Rebuild Time - Power or Str8Six
Discussion
It's looking like the time has finally come for my long overdue rebuild. I'm torn between a 4.3/4.5 or an LSx conversion (not DIY, probably TopCats I guess).
One thing I need to look into but haven't found any threads on - what are the relative merits of Power v Str8Six. Why choose one over the other? On the face of it Dom looks to be cheaper, but then Jason's quoted price of £10.5k+VAT on the website includes a new block.
It may well be as simple as the price is roughly the same (I believe the components are all from Power anyway) and it is a case of going with who you are happy with.
I would be interested to hear people's views on how they reached a decision.
One thing I need to look into but haven't found any threads on - what are the relative merits of Power v Str8Six. Why choose one over the other? On the face of it Dom looks to be cheaper, but then Jason's quoted price of £10.5k+VAT on the website includes a new block.
It may well be as simple as the price is roughly the same (I believe the components are all from Power anyway) and it is a case of going with who you are happy with.
I would be interested to hear people's views on how they reached a decision.
Quite honestly thats a tough one ... the 4.3 / 4.5 use the same primary components i believe, not sure on the smaller components, may be worth having a chat with both. TBH they both have a great reputation for cracking engine rebuilds...Jason rebuilt mine and it has been fantastic so far!
Congratulations in advance of the upgrade (even thoigh its kind of forced! whats wrong with your current engine?)
The most recent threads on the LSx seem to indicate a £12k+ bill, and im not sure you would get the kind of warranty you would from Power / Jason either, but thats just my perception of the state of the competition...
Congratulations in advance of the upgrade (even thoigh its kind of forced! whats wrong with your current engine?)
The most recent threads on the LSx seem to indicate a £12k+ bill, and im not sure you would get the kind of warranty you would from Power / Jason either, but thats just my perception of the state of the competition...
Robertjp said:
Quite honestly thats a tough one ... the 4.3 / 4.5 use the same primary components i believe, not sure on the smaller components, may be worth having a chat with both. TBH they both have a great reputation for cracking engine rebuilds...Jason rebuilt mine and it has been fantastic so far!
I have personal experience of Jason & the guys - they have been looking after my Tuscan for the last few years, and indeed they are the natural choice, but no matter how much I trust and value their ability, it's a lot of money so I need to do some due diligence :-)Robertjp said:
Congratulations in advance of the upgrade (even thoigh its kind of forced! whats wrong with your current engine?)
48k or so on a 2001/X Tuscan S with no work ever. It's been drinking oil & water and smoking like a chimney for some time (years) but refusing to give up. I still use it for 200+ mile commutes, but power is down and HGF between 4&5 now so really is time!Robertjp said:
The most recent threads on the LSx seem to indicate a £12k+ bill, and im not sure you would get the kind of warranty you would from Power / Jason either, but thats just my perception of the state of the competition...
If I knew my £12k would get me a working LSx then I think I would be sold... however the same £12k (well £13k) will get me a warranteed 4.3 from Jason. Decision almost made I think!I am guessing that most people will choose one over the other due to their proximity as I believe both companies to be reputable with what they do.
I am only down the road from Jason, so it was only natural to approach St8Six for looking after my Griff. I think I can honestly say that the guys at Str8Six have been the only garage I have dealt with in my car owning history that I have felt were on the ball and not trying to rip me off at some point.
That is a lot of money you are looking to shell out and I understand you wanting to cover your bases. If you have been happy with Jason so far, I don't think you will be disappointed in getting the work done at Str8Six.
Hope the waffle is of some help to you.
Royce
I am only down the road from Jason, so it was only natural to approach St8Six for looking after my Griff. I think I can honestly say that the guys at Str8Six have been the only garage I have dealt with in my car owning history that I have felt were on the ball and not trying to rip me off at some point.
That is a lot of money you are looking to shell out and I understand you wanting to cover your bases. If you have been happy with Jason so far, I don't think you will be disappointed in getting the work done at Str8Six.
Hope the waffle is of some help to you.
Royce
Thanks everyone so far... what I haven't got my head around (and been too busy to have a decent conversation with Dom & Jason) is why for a 4.3 Power quote £7k+VAT and Str8Six £10.5k+VAT, the only obvious major difference being that Jason builds into a new block, along with their own custom oil gallery mods.
UpTheIron said:
Thanks everyone so far... what I haven't got my head around (and been too busy to have a decent conversation with Dom & Jason) is why for a 4.3 Power quote £7k+VAT and Str8Six £10.5k+VAT, the only obvious major difference being that Jason builds into a new block, along with their own custom oil gallery mods.
Is £3500 the cost for the new block & oil gallery mods?gruffalo said:
No it includes a different ceramic coated exhaust to get the extra gas and heat away from the engine, a significant amount of head work, oversized injectors and a whole lot more.
On the face of it, the £3500 appears to be for some "stuff", and by that I am not suggesting that it isn't worth it, I am just trying to find out what I would get for the money, and if it is worth it.If it is all essential, why isn't Dom pushing the same? Both options have 5 year, unlimited miles warranties after all.
That said, looking at the websites there is £500/10% difference between standard 4.0 rebuilds. Power charge a £2.5k over this premium for the 4.3, Jason charges £5.5k. So £3k for a new block, injectors, head work, ceramic coating for the manifolds and a whole lot more. Is this good value? What does it mean in real terms? Extra reliability? Performance?
Don't get me wrong, I'm not looking to bash Jason and the team... they have looked after me very well for a few years now, but I'm not sure which way to jump - I have the money to do either which means the decision will be on merit alone... and a host of independent opinions from those who have been in the same boat is much appreciated.
gruffalo said:
jcpgasoline said:
Is £3500 the cost for the new block & oil gallery mods?
No it includes a different ceramic coated exhaust to get the extra gas and heat away from the engine, a significant amount of head work, oversized injectors and a whole lot more.jcpgasoline said:
gruffalo said:
jcpgasoline said:
Is £3500 the cost for the new block & oil gallery mods?
No it includes a different ceramic coated exhaust to get the extra gas and heat away from the engine, a significant amount of head work, oversized injectors and a whole lot more.Talk to Dom/Jason and see what you actually get for your money.
Good luck with whoever you decide to go with.
D14 AYS said:
I did the same, I have been using Tvr power for many years, so for me it was an easy choice, after seeing for myself the amount of time/work that goes into producing a 4.5 I do not know how they do it for the money! Then Dom has to put a 5 year warranty on top.
Talk to Dom/Jason and see what you actually get for your money.
Good luck with whoever you decide to go with.
The new block that will be offered by str8six will be an improvement on your existing 2001 block because it is a later casting which incorporates better cooling on cylinder no.6. This is an important improvement if you are looking to up the power with a 4.3. The str8six engine is also blueprinted...which means a lot of attention is given to all the tolerances. Hence less friction and potentially more power..Talk to Dom/Jason and see what you actually get for your money.
Good luck with whoever you decide to go with.
I cannot comment on TVR Powers offering, although with a warranty..you should still have peace of mind.
PipeNslippers said:
The new block that will be offered by str8six will be an improvement on your existing 2001 block because it is a later casting which incorporates better cooling on cylinder no.6. This is an important improvement if you are looking to up the power with a 4.3. The str8six engine is also blueprinted...which means a lot of attention is given to all the tolerances. Hence less friction and potentially more power...
I agree with both points, but:1 - How important an improvement? If it was essential surely Dom would not be able to offer 5 year/100k warranties without it?
2 - With an engine as highly developed as the 4.5, just how much more attention is paid to all the tolerances by "blueprinting".
UpTheIron said:
agree with both points, but:
1 - How important an improvement? If it was essential surely Dom would not be able to offer 5 year/100k warranties without it?
2 - With an engine as highly developed as the 4.5, just how much more attention is paid to all the tolerances by "blueprinting".
The question about what does 'blue printing' involve has been a bit illusive....but can involve line boring the big ends (reduces friction) and balancing the combustion chambers (prevents detonation)..which is very labour intensive..1 - How important an improvement? If it was essential surely Dom would not be able to offer 5 year/100k warranties without it?
2 - With an engine as highly developed as the 4.5, just how much more attention is paid to all the tolerances by "blueprinting".
I am not not sure if these activities are included in either package?
My suggestion is to have a very open conversation with both str8six and TVR Power before putting your money down. Both appear to be very good products with a good reputation..
PipeNslippers said:
My suggestion is to have a very open conversation with both str8six and TVR Power before putting your money down. Both appear to be very good products with a good reputation..
I plan to. I must stress I have on axe to grind with either - I've had dealing with both and my experiences have been good and their reputation speaks for itself.From what I have seen....
Dom and Jason do good work. I have seen higher headline figures from Jason (both cost and bhp).
There is someone out there who will do an LSx engine under £10k, but you'll have to wait for it.
Racing Green (I know), also offer a costly but good engine. You'll just have to wait as well for it!
Basically, if you can't wait for an engine, talk to Str8-Six/Power. You'll get a proven product quickly. If you want another route, you know what to do.
Dom and Jason do good work. I have seen higher headline figures from Jason (both cost and bhp).
There is someone out there who will do an LSx engine under £10k, but you'll have to wait for it.
Racing Green (I know), also offer a costly but good engine. You'll just have to wait as well for it!
Basically, if you can't wait for an engine, talk to Str8-Six/Power. You'll get a proven product quickly. If you want another route, you know what to do.
After reading this months Sprint mag I would be contacting Dave at RND Engineering http://www.rndengineering.co.uk/ he's got some good kit there. Well worth a look and a chat.
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