirals out to lane two and lane two feeds out to the required exit, at no time does the OP cross a lane line, so no signal is required.

Thank you, this is exactly the case.

[Hooli]

MagicalTrevor said:

kaf said:

BertBert said:

I don't see it that way! If you are on the inside lane of the roundabout and took an exit, you have to cross the lane by definition. If you think you didn't change lane, what would you have said you'd done if you'd carried on round? I think that a LH indicator is absolutely called for when coming off there. I'm putting the point for debating purposes, but that's the only thing I can see that you might have done differently other than speeded up to give the guy behind more space.

BErt

No you don't, it is a spiral design, lane 3 on the roundabout spirals out to lane two and lane two feeds out to the required exit, at no time does the OP cross a lane line, so no signal is required.

Thank you, this is exactly the case.

Ah but it could be argued that the lane continues around the roundabout & it's the exit path that's marked by the white lines. Mind you I agree with Trevor too.

[BertBert]

I did say that I was putting the point for debate. Anyone got a reference to how those "dotted" lines are defined to be used? My driving instructor told me (albeit quite a few years ago) that you could forego indication if the lanes are distinctly marked and signed.

I certainly can't see that in the picture.
Bert