Head Pictures

[Ryan Griffiths]

Hi All

Im currently looking to fit a Cam sensor to a few Speed Six Engines to enable them to run Sequential Injection instead of batch as standard.

Was wondering if any owners or traders have any pics of the Head from above without the Cam cover on but with the cam chain cover on. Currently looking at fitting one at the front of the cam cover and using a pretuding cam gear bolt as a reference. But want to see how much room i have.

Anyone done this before? Would be such a good improvement with the correct management system, espically for fuel consumption!

Having 6 injectors driven of 2 injector drivers is Crazy! No wonder the injectors get too hot as standard and they drink fuel!.

Thanks

Ryan

[plasticman]

Hi Ryan , I do not have a photo to hand but am sure there is the space for a longer bolt to protrude . It would possibly be easier to put the sensor in the cam cover as the front cover is not easily removed . Can you please explain your last sentence , thanks David

[Ryan Griffiths]

Yes will be placing in the top cam cover like shown below



Then will work like this





The injector setup on the Speed six is as standard wired so that injectors 1,2,3 are on one injector driver and 4,5,6 are on another. This is called batched injection and is done when no (reference) cam sensor is present. What happens is when say cylinder number 1 injector is fired in the firing order so is injectors 2 and 3. Same for cylinder 4,5 and 6. Lots of fuel is wasted and the injectors are run 3 times as much causing them to get hot and cause lean spots.

I understand standard speed six injectors are renowned for going lean randomly at high rpm.

Running them as Sequential mean each injector is driven of its own injector driver and only fired when requested by the ecu based on firing order.

Ryan

[Don1]

Ryan, are you in any way connected with Australia? Strange question, I know. PM me if you want to keep this off the board.

[Ryan Griffiths]

Random question!

Been over there mapping for the last month if thats "connected" lol

[dvs_dave]

Can this information not be derived from the existing crank position sensor?

Racing Green already do a plug and play Omex 710 kit and loom including idle control kit, which whilst pricey, may be of interest to you? I believe that this kit does sequential injection.

[plasticman]

I understand what batch injector timing means (I think) In the four stroke cycle the bank is opened once for a time controlled by the ecu . I know this is slightly wasteful of fuel compared to sequential and have not heard of anybody gaining power by using it (over batch/bank)

[Ryan Griffiths]

dvs_dave said:

Can this information not be derived from the existing crank position sensor?

Racing Green already do a plug and play Omex 710 kit and loom including idle control kit, which whilst pricey, may be of interest to you? I believe that this kit does sequential injection.

Crank sensor alone wont allow Sequential

Omex kits for the Tuscan do not run sequential Injection. Trust me i map them for RG

[Ryan Griffiths]

plasticman said:

I understand what batch injector timing means (I think) In the four stroke cycle the bank is opened once for a time controlled by the ecu . I know this is slightly wasteful of fuel compared to sequential and have not heard of anybody gaining power by using it (over batch/bank)

Im more doing it to stop the injector cooking and for better MPG but will see if it gains any power as have full use of a dyno when ever i want. I have a feeling it will gain some.

Ryan

[plasticman]

OK , fair enough , but I still do not understand how there would be any change to the frequency of the injector opening , just a marginal change in duration . Thanks , David

[dvs_dave]

Interesting stuff. Now that Speed 6 mechanical durability is sorted, better engine management is the next logical upgrade.

So with batch injection, do all the
injectors for a given set of cylinders fire whenever only one of those cylinders is actually on it's intake stroke? Does that mean that for much of the time the injectors are firing fuel into a closed cylinder inlet port? That does seem pretty bonkers and a very crude way of doing things.

I'd also like to understand why seqential injection can't work from the crank position sensor? The ecu knows when to fire each bank of injectors and also when to fire the relevant spark plug, so why not the injectors individually?

Edited by dvs_dave on Saturday 11th September 09:07

[plasticman]

Yes , injectors on the first three cylinders are all triggered at the same time and on the second revolution the back three . As the four stroke cycle takes two revolutions of the crank a cam sensor is required to tell the ecu as it runs at half engine speed .

[plasticman]

Just taken a pic of my spare engine

[dvs_dave]

Another couple of pics I found that may be of interest

[Ryan Griffiths]

Perfect thanks guys!

Will keep you updated and upload some pics of the install in a few weeks time.

Also will pop a thread up with the traction control install and setup.

The Syvecs Ecu I'm popping on the car is going to transform it with the resolution it has. You guys are welcome to pop down the Dyno and test track to experience the traction control afterwards

Ryan

[dvs_dave]

plasticman said:

As the four stroke cycle takes two revolutions of the crank a cam sensor is required to tell the ecu as it runs at half engine speed .

The spark plugs are fired sequentially without the aid of a cam position sensor, so why can't the same be done with the injectors?

[dvs_dave]

Ryan Griffiths said:

Perfect thanks guys!

Will keep you updated and upload some pics of the install in a few weeks time.

Also will pop a thread up with the traction control install and setup.

The Syvecs Ecu I'm popping on the car is going to transform it with the resolution it has. You guys are welcome to pop down the Dyno and test track to experience the traction control afterwards

Ryan

Excellent.....I'll be watching closely. So aside from the sequential injection and TC, what other functionality are you hoping to incorporate? Idle and warm-up control as well as knock sensing would be great features to add. I'm sure you know the Speed 6 is prone to knock/detonation, especially from cylinder 6.

[DonkeyApple]

Sadly this will never sell as I fear that removing all that excess fuel will mean the car no longer pops and bangs.

[Don1]

Ryan Griffiths said:

Random question!

Been over there mapping for the last month if thats "connected" lol

Gotcha - know you you are now! RG were singing your praises, that's all.

[dpd3047]

Sequential injection will help emissions and smother running it will not make any more top end power.