Supercharged Speed6
Discussion
Have read posts on here about supercharging projects going horribly wrong, tens of thousands of pounds down the drain and TVR specialist failing to sort them out
without getting into the who, when, and how much.
Is there an inherent engineering problem with a forced induction on a speed6
without getting into the who, when, and how much.
Is there an inherent engineering problem with a forced induction on a speed6
Str8 six have done it with a sagaris.
Who's is this tuscan, which would appear to be charged aswell
http://www.autoenginelube.com/satisfiedcustomers/2...
Who's is this tuscan, which would appear to be charged aswell
http://www.autoenginelube.com/satisfiedcustomers/2...
m4tti said:
Who's is this tuscan, which would appear to be charged aswell
http://www.autoenginelube.com/satisfiedcustomers/2...
yzf1070 said:
m4tti said:
Who's is this tuscan, which would appear to be charged aswell
http://www.autoenginelube.com/satisfiedcustomers/2...
Out of interest (apart from the running issues) when it was running did the charger make for a quick car?
There's no reason why a forced induction sp6 shouldn't work, just that some people were promised sky high power levels instead of something realistic. A 450bhp tuscan should be fine (ie 90-100 up on std) .. but 600 hp or similar? That would be a big jump. When people talk of forced air they automatically think it's going to be skyline levels of hp .. whereas in reality a 100hp increase would be a useful performance boost and not cause too many problems? Is it just a case of people wanting / expecting / being promised too much?
m4tti said:
Aha interesting! Did you fit the auto engine lube pre oiler to the 4.5
Out of interest (apart from the running issues) when it was running did the charger make for a quick car?
If the autolube was actually needed I am sure TVR Power would fit one on the 4.5, they didn't and therefore neither will I, besides it would possibly void Power's very generous warranty.Out of interest (apart from the running issues) when it was running did the charger make for a quick car?
The car was exceptionally fast with the charger fitted.... The brief 1000 or so post run in miles I did in it. Long story, but I sent it back to the outfit that did the Emerald ECU, to fit a Lynk G4 Extreme ECU and set that up. That's where I believe the terminal damage was done, only my guess but I think they may have cooked it on the dyno. I was as usual away overseas at the time and the car was transported back home and sat in the garage. A year later I return to a car running rough as a badgers ass... from start up. After a couple days trying this that n the other I did a comp test and discover the engine was goosed. Was only home for 10 days so couldn't do much about it. No wonga either, totally skint due to a house build overseas, so it sat for a couple years (time for me to eventually come to my senses), before it was sent to TVR Power.
In 2 weeks I will be able to compare the 4.5 performance to what I recall the charger was like. I do not expect the same, but from what I have read on here the 4.5 engine has superb low down torque. I can't remember exact figures but I am sure the charger did not make any difference until around 3K rpm, but thereafter it was fun...... briefly
spitfire4v8 said:
There's no reason why a forced induction sp6 shouldn't work, just that some people were promised sky high power levels instead of something realistic. A 450bhp tuscan should be fine (ie 90-100 up on std) .. but 600 hp or similar? That would be a big jump. When people talk of forced air they automatically think it's going to be skyline levels of hp .. whereas in reality a 100hp increase would be a useful performance boost and not cause too many problems? Is it just a case of people wanting / expecting / being promised too much?
To go into numbers, IIRC Graham's SC engine got 491hp, with a finger follower engine.The attempt that was made on mine, with amongst other issues, the supercharger belt slipping, managed 483hp on what was told to me "low boost" (deliberately not being told how much until I picked it up unfinished to "run it in" in July 2010). The fact that something popped in the engine within a few 100 miles (supposedly "a shim jumped out of a bucket", which to me sounds nigh impossible) would suggest to me that there is something not ok with the whole piss poor attempt they call an "engine rebuild".
Also, with the company involved claiming to achieve 475hp on their demo and customer cars with 440hp with a "more driveable tune" out of a NA engine, I think 483hp isn't a huge improvement when using a supercharger, especially with over 25k spent for a few hp. Hence why they proposed to swap the thing for a turbocharger, again with the promise of a "realistic 650hp" from that setup. At which point half of my car got butchered for the trial fitment of the exhaust (as could be seen on the pictures form another thread that magically disappeared again). I have repeatedly expressed my concerns to said company with an UPwards going exhaust manifold too for that turbo setup before announcing them I was pulling the plug on the whole mishap. November 2012 btw, exactly one year after being told about their "turbocharged solution".
Anyway, don't want to say too much too, or this thread will get taken down AGAIN... as they've asked to do with every other thread that shows any negative comment. My turn'll come, rest assured, and I'll be taking down more than a thread on a public forum.
Edited by PascalBuyens on Friday 4th October 09:48
Edited by PascalBuyens on Friday 4th October 09:51
yzf1070 said:
m4tti said:
Aha interesting! Did you fit the auto engine lube pre oiler to the 4.5
Out of interest (apart from the running issues) when it was running did the charger make for a quick car?
If the autolube was actually needed I am sure TVR Power would fit one on the 4.5, they didn't and therefore neither will I, besides it would possibly void Power's very generous warranty. Out of interest (apart from the running issues) when it was running did the charger make for a quick car?
The sheer number of successful rebuilds by Dom & Jason proves that if the correct quality parts are used the oil feeds are perfectly adequate & the finger follower design is fine imo..
Jason built a S/C Speed6 for his very own Sagaris. Believe it has 500bhp+ in safe levels of tune, but he spent thousands ensuring he engineered out overheating issues etc... Its a lovely piece of engineering but don't ask him to make you one
Jason built a S/C Speed6 for his very own Sagaris. Believe it has 500bhp+ in safe levels of tune, but he spent thousands ensuring he engineered out overheating issues etc... Its a lovely piece of engineering but don't ask him to make you one
RedSpike66 said:
The sheer number of successful rebuilds by Dom & Jason proves that if the correct quality parts are used the oil feeds are perfectly adequate & the finger follower design is fine imo..
Jason built a S/C Speed6 for his very own Sagaris. Believe it has 500bhp+ in safe levels of tune, but he spent thousands ensuring he engineered out overheating issues etc... Its a lovely piece of engineering but don't ask him to make you one
That engine was originally meant for a customer who pulled the plug after 18 months. I believe it is fair to say Jason stepped up and did the right thing towards that customer, instead of asking more money for delivering nothing.Jason built a S/C Speed6 for his very own Sagaris. Believe it has 500bhp+ in safe levels of tune, but he spent thousands ensuring he engineered out overheating issues etc... Its a lovely piece of engineering but don't ask him to make you one
It is reading threads like this that makes you think the LS route is the only sensible choice.
What is the point of spending 25k+ trying to achieve 500bhp+ from a speed 6 which may go pop within a few thousand miles when you can drop in a crate 525hp LS3 with a 2 year warranty. You also have the option of making serious hp is that's your thing from the LS engine with relatively little cost.
I realise this is the speed 6 engine forum so I expect a good flaming.
What is the point of spending 25k+ trying to achieve 500bhp+ from a speed 6 which may go pop within a few thousand miles when you can drop in a crate 525hp LS3 with a 2 year warranty. You also have the option of making serious hp is that's your thing from the LS engine with relatively little cost.
I realise this is the speed 6 engine forum so I expect a good flaming.
PascalBuyens said:
RedSpike66 said:
The sheer number of successful rebuilds by Dom & Jason proves that if the correct quality parts are used the oil feeds are perfectly adequate & the finger follower design is fine imo..
Jason built a S/C Speed6 for his very own Sagaris. Believe it has 500bhp+ in safe levels of tune, but he spent thousands ensuring he engineered out overheating issues etc... Its a lovely piece of engineering but don't ask him to make you one
That engine was originally meant for a customer who pulled the plug after 18 months. I believe it is fair to say Jason stepped up and did the right thing towards that customer, instead of asking more money for delivering nothing.Jason built a S/C Speed6 for his very own Sagaris. Believe it has 500bhp+ in safe levels of tune, but he spent thousands ensuring he engineered out overheating issues etc... Its a lovely piece of engineering but don't ask him to make you one
In my conversations with Lawrence Tomlinson he has stated several times that a Speed 6 is incapable of producing anything more than 440bhp reliably without the engine failing.
Now before anyone shoots me down in flames saying their engine produces that or even more power, he is clearly talking about racing and running the engine hard and up against the limiter for extended periods.
However, I would suggest that with his extensive investment and knowledge in the Speed 6 he's going to be correct about the inherent failings of the engine at it's limits and so I'd suggest that attempting to produce an engine that produces high 400's,500 or 600 BHP is going to fail even in road use conditions as the engine just cannot cope.
Now before anyone shoots me down in flames saying their engine produces that or even more power, he is clearly talking about racing and running the engine hard and up against the limiter for extended periods.
However, I would suggest that with his extensive investment and knowledge in the Speed 6 he's going to be correct about the inherent failings of the engine at it's limits and so I'd suggest that attempting to produce an engine that produces high 400's,500 or 600 BHP is going to fail even in road use conditions as the engine just cannot cope.
TimJM said:
It is reading threads like this that makes you think the LS route is the only sensible choice.
What is the point of spending 25k+ trying to achieve 500bhp+ from a speed 6 which may go pop within a few thousand miles when you can drop in a crate 525hp LS3 with a 2 year warranty. You also have the option of making serious hp is that's your thing from the LS engine with relatively little cost.
I realise this is the speed 6 engine forum so I expect a good flaming.
Because at full chat a speed six sounds like the devil breathing, you just don't get that outside of ferraris/flatplane crank motors. What is the point of spending 25k+ trying to achieve 500bhp+ from a speed 6 which may go pop within a few thousand miles when you can drop in a crate 525hp LS3 with a 2 year warranty. You also have the option of making serious hp is that's your thing from the LS engine with relatively little cost.
I realise this is the speed 6 engine forum so I expect a good flaming.
Conversely I don't really get the LS thing. Chuck it in an ultima an harness the power properly.
V8 GRF said:
In my conversations with Lawrence Tomlinson he has stated several times that a Speed 6 is incapable of producing anything more than 440bhp reliably without the engine failing.
Now before anyone shoots me down in flames saying their engine produces that or even more power, he is clearly talking about racing and running the engine hard and up against the limiter for extended periods.
However, I would suggest that with his extensive investment and knowledge in the Speed 6 he's going to be correct about the inherent failings of the engine at it's limits and so I'd suggest that attempting to produce an engine that produces high 400's,500 or 600 BHP is going to fail even in road use conditions as the engine just cannot cope.
I would think the speed six engine has come along way in terms of development/reliability since he raced one.Now before anyone shoots me down in flames saying their engine produces that or even more power, he is clearly talking about racing and running the engine hard and up against the limiter for extended periods.
However, I would suggest that with his extensive investment and knowledge in the Speed 6 he's going to be correct about the inherent failings of the engine at it's limits and so I'd suggest that attempting to produce an engine that produces high 400's,500 or 600 BHP is going to fail even in road use conditions as the engine just cannot cope.
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