How many FFF's ?
Discussion
DonkeyApple said:
PascalBuyens said:
truck71 said:
£17k (gulp)or 17000 miles?
That'll be 17k miles in Lee's case...
DonkeyApple said:
What's the power output of a 4L FFF v a 4.3 Power engine?
That's an odd request bearing in mind:tail slide said:
If you speak to the builders/designer of them, the LM engines relied on the excellent design of finger followers to provide very high valve lift with large overlap, to give good power at very high revs (as used in all the hi-po bike engines). That enabled a cam profile to be used that wasn't so peaky it would wear out in a few hundred miles.
The FFF design - and remember that TVR designed this in-house themselves to de-tune the Speed 12 to a level where it would last race distance - can't be engineered to produce nearly as much valve lift, and therefore can't possibly produce the same power as a finger-follower engine to the same spec.
4L FFF v 4L Power would be of passing interest.The FFF design - and remember that TVR designed this in-house themselves to de-tune the Speed 12 to a level where it would last race distance - can't be engineered to produce nearly as much valve lift, and therefore can't possibly produce the same power as a finger-follower engine to the same spec.
JR said:
DonkeyApple said:
PascalBuyens said:
truck71 said:
£17k (gulp)or 17000 miles?
That'll be 17k miles in Lee's case...DonkeyApple said:
What's the power output of a 4L FFF v a 4.3 Power engine?
That's an odd request bearing in mind:tail slide said:
If you speak to the builders/designer of them, the LM engines relied on the excellent design of finger followers to provide very high valve lift with large overlap, to give good power at very high revs (as used in all the hi-po bike engines). That enabled a cam profile to be used that wasn't so peaky it would wear out in a few hundred miles.
The FFF design - and remember that TVR designed this in-house themselves to de-tune the Speed 12 to a level where it would last race distance - can't be engineered to produce nearly as much valve lift, and therefore can't possibly produce the same power as a finger-follower engine to the same spec.
4L FFF v 4L Power would be of passing interest.The FFF design - and remember that TVR designed this in-house themselves to de-tune the Speed 12 to a level where it would last race distance - can't be engineered to produce nearly as much valve lift, and therefore can't possibly produce the same power as a finger-follower engine to the same spec.
Re 4l fff v 4.3 Power, I think it is fair to compare them as both companies are promoting them as noteable enhancements from the standard s6 for both reliability and power.
Both are alledgedly over 400bhp and both seem to have good followings on here.
It would be interesting to get some actual numbers to back up all the talk. Otherwise it leaves you to only assume the worst regards why everyone is keeping quiet.
DonkeyApple said:
JR said:
DonkeyApple said:
PascalBuyens said:
truck71 said:
£17k (gulp)or 17000 miles?
That'll be 17k miles in Lee's case...DonkeyApple said:
What's the power output of a 4L FFF v a 4.3 Power engine?
That's an odd request bearing in mind:tail slide said:
If you speak to the builders/designer of them, the LM engines relied on the excellent design of finger followers to provide very high valve lift with large overlap, to give good power at very high revs (as used in all the hi-po bike engines). That enabled a cam profile to be used that wasn't so peaky it would wear out in a few hundred miles.
The FFF design - and remember that TVR designed this in-house themselves to de-tune the Speed 12 to a level where it would last race distance - can't be engineered to produce nearly as much valve lift, and therefore can't possibly produce the same power as a finger-follower engine to the same spec.
4L FFF v 4L Power would be of passing interest.The FFF design - and remember that TVR designed this in-house themselves to de-tune the Speed 12 to a level where it would last race distance - can't be engineered to produce nearly as much valve lift, and therefore can't possibly produce the same power as a finger-follower engine to the same spec.
Re 4l fff v 4.3 Power, I think it is fair to compare them as both companies are promoting them as noteable enhancements from the standard s6 for both reliability and power.
Both are alledgedly over 400bhp and both seem to have good followings on here.
It would be interesting to get some actual numbers to back up all the talk. Otherwise it leaves you to only assume the worst regards why everyone is keeping quiet.
Yeah, sorry - 17k MILES!
One of the FFF owners had his measured at about 406bhp on an independent RR (SRR maybe?).
Be good to see a 4.3 and a FFF on an independent Rolling Road back to back just for the sake of interest.
And of course my abortive attempt to organise a track/airfield day where we could try them against each other in a more real-world comparison...
One of the FFF owners had his measured at about 406bhp on an independent RR (SRR maybe?).
Be good to see a 4.3 and a FFF on an independent Rolling Road back to back just for the sake of interest.
And of course my abortive attempt to organise a track/airfield day where we could try them against each other in a more real-world comparison...
Not sure about the comparison of costs, as my build also included a fair few additional bits such as new clutch, lightened fly wheel, new exhaust manifolds...... and I can't remember the itemisation (working away from home). I guess you'd have to check the website or call them for the actual cost of the FFF upgrade.
No hidden extras as far as I know. I just chose to have some other stuff done at the same time.
I just checked their website but couldn't see a standard price; however, they have further refined the head so maybe they are waiting for costs to be finalised.
As and when I get mine on the RR I'll publish my figures, but check with RG as they have had one customer car checked (400+bhp) and I saw the map of the demo which was at 392bhp. Not sure about torque though.
I just checked their website but couldn't see a standard price; however, they have further refined the head so maybe they are waiting for costs to be finalised.
As and when I get mine on the RR I'll publish my figures, but check with RG as they have had one customer car checked (400+bhp) and I saw the map of the demo which was at 392bhp. Not sure about torque though.
Someone please correct me if i'm wrong but to summarise on the power front:
The RG FFF engine made 392bhp (flywheel), TVR Powers 4.3 made 390 at the wheels and Str8six's 4.3 made 411 at the wheels. Both 4.3's were tested on the same dyno, the RG FFF on SRR ?.
Bangs for bucks:
Powers 4.3 £6.5k plus VAT
STR8Six 4.3 ??? but possibly a bit more
RG's FFF 4.0 I seem to remember £9k being mooted (not sure if this was VAT inclusive or not)
Conclusion ? it looks like the 4.3's make the same or more power at the wheels as the RG FFF does at the flywheel for probably less money. Power's 4.3 comes with a 5 year warranty, not sure about STR8Six or RG.
I would say it's a no-brainer on paper !
The RG FFF engine made 392bhp (flywheel), TVR Powers 4.3 made 390 at the wheels and Str8six's 4.3 made 411 at the wheels. Both 4.3's were tested on the same dyno, the RG FFF on SRR ?.
Bangs for bucks:
Powers 4.3 £6.5k plus VAT
STR8Six 4.3 ??? but possibly a bit more
RG's FFF 4.0 I seem to remember £9k being mooted (not sure if this was VAT inclusive or not)
Conclusion ? it looks like the 4.3's make the same or more power at the wheels as the RG FFF does at the flywheel for probably less money. Power's 4.3 comes with a 5 year warranty, not sure about STR8Six or RG.
I would say it's a no-brainer on paper !
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