is a stage 1 exhaust enough?
Discussion
Getting a new exhaust for my car and within warranty period as its wells have failed. I have the kind offer of a sports exhaust instead of the standard one and would like to take up this offer. I was thinking of stage 1 bit am now concerned that it may not be enough.
My car is an elise s 1.8 with no induction kit, it is my daily driver and I do 16000 mainly motorway miles in it a year. I really like the rumble of the engine under say 3000 rpm but feel it sounds strained when taken higher (not that this happens often) therefore need something that will not drive me mad on the motorway but also brings some worthwhile gains.
Any thoughts, but please bear in mind the miles done in it (i like being able to sing along to the stereo) and also pleaded remember it does need to be a lotus exhaust.
Forgot to mention it will never be tracked so db is not an issue for tracks but must be able to pass an mot.
Thanks for reading and any help offered greatly appreciated.
My car is an elise s 1.8 with no induction kit, it is my daily driver and I do 16000 mainly motorway miles in it a year. I really like the rumble of the engine under say 3000 rpm but feel it sounds strained when taken higher (not that this happens often) therefore need something that will not drive me mad on the motorway but also brings some worthwhile gains.
Any thoughts, but please bear in mind the miles done in it (i like being able to sing along to the stereo) and also pleaded remember it does need to be a lotus exhaust.
Forgot to mention it will never be tracked so db is not an issue for tracks but must be able to pass an mot.
Thanks for reading and any help offered greatly appreciated.
Why does it need to be a Lotus exhaust??(if your dealer has told you it will void your warranty they're talking s
te)
They aren't stainless and are generally pretty poor quality, a Stage 2 will drone badly.
If they're replacing it gratis then offer to pay the difference between the Lotus jobbie.
I've got a Larini Sport on my S but it'll be too much for a daily driver.
I'd suggest a 2bular 8" x 24" as its nicely fruity without being ott
http://2bular.com/product-catalogue/11-elise-s/36-...
Fantastic quality with plenty of satisfied customers.
te)They aren't stainless and are generally pretty poor quality, a Stage 2 will drone badly.
If they're replacing it gratis then offer to pay the difference between the Lotus jobbie.
I've got a Larini Sport on my S but it'll be too much for a daily driver.
I'd suggest a 2bular 8" x 24" as its nicely fruity without being ott
http://2bular.com/product-catalogue/11-elise-s/36-...
Fantastic quality with plenty of satisfied customers.
If you do motorway miles then you will want an exhaust that doesn't resonate. Most of the loud ones do. The Lotus sports exhausts are notorious for poor quality and don't last long - and don't save much weight either.
If it's a cost thing - take however much the offer is for the Lotus stage 1 and add your own money to buy a 2bular 8x24 (aka 'the quiet one') - guaranteed to pass dB levels at trackdays (not that trackdays are a problem for you, but dB levels higher than most trackdays permit for 16k a year on motorways would be unpleasant). Fantastic build quality, it will last forever, sounds fantastic and doesn't add noise when on a light or steady throttle. Nail it though and you get some character from the engine - and in my experience (2 cars, same 2bular 8x24 zorst) it frees up the revs higher up too - the engine seems to want to spin a little more freely.
It's not the loudest exhaust out there, but IMO it's the best. If you want the same but louder, Jim will build you whatever you fancy. The smaller the diameter, the louder - so whilst the 8" is the fattest and quietest, you can have a 7" if you like more noise, and smaller if you're mental. There's none of the 'build to order' random wait time either now, since the product is justly popular and a stock is kept of the most popular fitments.
If you want to sing in the car you won't want any louder than a quiet 2bular, unless you have a particularly powerful voice or have miked up the car
I was singing on the way back from Somerset 2 weekends ago and the music / voice gets drowned out a bit by engine, induction, exhaust and road / wind noise above 90…
If it's a cost thing - take however much the offer is for the Lotus stage 1 and add your own money to buy a 2bular 8x24 (aka 'the quiet one') - guaranteed to pass dB levels at trackdays (not that trackdays are a problem for you, but dB levels higher than most trackdays permit for 16k a year on motorways would be unpleasant). Fantastic build quality, it will last forever, sounds fantastic and doesn't add noise when on a light or steady throttle. Nail it though and you get some character from the engine - and in my experience (2 cars, same 2bular 8x24 zorst) it frees up the revs higher up too - the engine seems to want to spin a little more freely.
It's not the loudest exhaust out there, but IMO it's the best. If you want the same but louder, Jim will build you whatever you fancy. The smaller the diameter, the louder - so whilst the 8" is the fattest and quietest, you can have a 7" if you like more noise, and smaller if you're mental. There's none of the 'build to order' random wait time either now, since the product is justly popular and a stock is kept of the most popular fitments.
If you want to sing in the car you won't want any louder than a quiet 2bular, unless you have a particularly powerful voice or have miked up the car
I was singing on the way back from Somerset 2 weekends ago and the music / voice gets drowned out a bit by engine, induction, exhaust and road / wind noise above 90… No nothing to do with warranty or cost, standard exhaust failed in warranty period along with a few other niggles, dealer has been fantastic over all of my issues knew I wanted a sports exhaust and offered a sports exhaust in replacement for the standard one.
Obviously because of this though it needs to be a lotus one.
Obviously because of this though it needs to be a lotus one.
I have a stage 2 on my Elise S. I love it, it pops and bangs and sounds quite fruity. Its been on the car now for 3 years and has done 30K without any issues whatsover, its not fallen apart, its not blowing and it sounds exactly the same as the day I got it. For the record it has been measured at 86db static and 96db at 4.5kRPM, the most it has regeistered has been 103.5db. I don't do many motorway miles though when I have it does drone terribley when above 80mph, keep on 80 or below and its fine. During normal driving I can still listen to the stero 
and chat to the wife 
and chat to the wife Edited by carl carlson on Wednesday 15th December 10:45
cyberface said:
If you do motorway miles then you will want an exhaust that doesn't resonate. Most of the loud ones do. The Lotus sports exhausts are notorious for poor quality and don't last long - and don't save much weight either.
If it's a cost thing - take however much the offer is for the Lotus stage 1 and add your own money to buy a 2bular 8x24 (aka 'the quiet one') - guaranteed to pass dB levels at trackdays (not that trackdays are a problem for you, but dB levels higher than most trackdays permit for 16k a year on motorways would be unpleasant). Fantastic build quality, it will last forever, sounds fantastic and doesn't add noise when on a light or steady throttle. Nail it though and you get some character from the engine - and in my experience (2 cars, same 2bular 8x24 zorst) it frees up the revs higher up too - the engine seems to want to spin a little more freely.
It's not the loudest exhaust out there, but IMO it's the best. If you want the same but louder, Jim will build you whatever you fancy. The smaller the diameter, the louder - so whilst the 8" is the fattest and quietest, you can have a 7" if you like more noise, and smaller if you're mental. There's none of the 'build to order' random wait time either now, since the product is justly popular and a stock is kept of the most popular fitments.
If you want to sing in the car you won't want any louder than a quiet 2bular, unless you have a particularly powerful voice or have miked up the car I was singing on the way back from Somerset 2 weekends ago and the music / voice gets drowned out a bit by engine, induction, exhaust and road / wind noise above 90…
I've got a 6.5" 2bular waiting to go on my 111R. Does that make me mental? Long response preferred. If it's a cost thing - take however much the offer is for the Lotus stage 1 and add your own money to buy a 2bular 8x24 (aka 'the quiet one') - guaranteed to pass dB levels at trackdays (not that trackdays are a problem for you, but dB levels higher than most trackdays permit for 16k a year on motorways would be unpleasant). Fantastic build quality, it will last forever, sounds fantastic and doesn't add noise when on a light or steady throttle. Nail it though and you get some character from the engine - and in my experience (2 cars, same 2bular 8x24 zorst) it frees up the revs higher up too - the engine seems to want to spin a little more freely.
It's not the loudest exhaust out there, but IMO it's the best. If you want the same but louder, Jim will build you whatever you fancy. The smaller the diameter, the louder - so whilst the 8" is the fattest and quietest, you can have a 7" if you like more noise, and smaller if you're mental. There's none of the 'build to order' random wait time either now, since the product is justly popular and a stock is kept of the most popular fitments.
If you want to sing in the car you won't want any louder than a quiet 2bular, unless you have a particularly powerful voice or have miked up the car
I was singing on the way back from Somerset 2 weekends ago and the music / voice gets drowned out a bit by engine, induction, exhaust and road / wind noise above 90… chevronb37 said:
cyberface said:
If you do motorway miles then you will want an exhaust that doesn't resonate... <snip>
I've got a 6.5" 2bular waiting to go on my 111R. Does that make me mental? Long response preferred. 
Not an Oh
you 
- that'd be if you were fitting a 6.0" pipe. Just a less but still... I've got earplugs for sale, would you like to subscribe to my long-term earplug service?No need for a long response, you won't be able to hear soon after the zorst's fitted so I'd expect your standard response to be 'eh?' before long
Blimey - just checked out Jim's website again and he's been upgrading... given that his business has more than doubled purely based on word of mouth (and internet) - that says it ALL. There are a lot of vicious cowards on the internet because they can hide behind screen names, and virtually ALL companies have problems, the odd Friday afternoon product or the odd bad customer - and with the internet these problems can be amplified by either very loud 'bad customers' or a clique of competing-product-fans, or general trouble-makers.
I'll make no bones about the fact that I'll shout Jim's praises from the rooftops as I think his zorsts are the best. But I won't criticise other systems unless I have seen and experienced them and know they're not as good as 2bular. Larini seem to get a good write-up by their owners and so I won't criticise Larini just because they're not 2bular. But if you want to get an exhaust where there's zero chance of unhappiness, then get a 2bular.
You simply can't double your business like that unless more than 95% of word of mouth is strongly positive - that 5% can be a very loud negative effect on your business, and FUD is easy to spread on the 'net. Jim's up in Scotland and isn't the sort to take horses
t from anyone either, it's not as if he will sit back and accept a bad customer spreading lies about his products online. As a result, you simply have to conclude that it's the product doing the talking - and everyone with them is happy with them.In fact, the only unhappy customers I've heard of were those who took Jim's claims of 'quiet and civilised but characterful and free-flowing' with a pinch of salt (!!!) i.e. didn't think he could do it. The zorsts turned up, and they did what they said on the tin. The sceptical customers actually wanted more volume
so Jim took the 'quiet' 2bulars back and sent them a louder one. Happy customers again. 
Go back through the archives and the only issues were when Jim was making them *by himself* to order, and there was an argument with a loud type on an internet forum who must have confused Jim's operation with an off-the-shelf mass-production outfit. There was a lead time as Jim had to make the thing from scratch, the customer wanted it immediately and made a fuss. This isn't the case now, as Jim's had to deal with the demand and the *popular* fitments are kept in stock. But if you want a 'special' then Jim will make you one, and it will take some time.
Even the 'where's my exhaust I want it NOW' guy wasn't unhappy with the actual product. I haven't heard of *anyone* who isn't anything other than absolutely satisfied with the quality of the 2bular product.
In fact, having seen his new site, I'm seriously considering getting rid of my 2bular... and getting Jim to make me one in Titanium... anything to make the Ginger Ballerina a bit lighter is very welcome indeed, even though Jim's stainless exhausts are *already* some of the lightest available...
I have heard very good things about 2bular and do think I will get one at some point as the car is a keeper. It's just the free cash side of things vs lotus option is free. If I had the money to buy the exhaust I would buy the iwc off of you!
Would I be right in assuming there is more of a secondhand market for stage 2? My thinking being if I kept it for a year or so then sold the lotus exhaust to buy a 2bular then would I find it easier to move on, over a stage 1?
Would I be right in assuming there is more of a secondhand market for stage 2? My thinking being if I kept it for a year or so then sold the lotus exhaust to buy a 2bular then would I find it easier to move on, over a stage 1?
cyberface said:
chevronb37 said:
cyberface said:
If you do motorway miles then you will want an exhaust that doesn't resonate... <snip>
I've got a 6.5" 2bular waiting to go on my 111R. Does that make me mental? Long response preferred. Not an Oh
you - that'd be if you were fitting a 6.0" pipe. Just a less but still... I've got earplugs for sale, would you like to subscribe to my long-term earplug service?No need for a long response, you won't be able to hear soon after the zorst's fitted so I'd expect your standard response to be 'eh?' before long
Blimey - just checked out Jim's website again and he's been upgrading... given that his business has more than doubled purely based on word of mouth (and internet) - that says it ALL. There are a lot of vicious cowards on the internet because they can hide behind screen names, and virtually ALL companies have problems, the odd Friday afternoon product or the odd bad customer - and with the internet these problems can be amplified by either very loud 'bad customers' or a clique of competing-product-fans, or general trouble-makers.
I'll make no bones about the fact that I'll shout Jim's praises from the rooftops as I think his zorsts are the best. But I won't criticise other systems unless I have seen and experienced them and know they're not as good as 2bular. Larini seem to get a good write-up by their owners and so I won't criticise Larini just because they're not 2bular. But if you want to get an exhaust where there's zero chance of unhappiness, then get a 2bular.
You simply can't double your business like that unless more than 95% of word of mouth is strongly positive - that 5% can be a very loud negative effect on your business, and FUD is easy to spread on the 'net. Jim's up in Scotland and isn't the sort to take horses
t from anyone either, it's not as if he will sit back and accept a bad customer spreading lies about his products online. As a result, you simply have to conclude that it's the product doing the talking - and everyone with them is happy with them.In fact, the only unhappy customers I've heard of were those who took Jim's claims of 'quiet and civilised but characterful and free-flowing' with a pinch of salt (!!!) i.e. didn't think he could do it. The zorsts turned up, and they did what they said on the tin. The sceptical customers actually wanted more volume
so Jim took the 'quiet' 2bulars back and sent them a louder one. Happy customers again. Go back through the archives and the only issues were when Jim was making them *by himself* to order, and there was an argument with a loud type on an internet forum who must have confused Jim's operation with an off-the-shelf mass-production outfit. There was a lead time as Jim had to make the thing from scratch, the customer wanted it immediately and made a fuss. This isn't the case now, as Jim's had to deal with the demand and the *popular* fitments are kept in stock. But if you want a 'special' then Jim will make you one, and it will take some time.
Even the 'where's my exhaust I want it NOW' guy wasn't unhappy with the actual product. I haven't heard of *anyone* who isn't anything other than absolutely satisfied with the quality of the 2bular product.
In fact, having seen his new site, I'm seriously considering getting rid of my 2bular... and getting Jim to make me one in Titanium... anything to make the Ginger Ballerina a bit lighter is very welcome indeed, even though Jim's stainless exhausts are *already* some of the lightest available...
So I decided on the stage 1 in the end and now waiting like a school kid with excitement as the day has come and its being fitted as we speak. It should be ready about 3ish, so of you see a blue white and gold lotus on the road with the driver keep changing gear and a big smile it will be me. Will report on my thoughts later.
Just been delivered, so far very impressed. Sounds lovely at tickover nice and deep noise with a real gargle when on the move.
Really makes the car and only regret is I didn't have one put on when I first bought it! Only problem is it now sounds faster than it is.
I have noticed a resonance when backing off of the throttle, which in itself isn't a problem but it doesn't half make the coins under the driver seat rattle
May still get a 2bular in a bit, but for a free upgrade on warranty I'm very happy and pleased again with my local dealer.
Really makes the car and only regret is I didn't have one put on when I first bought it! Only problem is it now sounds faster than it is.
I have noticed a resonance when backing off of the throttle, which in itself isn't a problem but it doesn't half make the coins under the driver seat rattle
May still get a 2bular in a bit, but for a free upgrade on warranty I'm very happy and pleased again with my local dealer.
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