Speed 6 Q's

[Silver29]

Right guys/gals, some advise please.

I'm contemplating buying a T350 but am concerned about the speed 6 engine. From what research I’ve done many seem to have had a complete engine rebuild around 20k ish. Is this common for all T350’s or particularly the early ones?

I’d be looking at spending around 20k (maybe a bit more) which seems to get an early model. Is it wise to look for one which has already had an engine rebuild?

What sort of price is a re-build?

Are there any companies that you can purchase a good TVR warranty with?

All advice appreciated.

[Ryder35]

Went through the same agonies as you before I bought mine about 3 weeks ago. I picked up a very nice 05 plate with 13K on the clock for £21k ish so don't think you have to limit your search to older cars. The concensus seems to be that 05 onwards are the best engines as improvements were made in 2004. If a car has had a rebuils since then the improvements will have been included in the rebuild.

Buying an older can that has been loved by some of the users on here should not be too much worry.

Rebuilds can be up to £6k AFAIK s warrenty is a great idea (mine has a 3 year werar and tear warrenty, Racing Green supplied the warranty originally and it can be added to the car if it passes the inspection and is not too old.

My advice is buy the best you can afford but make sure you are covered if it does go bang. It is a great car and talk of rebuilds skews the reliability unfairly IMHO.

[grumbledoak]

Very variable on the engines, and how they have been treated. General concensus seems to be that post 2004 most of the issues were ironed out, but I guess you can still be unlucky. £6k every five years is about what a warranty will cost you, so you pays your money and makes your choice!

I'd expect a clutch at 20k miles, mind, though seemingly better replacements are available.

[J_S_G]

Silver29 said:

Right guys/gals, some advise please.

I'm contemplating buying a T350 but am concerned about the speed 6 engine. From what research I’ve done many seem to have had a complete engine rebuild around 20k ish. Is this common for all T350’s or particularly the early ones?

I’d be looking at spending around 20k (maybe a bit more) which seems to get an early model. Is it wise to look for one which has already had an engine rebuild?

What sort of price is a re-build?

Are there any companies that you can purchase a good TVR warranty with?

All advice appreciated.

Early Speed 6s had finger follower problems. Resulted in VERY high rebuild rates, usually at significantly less than 20,000 miles. (Some great stories of cars making it no further than off the back of the delivery truck)
Many that got rebuilt then needed a second rebuild at around 20,000 as the valve guides wore out.

That's largely pre mid-2002 stuff - doesn't really affect T350s, unless they happened to be built with an old engine lying around the factory.

Later engines - especially the less stressed 3.6s suffer a lot less. Lots will still have rebuilds, though, at mileages you'd not consider "normal" for any other car. 20,000 miles on a 2003 onwards factory-engined(original engine build) isn't unexpected - things like half time bearings, etc. You'll see less of the rebuilds on much newer ones - there were ongoing tweaks at the factory (some of the things just weren't REALLY addressed, though), and the newer ones are at lower mileages in general so hence would never show the same numbers yet. They are all a lot, LOT better than earlier ones, though.

One rebuilt now/relatively recently at that mileage should then be fine for a good long time.

Rebuilds will cost you anything from £4-5k upwards. Depends what's gone wrong to some extent - whether it's top end/bottom end/both, etc. TVR Power is a very good benchmark, with a breakdown of standard things done (http://www.tvrpower.co.uk/sp6.rebuild.php). £6,500.

I'd personally get one that had just been rebuilt. Period. Others will argue that their engines are absolutely fine. Impossible to say who's right/wrong on any given engine... But the chances of one rebuilt more recently one lasting into old age have got to be better than an older engine. I've paid for several rebuilds on Tuscans/T350/etc, so I know the pain of it all!

Warranties: yep, you can get some to help cover for this stuff. You can buy many of them direct as a consumer, couple of others the garage will need to do an inspection for. These are all particularly expensive, though. (~£1500 a year for the one I'd previously have recommended) The "better" warranties there generally won't fly on a car more than 5 years old. Buy a car with a rebuilt engine and you'll almost always get a warranty on it, though, saving that bill entirely.

That's the impartial bit. The self-serving bit: mine's for sale in the ads, having just come back from TVR Power last week with an engine rebuild, and under £20k...

[J_S_G]

grumbledoak said:

I'd expect a clutch at 20k miles, mind, though seemingly better replacements are available.

Like clockwork.

Radiators are quite common on the T350, too...

[Silver29]

Thanks for the help guys. I'm jumping from a nice reliable german engineered TT to a Tivver but I'll be going in with eyes wide open and fingers crossed!

JSG, I had seen yours in the classifieds, stunning car. Clearly well loved, I'm sure it'll be a painful split! I may well be in touch.

[Ryder35]

J_S_G said:

That's the impartial bit. The self-serving bit: mine's for sale in the ads, having just come back from TVR Power last week with an engine rebuild, and under £20k...

I have to say that one would be high on my list had I not just bought. Very nice spec and obviously obsessively looked after. When you go to look at a TVR I would look for signs of OCD in the owner!

[J_S_G]

Ryder35 said:

When you go to look at a TVR I would look for signs of OCD in the owner!

It's the one time in life that kind of obsessive behaviour is acceptable! Probably not healthy, though...

It's an odd one with TVRs and lots of other similar cars; there's so much luck of the draw whether you're hit with bills or have trouble free motoring when you buy one, regardless of how well maintained they are. Always feels like fate decides whether to reward or punish you and all you can do is minimise the chances of the potential horrors.

Could say the same about non-niche cars, I guess - had both the multitronic gearbox and cams fail on a few years old, not-many-miles, well maintained diesel Audi back in Spring, just a couple of weeks in to ownership... £8,500 work needed.

[ajg31]

Having not owned a tiv (but owned a Noble that required a rebuild 2 weeks into ownership) before i would just like to say that i would look to buy a rebuilt one too. You KNOW at some point she IS going to pop. Let the last owner take the sting and have some "free" motoring
The one posted above looks fantastic for the cash, if only i was in the uk i would be sorely tempted (i do have my heart set on a white 350 tho)...

[J_S_G]

ajg31 said:

Having not owned a tiv (but owned a Noble that required a rebuild 2 weeks into ownership) before i would just like to say that i would look to buy a rebuilt one too. You KNOW at some point she IS going to pop. Let the last owner take the sting and have some "free" motoring
The one posted above looks fantastic for the cash, if only i was in the uk i would be sorely tempted (i do have my heart set on a white 350 tho)...

RESPRAY!

Hmmm... white would need pure black, pure white, or pure blood-red interior, though?

(In all seriousness, given the low number of cars, lower number of good cars, and even lower number of white cars - a respray might well be your only option for that - would look AMAZING, though...)

[ajg31]

JSG, all pie in the sky for me mate as i am in Australia working as a fitter. Zero chance of my buying a toy for many years. There was a white 350 for sale by SSCC about a month ago. Think it was overpriced in this climate. Can't remember the interior tho, think it was off white and blue? From what you have written about yours, i would say its undervalued so good luck with the sale. Someone is getting a winter toy for next to nothing

Edited by ajg31 on Friday 2nd January 10:18

[Snakes]

If I were in your shoes I'd seriously consider this car as it looks as though it has had all the work done, is being sold by a fastidious TVR-nut!

[J_S_G]

ajg31 said:

JSG, all pie in the sky for me mate as i am in Australia working as a fitter. Zero chance of my buying a toy for many years. There was a white 350 for sale by SSCC about a month ago. Think it was overpriced in this climate. Can't remember the interior tho, think it was off white and blue?

I think a certain Tuscan owning PHer is about to move to Aus and ship his car with him in the next couple of months. Might be worth buying him a drink for a play in it...

[J_S_G]

Snakes said:

If I were in your shoes I'd seriously consider this car as it looks as though it has had all the work done, is being sold by a fastidious TVR-nut!

/grin/ Thanks.

Edited by J_S_G on Friday 2nd January 11:52

[ajg31]

J_S_G said:

ajg31 said:

JSG, all pie in the sky for me mate as i am in Australia working as a fitter. Zero chance of my buying a toy for many years. There was a white 350 for sale by SSCC about a month ago. Think it was overpriced in this climate. Can't remember the interior tho, think it was off white and blue?

I think a certain Tuscan owning PHer is about to move to Aus and ship his car with him in the next couple of months. Might be worth buying him a drink for a play in it...

Jeez, is it that cheap to get a ride in a canoe these days? LOL. Dont suppose you know which part. Not like the UK, i am 2-3000km to the next nearest city!

[Zippee]

Theres a lot of people on here stating only buy one with a rebuild. I don't know figures but when looking for mine I saw only 1 T350 for sale with an advertised rebuild and that was a very early 2002 model. It seemed to me there are very few 350s that have had this done??

I also saw a number of 2003 models for sale with 25-30k on the clock and no rebuild - possibly coming up to that point but who knows.
I was told late 04 on were the better engines but again believe this is not an exact science.

[Bellyj43]

2003 T350. 26,000 miles, Same Clutch, No rebuilds, 20 ish Track days, fingers still crossed.
Don't go above 2,500-3,000 rpm til the oil temp is around 60. Happy Days

[J_S_G]

Zippee said:

Theres a lot of people on here stating only buy one with a rebuild. I don't know figures but when looking for mine I saw only 1 T350 for sale with an advertised rebuild and that was a very early 2002 model. It seemed to me there are very few 350s that have had this done??

I also saw a number of 2003 models for sale with 25-30k on the clock and no rebuild - possibly coming up to that point but who knows.
I was told late 04 on were the better engines but again believe this is not an exact science.

The later the engine/the later the rebuild, the more that's likely to have sorted on it. The problem with buying, say, a 2004 car is that it could well have a significantly earlier engine in it depending on what was lying around in the factory.

As for problems/rectifications of these on new engines - the followers were a lot tougher as of mid '02 to compensate (but the fundamental design issue's still there), the valve guides were sorted around the same time... but that still does leave some quite common problems. Good example would be the half time bearings. Much more variable on mileage; mine went at just over 20k miles, other last into the 30s, etc.

It's just not a "common" enough engine to know what all the faults are going to be from the small sample size of higher mileage cars. The best thing about the rebuilds is that it generally means that you've got a warranty on it for a good couple of years, whatever goes wrong. Second best thing is then that you know it has been pulled apart, looked at, and at least the weakest/worst components replaced... it is just a bit of a gamble otherwise, even on cars that have been *impeccably* looked after. Nothing to say you wouldn't have an utterly trouble free engine... but having had cars Tivs off the road for almost 9 months whilst queueing for new engines, and written cheques for five figure sums in total for the engines, I'd certainly not risk that again!

[TVR_owner]

J_S_G said:

The later the engine/the later the rebuild, the more that's likely to have sorted on it. The problem with buying, say, a 2004 car is that it could well have a significantly earlier engine in it depending on what was lying around in the factory.

If it's a 2004 built car there is no way it would have a significantly earlier engine. TVR went through a long period towards the end of 2003 where they had no engines at all - not even the lying around type...
2004 onward, blocks and heads were cast by a different supplier that needed to be found quickly as the previous supplier cut off supply (nothing to do with unpaid bills either).

Be carefull also with the sweeeping statement that the later the rebuild the better sorted it is. There have been the odd rebuilds (and they are small in number) that are train wrecks too - something I'm afraid is a consequence of folk jumping on band wagons, and not having appropriate levels of QA.

[macdeb]

First, I love these cars, I did have one. As for rebuilds, a guy in the club had a late low miles 04 car and had THREE rebuilds the last of which only went as far as the running in period. Another 3.6 Tuscan went similar ways. I think JSG has given a fairly honest view of things. [and his car certainly looks the biz' and I still find myself looking at it] I only had mine for a few months and really miss it still, but, at the time the depreciation was horrendous, the service from the factory was appalling and with a few around me failing I was almost scared to drive it. Add to this the fact I needed to raise some money at the time I had to let it go. BUT I STILL MISS IT! Would I have another? Yeh, probably would and I envy those getting them. Weird. IF I were in the market for one, then something like 'JSG's would be high on my list.

Edited by macdeb on Sunday 4th January 13:25