Two lanes narrowing to one - suggested approach?
Discussion
After four rather blissful carless days on the Scilly Isles, yesterday I drove from Exeter airport to where I live just East of Basingstoke, along the A303. The 303 has lots of situations where two lanes turn to one, and it was here I encountered and witnessed a lot of road rage, which I would rather have avoided.
What are people's thoughts on recommended approaches to these "2-1" situations? Here are stories from yesterday for the two common approaches:
1) The "pull in nice and early approach", featuring me
I was driving in lane 2 of a dual carriageway, and a "two lanes to one" sign appeared over a crest, and sure enough, about 400 yards ahead you could see the road doing just that. So, I overtake the next car as planned, bringing me alongside quite a sizeable and safe gap in lane 1, where I flick on my indicator ready to move back to lane one. Whilst I'm still in lane 2, the chap in lane one then accelerates up my inside, blocking my move and flashing his lights at me. The chap behind him isn't really leaving a big enough gap for me to accept an undertake and slot in behind, and the original gap I was going for is still quite large and safe, so (still indicating) I give the car a quick burst of power, and then when up ahead in the safe gap again, I pull in and cancel the indicator. This guy then catches up and comes right up behind me doing the full sign language routine, main beam, the lot. Now, what's interesting is that at the next 2-1, a car comes storming up lane two and slots in front of this aggravated guy behind me, except that he does it at the very last minute and into a tiny gap, cutting over a white hashed area in the process, but strangely without any protest from Mr Angry at all. Is this inferring he would have rather I moved back in at the last minute than conscientiously early? I'd like to know, as my aim is to fit in with everyone as well as possible.
2) The "last minute" approach - featuring a guy in a rather nice S1 Elise. We watch the Elise attempt a last minute cut-in, and get blocked by a van which swerved from lane 1 into the dissapearing lane 2 to stop the Elise going any further.
How do people tackle these situations? In my driving priorities I rate avoiding road rage above making progress. My aim is firstly to keep myself to myself and avoid trouble, and only second to make progress where possible. I''d just like to know how to do this in these two lanes to one situations. Inevitably, I will want to overtake slower vehicles, but often I find that I can't get back in again without causing a huge amount of upset.
What are people's thoughts on recommended approaches to these "2-1" situations? Here are stories from yesterday for the two common approaches:
1) The "pull in nice and early approach", featuring me
I was driving in lane 2 of a dual carriageway, and a "two lanes to one" sign appeared over a crest, and sure enough, about 400 yards ahead you could see the road doing just that. So, I overtake the next car as planned, bringing me alongside quite a sizeable and safe gap in lane 1, where I flick on my indicator ready to move back to lane one. Whilst I'm still in lane 2, the chap in lane one then accelerates up my inside, blocking my move and flashing his lights at me. The chap behind him isn't really leaving a big enough gap for me to accept an undertake and slot in behind, and the original gap I was going for is still quite large and safe, so (still indicating) I give the car a quick burst of power, and then when up ahead in the safe gap again, I pull in and cancel the indicator. This guy then catches up and comes right up behind me doing the full sign language routine, main beam, the lot. Now, what's interesting is that at the next 2-1, a car comes storming up lane two and slots in front of this aggravated guy behind me, except that he does it at the very last minute and into a tiny gap, cutting over a white hashed area in the process, but strangely without any protest from Mr Angry at all. Is this inferring he would have rather I moved back in at the last minute than conscientiously early? I'd like to know, as my aim is to fit in with everyone as well as possible.2) The "last minute" approach - featuring a guy in a rather nice S1 Elise. We watch the Elise attempt a last minute cut-in, and get blocked by a van which swerved from lane 1 into the dissapearing lane 2 to stop the Elise going any further.
How do people tackle these situations? In my driving priorities I rate avoiding road rage above making progress. My aim is firstly to keep myself to myself and avoid trouble, and only second to make progress where possible. I''d just like to know how to do this in these two lanes to one situations. Inevitably, I will want to overtake slower vehicles, but often I find that I can't get back in again without causing a huge amount of upset.
Edited by RobM77 on Wednesday 1st June 00:31
I seem to recall that the IAM view is that traffic should maximise road space by using both lanes up to the converge point and then merge alternately. Good theory, IF all drivers adopted the same strategy. Unfortunately, however, as you point out this is seldom the case and far too many drivers get irrationally upset at the thought of someone pulling in front of them, whatever the circumstances.
In practice, I generally follow the same course as you and try to avoid causing upset, even if I'm within my 'rights'. Sometimes (occasionally) there are signs saying "Use both lanes" and "Merge in turn" which at least give you the moral high ground!
In practice, I generally follow the same course as you and try to avoid causing upset, even if I'm within my 'rights'. Sometimes (occasionally) there are signs saying "Use both lanes" and "Merge in turn" which at least give you the moral high ground!
You're always going to rub people up the wrong way if you "nip in" in front of them, and it often makes little significant difference to progress exactly where in a queue of traffic you are.
Instead, try to slide back behind them. Pause next to vehicle you're planning to get behind, indicate clearly, drift back and slot in. Strangely, people seem more accepting if they feel you are yielding position to slot in, rather than stealing position. And --- see above --- the position is worthless.
The guy behind -- that you were always in front of -- won't resent you sliding across. You were in front anyway, jostling with the guy ahead of him.
Do everything early and slowly, and be prepared to go one or two cars behind into a queue. Leave a big gap to the car in front of you so that you have room to manoeuvre your position back and forth.
Instead, try to slide back behind them. Pause next to vehicle you're planning to get behind, indicate clearly, drift back and slot in. Strangely, people seem more accepting if they feel you are yielding position to slot in, rather than stealing position. And --- see above --- the position is worthless.
The guy behind -- that you were always in front of -- won't resent you sliding across. You were in front anyway, jostling with the guy ahead of him.
Do everything early and slowly, and be prepared to go one or two cars behind into a queue. Leave a big gap to the car in front of you so that you have room to manoeuvre your position back and forth.
RobM77 said:
... bringing me alongside quite a sizeable and safe gap in lane 1, where I flick on my indicator ready to move back to lane one.
If the gap was as large as you suggest, and the traffic was moving at a good speed then I would have acted more positively and moved into the gap at the same time as indicating so as not to give the other driver chance to try and block me.A worse situation is a road I use twice a day where the merge is immediately on the exit from a 2 lane roundabout which is often has the left lane solid so there's no flowing traffic. Some people try to beat the queue by using the right lane to go straight on (from 6 o'clock to 12) but people joining at the 3 o'clock position have no choice but to use the right lane - they can't merge on the roundabout.
At the pinch-point there is often much anger from people trying to block out the right-laners. My understanding is that if you're ahead in the right-lane and you indicate then the car in the left lane has to let you in and if a crash results then they're driving without due care and consideration (careless driving now).
If I do happen to be in the left lane and the guy behind me is blocking then I'll stop and let several cars pass me and get in.
General advice
Merge early if traffic is flowing freely
Merge at pinch point if traffic is crawling
The manner in which merging is done is the key to a safe merge without annoying anyone
If lane 1 is full of heavy or slow moving traffic and lane 2 is virtually unused then gently cruise by in lane 2 and then apply an 'ASK' signal early enough to give those in lane 1 time to see it and react to it
If one or two drivers are determined not to be sensible then let them go - there will always be a sensible driver along soon
I have been doing it this way for years in cars and artics and have NEVER upset or had a problem with anyone
Merge early if traffic is flowing freely
Merge at pinch point if traffic is crawling
The manner in which merging is done is the key to a safe merge without annoying anyone
If lane 1 is full of heavy or slow moving traffic and lane 2 is virtually unused then gently cruise by in lane 2 and then apply an 'ASK' signal early enough to give those in lane 1 time to see it and react to it
If one or two drivers are determined not to be sensible then let them go - there will always be a sensible driver along soon
I have been doing it this way for years in cars and artics and have NEVER upset or had a problem with anyone
I once had something similar in an unfamiliar two lane one-way system, I needed to get into the right lane, checked the mirrors and some woman had dropped right back. As she looked up from the text she was sending and realised I was stealing her place she reacted in, lets say a rather irate manner!!
You can't appeal to a sense of logic which these people do not possess so consider them a source of amusment and keep out of their way as much as posible.
You can't appeal to a sense of logic which these people do not possess so consider them a source of amusment and keep out of their way as much as posible.
R0G said:
General advice
Merge early if traffic is flowing freely
Merge at pinch point if traffic is crawling
The manner in which merging is done is the key to a safe merge without annoying anyone
If lane 1 is full of heavy or slow moving traffic and lane 2 is virtually unused then gently cruise by in lane 2 and then apply an 'ASK' signal early enough to give those in lane 1 time to see it and react to it
If one or two drivers are determined not to be sensible then let them go - there will always be a sensible driver along soon
I have been doing it this way for years in cars and artics and have NEVER upset or had a problem with anyone
This is a perfect description of what I did, but got a whole load of abuse doing it. Merge early if traffic is flowing freely
Merge at pinch point if traffic is crawling
The manner in which merging is done is the key to a safe merge without annoying anyone
If lane 1 is full of heavy or slow moving traffic and lane 2 is virtually unused then gently cruise by in lane 2 and then apply an 'ASK' signal early enough to give those in lane 1 time to see it and react to it
If one or two drivers are determined not to be sensible then let them go - there will always be a sensible driver along soon
I have been doing it this way for years in cars and artics and have NEVER upset or had a problem with anyone
As above, maybe the answer is not to indicate? I tend to think of that as even more rude though - it's doing something without asking permission or notifying others of what you're about to do.
Regarding the advice regarding it not being worth it - yes, I'm the first to realise it doesn't matter if I'm ten cars behind or ahead. In this situation though the dual carriageway had been a few miles long and I'd made a huge amount of progress doing 70 passing lots of 50-60mph trucks and campervans; progress that's really worth it come the next steep hill when trucks slow right down.
RobM77 said:
...maybe the answer is not to indicate? I tend to think of that as even more rude though - it's doing something without asking permission or notifying others of what you're about to do.
In your description above Rob, you said you (quite rightly) gave the signal and then moved. Someone else suggested they would signal whilst moving across. The second option, for me begs the question; why bother with the signal then if you're not giving the other road user time to react? However, if it does not give the numpty time to react(seeing as their reaction is going to be a negative one anyway) then maybe the answer is; don't indicate (just ensure plenty of space before the manoeuvre).Good point! I guess the problem is that you don't know how the guy's going to react before you indicate. If he's one of the 9 out of 10 people that are normal and courteous, then I would like to extend him the common courtesy of indicating. I don't like being rude to people, and I see making a move like that without indicating first as rude. This is interesting, because I suppose my efforts to be polite are occasionally my downfall...
I guess the problem is that you don't know how the guy's going to react before you indicate. If he's one of the 9 out of 10 people that are normal and courteous, then I would like to extend him the common courtesy of indicating. I don't like being rude to people, and I see making a move like that without indicating first as rude. This is interesting, because I suppose my efforts to be polite are occasionally my downfall...R0G said:
General advice
Merge early if traffic is flowing freely
Merge at pinch point if traffic is crawling
Exactly my thoughts.Merge early if traffic is flowing freely
Merge at pinch point if traffic is crawling
For those of you who know the start of the A3 (going South on A3 in Roehampton) where it goes from 3 lanes to 2 lanes at the top of Roehampton Vale I had this situation.
Crawling in 3rd lane, pulled in at last minute and car blocking; angry. Car behind was a Polise Traffic car also blocking; angry. The car behind let me in no problem so now it's two lanes with Police blocker and blocker one in front of him. The Traffic Officer put his light on and signaled me to follow him to the Texaco station at the bottom of the hill. I think he could see I was not happy.
He calmly walked up to the window (2001 Cerbera 4.5 - S604 GOU - this is ph after all!) and asked me to stop swearing as he didn't want to speak to me, he wanted to "b
k" the blocker! Which was why he blocked me.....!If the road is crawling and there is a traffic merge but you choose to merge 400m before you have to; your decision. Don't try to stop me doing the obvious thing that makes sense.
RobM77 said:
As above, maybe the answer is not to indicate? I tend to think of that as even more rude though - it's doing something without asking permission or notifying others of what you're about to do.
Hard to say without being there, but with only 400 yards of road to play with before the start of the overtake, would it have been worth holding lane 2 and planning to merge as it went down to a single lane (with no indication necessary)?Chris
RobM77 said:
After four rather blissful carless days on the Scilly Isles, yesterday I drove from Exeter airport to where I live just East of Basingstoke, along the A303. The 303 has lots of situations where two lanes turn to one, and it was here I encountered and witnessed a lot of road rage, which I would rather have avoided.
What are people's thoughts on recommended approaches to these "2-1" situations? Here are stories from yesterday for the two common approaches:
1) The "pull in nice and early approach", featuring me
2) The "last minute" approach - featuring a guy in a rather nice S1 Elise. We watch the Elise attempt a last minute cut-in, and get blocked by a van which swerved from lane 1 into the dissapearing lane 2 to stop the Elise going any further.
The swerving from lane 1 out to lane 2 - if they swerve in a dangerous manner ( ie. driving in a manner which is likely to cause danger or damage to other road users or property) they should be reported as such.What are people's thoughts on recommended approaches to these "2-1" situations? Here are stories from yesterday for the two common approaches:
1) The "pull in nice and early approach", featuring me
2) The "last minute" approach - featuring a guy in a rather nice S1 Elise. We watch the Elise attempt a last minute cut-in, and get blocked by a van which swerved from lane 1 into the dissapearing lane 2 to stop the Elise going any further.
Edited by RobM77 on Wednesday 1st June 00:31
The last time this happened to me ( the person swerving out from lane 1 to lane 2 to prevent traffic from progressing to a merge in turn manuever from lane 2) I took to the soft verge with my hand on the horn and drove around them - it was close and they got a bit of a shock as it was a close call. I wonder if they had fully considered the consequences of their actions - they pulled out when I was literally on top of them travelling at about 1/2 the posted limit. Idiots.
ScoobyChris said:
RobM77 said:
As above, maybe the answer is not to indicate? I tend to think of that as even more rude though - it's doing something without asking permission or notifying others of what you're about to do.
Hard to say without being there, but with only 400 yards of road to play with before the start of the overtake, would it have been worth holding lane 2 and planning to merge as it went down to a single lane (with no indication necessary)?Chris
I admire your concern for joe public but let me tell you they wont appreciate it - christian motoring is not a widely known or accepted method.
There is a small amount of confusion in my mind as to why you are seeking advice on what is such a normal situation - you know theres always going to be somw twit who blocks you or swerves out - drive defensively - non?
ps. its completely different when rising a motorbike - no-one swerves out and they flash you in- crazy world we live in!
There is a small amount of confusion in my mind as to why you are seeking advice on what is such a normal situation - you know theres always going to be somw twit who blocks you or swerves out - drive defensively - non?
ps. its completely different when rising a motorbike - no-one swerves out and they flash you in- crazy world we live in!
RobM77 said:
Because that is often seen as rude and I was trying to avoid road rage by showing apathy towards my progress and calmly filtering in early.
I'm not sure I understand how calmly filtering in early (to show apathy), is any different to blending in later, similarly calmly, carrying similar speed and with plenty of space. In fact I'd say the latter draws less attention to you and I've certainly never encountered anyone who thought it was rude or had a bad reaction. Perhaps it could be considered rude if the reason the merge was late was because the driver was rushing into a rapidly closing gap but that's not a situation we'd be putting ourselves in...Chris
RobM77 said:
1) The "pull in nice and early approach", featuring me I was driving in lane 2 of a dual carriageway, and a "two lanes to one" sign appeared over a crest, and sure enough, about 400 yards ahead you could see the road doing just that. So, I overtake the next car as planned, bringing me alongside quite a sizeable and safe gap in lane 1, where I flick on my indicator ready to move back to lane one. Whilst I'm still in lane 2, the chap in lane one then accelerates up my inside, blocking my move and flashing his lights at me. The chap behind him isn't really leaving a big enough gap for me to accept an undertake and slot in behind, and the original gap I was going for is still quite large and safe, so (still indicating) I give the car a quick burst of power, and then when up ahead in the safe gap again, I pull in and cancel the indicator. This guy then catches up and comes right up behind me doing the full sign language routine, main beam, the lot. Now, what's interesting is that at the next 2-1, a car comes storming up lane two and slots in front of this aggravated guy behind me, except that he does it at the very last minute and into a tiny gap, cutting over a white hashed area in the process, but strangely without any protest from Mr Angry at all. Is this inferring he would have rather I moved back in at the last minute than conscientiously early? I'd like to know, as my aim is to fit in with everyone as well as possible.
2) The "last minute" approach - featuring a guy in a rather nice S1 Elise. We watch the Elise attempt a last minute cut-in, and get blocked by a van which swerved from lane 1 into the dissapearing lane 2 to stop the Elise going any
Oh how I love the A303!! I was driving in lane 2 of a dual carriageway, and a "two lanes to one" sign appeared over a crest, and sure enough, about 400 yards ahead you could see the road doing just that. So, I overtake the next car as planned, bringing me alongside quite a sizeable and safe gap in lane 1, where I flick on my indicator ready to move back to lane one. Whilst I'm still in lane 2, the chap in lane one then accelerates up my inside, blocking my move and flashing his lights at me. The chap behind him isn't really leaving a big enough gap for me to accept an undertake and slot in behind, and the original gap I was going for is still quite large and safe, so (still indicating) I give the car a quick burst of power, and then when up ahead in the safe gap again, I pull in and cancel the indicator. This guy then catches up and comes right up behind me doing the full sign language routine, main beam, the lot. Now, what's interesting is that at the next 2-1, a car comes storming up lane two and slots in front of this aggravated guy behind me, except that he does it at the very last minute and into a tiny gap, cutting over a white hashed area in the process, but strangely without any protest from Mr Angry at all. Is this inferring he would have rather I moved back in at the last minute than conscientiously early? I'd like to know, as my aim is to fit in with everyone as well as possible.2) The "last minute" approach - featuring a guy in a rather nice S1 Elise. We watch the Elise attempt a last minute cut-in, and get blocked by a van which swerved from lane 1 into the dissapearing lane 2 to stop the Elise going any
Edited by RobM77 on Wednesday 1st June 00:31
I have found that the merge in a road is a classic example of how improved observation can benefit the driver.
On the approach to the merge if the traffic is flowing I will observe the cars in the left-hand lane. Take into account gap sizes (which gaps are growing or shrinking) and the make, model and driving style of the cars.
This allows me to identify:
1. If the driving style of the car leads me to believe that they will let me slot into the gap in-front.
2. If if my car is significantly more powerful and I can simply out accelerate them into an opening gap without causing annoyance or alarm.
3. If the driving of the car leads me to believe that he will try to be difficult and acceleration to fill a gap in front, which will leave a gap behind to slot in.
If traffic is slow moving then I pick a likely candidate in the left hand lane and position my car parallel to the gap between the 2 cars in the left hand lane with my indicator on. This makes my intention 100% clear.
HTH
Jay
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