opinions asked: how good is an M3
Discussion
My 111s is no more.
I need another car shortly and I got useful opinions here asking about the boxter 987 but I ruled it (S) out as 2nd hand ones are not affordable yet.
Before I burn my money on a Lotus again ... what do you think of a BMW M3?
Essentially a nice 03 M3 convertible is about the price of a new exige TP aircon.
I have't test drive an M3 yet, only a (slow) pax ride in a convertible, so
did not experience the power.
loved the roof. can be a practical 2nd car too.
I don't like the luxury looks (I prefer the special essentiality of a lotus) but it seemed a good car.
where would you throw 30k at ?
I need another car shortly and I got useful opinions here asking about the boxter 987 but I ruled it (S) out as 2nd hand ones are not affordable yet.
Before I burn my money on a Lotus again ... what do you think of a BMW M3?
Essentially a nice 03 M3 convertible is about the price of a new exige TP aircon.
I have't test drive an M3 yet, only a (slow) pax ride in a convertible, so
did not experience the power.
loved the roof. can be a practical 2nd car too.
I don't like the luxury looks (I prefer the special essentiality of a lotus) but it seemed a good car.
where would you throw 30k at ?
The E46 M3 is a great car. I owned one in 2002 - Pheonix yellow.Only problem I can see is the servicing costs ( quite high ) and likely depreciation when the new model comes out maybe next year. The exhaust note at full pelt is great though!I would look for one with SAT NAV / TV and 19" wheels essential (IMHO).SMG box is supposed to be good though mine was manual.
As a car the M3 is a wonderfull weapon on the road or on the track, EXCEPT for the brakes.
The problem comes from the way the owner see his car. Some bloke believe they can race everything everywhere without rules, but no generalization...
I personnaly do not like it so much (too conventionnal design) but as sporty four seater, there is no real competitor (or in another style: EVO, Impreza,...)
The problem comes from the way the owner see his car. Some bloke believe they can race everything everywhere without rules, but no generalization...
I personnaly do not like it so much (too conventionnal design) but as sporty four seater, there is no real competitor (or in another style: EVO, Impreza,...)
Eduardo - I currently have an S2 111s. My previous car was an M3, though not a convertible.
In context though, I was living in South Africa when I owned the M3. No doubt it is a quick car - the handling is solid and it makes a great sound at high revs. I did a great deal of long distance travelling - trips across the country of over 1000 miles at a time. The roads are essentially empty by comparison and having a high top speed was a major plus. I wanted a car that could sustain 150mph for long periods in comfort. I had a BMW chip that increased the rev limit marginally, but removed the top speed governer. The car was good for near 180mph. As a car for high top speeds and general fast comfortable driving, it was superb. In the UK context I would raise several issues (the reasons why I did not buy another).
1) There is little perception of speed - 100mph feels like 50mph. You would have to be really careful or lose your licence.
2) The steering feedback is virtually nil - the car's power steering is overservoed imho. It is nowhere in the same league as the lotus for b-road blasting and putting a huge grin on your face. I have had far more smiles with the lotus in every aspect of its performance, despite some of the comfort drawbacks.
3) Cost of running the M3 could be crippling. They have had big-end bearing problems, as well as several cars needing the vanos replaced. Mine was on a motor plan, so I escaped the £3000 this would have cost.
4) The convertible is fun, but far to much body flex to be a proper sports car. Dynamically way inferior to the coupe. You will not get to use the additional power effectively. If I was buying the convertible, I would probably go for the 330i and save a packet and have enough power for the chassis to cope.
5) The SMG gearbox is fun, but there have been a load of problems - not going to be fun if that needs replacing.
6) I should also mention that I agree with Bher about the brakes. In particular the brake feel - there isn't any. Also takes about 3 car lengths longer to stop from 80mph than the elise and bad fade on a race track (I did track my M3 a few times)
You really need to decide is you are committed to a sports car which you can chuck about and take on the track and grin from ear to ear, or whether you want a powerful, luxurious high speed cruiser to take the family out in - in which case the convertible BMW may be the ticket. I must admit to being a tad bored of the M3 within a year or so. As I have gotten better at extracting more form the lotus, I am enjoying it more and more each fay after 18 months. Might put a honda engine in though....
>> Edited by shangani on Friday 28th October 08:26
>> Edited by shangani on Friday 28th October 08:29
In context though, I was living in South Africa when I owned the M3. No doubt it is a quick car - the handling is solid and it makes a great sound at high revs. I did a great deal of long distance travelling - trips across the country of over 1000 miles at a time. The roads are essentially empty by comparison and having a high top speed was a major plus. I wanted a car that could sustain 150mph for long periods in comfort. I had a BMW chip that increased the rev limit marginally, but removed the top speed governer. The car was good for near 180mph. As a car for high top speeds and general fast comfortable driving, it was superb. In the UK context I would raise several issues (the reasons why I did not buy another).
1) There is little perception of speed - 100mph feels like 50mph. You would have to be really careful or lose your licence.
2) The steering feedback is virtually nil - the car's power steering is overservoed imho. It is nowhere in the same league as the lotus for b-road blasting and putting a huge grin on your face. I have had far more smiles with the lotus in every aspect of its performance, despite some of the comfort drawbacks.
3) Cost of running the M3 could be crippling. They have had big-end bearing problems, as well as several cars needing the vanos replaced. Mine was on a motor plan, so I escaped the £3000 this would have cost.
4) The convertible is fun, but far to much body flex to be a proper sports car. Dynamically way inferior to the coupe. You will not get to use the additional power effectively. If I was buying the convertible, I would probably go for the 330i and save a packet and have enough power for the chassis to cope.
5) The SMG gearbox is fun, but there have been a load of problems - not going to be fun if that needs replacing.
6) I should also mention that I agree with Bher about the brakes. In particular the brake feel - there isn't any. Also takes about 3 car lengths longer to stop from 80mph than the elise and bad fade on a race track (I did track my M3 a few times)
You really need to decide is you are committed to a sports car which you can chuck about and take on the track and grin from ear to ear, or whether you want a powerful, luxurious high speed cruiser to take the family out in - in which case the convertible BMW may be the ticket. I must admit to being a tad bored of the M3 within a year or so. As I have gotten better at extracting more form the lotus, I am enjoying it more and more each fay after 18 months. Might put a honda engine in though....
>> Edited by shangani on Friday 28th October 08:26
>> Edited by shangani on Friday 28th October 08:29
shangani said:
I wanted a car that could sustain 150mph for long periods in comfort. I had a BMW chip that increased the rev limit marginally, but removed the top speed governer. The car was good for near 180mph.
thanks shangani your story is very interesting to me
(as were your posts about airbags!).
... 180mph = 290 km/h !!!!!!!!!
If I bought an M3, I'd need to go to Germany just to drink a coffee now and then ;-)
There is clearly agreement on the M3 issue on this forum - then again we are all lotus enthusiasts.
You could always post on the BMW forum to hear the other views. That said, the lotus owners tend to be car enthusiasts who have chosen that particular car. Plenty of M3's are bought by people who know very little about cars, but think they are "cool" or a status symbol.
You could always post on the BMW forum to hear the other views. That said, the lotus owners tend to be car enthusiasts who have chosen that particular car. Plenty of M3's are bought by people who know very little about cars, but think they are "cool" or a status symbol.
shangani said:
Plenty of M3's are bought by people who know very little about cars, but think they are "cool" or a status symbol.
That is a very good point. You do see a lot being ragged to within an inch of their lifes from cold
I own a 330 coupe and I find all the controls too artificial and difficult to operate. It is impossible to drive the thing smoothly or get any satisfaction out of driving it at all. This is why I want to switch to an Elise!
I am sure that the M3 is much better than the 330 though. My advice is take a test drive, but don't do what I did and take a 5 minute spin round the block. INSIST on at least half an hour or just leave it and walk away. I decided within two days that I hated the 330, but by then of course I had already spent my money! Bell and Colvill spent about 2 or 3 hours with me, and as a result I left there knowing exactly what I wanted - fantastic customer service - beats BMW hands down!
Beaten me to it then! My 330 has lasted four months so far. It has avoided being pushed off a cliff (I've been very tempted whilst near high up places), so instead it will be making an appearance in Autotrader very soon and being replaced by... you guessed it! Problem is, if I classify the 330 correctly in Autotrader it will appear next to wastage that gets shovelled onto rose beds. I'm not sure it'll sell if I tell the truth, so I might have to lie and put it in the 'general cars' section.
Obviously the advantage of the BMW is that it has four seats and a boot and will cruise down the Autobahn at 130mph in silence and comfort. I need these things from time to time, but now I am looking at getting an Elise and a Micra (problem solved!).
The BMW 3 series is better than any other saloon car I've ever driven because it is RWD and has sharper handling than most things. I can't stand FWD, so it is a natural choice for me.
The main reason that I hate my 330ci is the fly-by-wire throttle, which gives a delay between throttle input and engine response. My 330 is a 2000 model and the problem is very bad indeed. All modern saloons that I have tried have this problem. I believe that modern BMWs are much better in this area. Today I have a 118d, which has a delay, but it doesn't bother me much because it is a very small delay.
The other issue is that the controls don't really gel on earlier models (pre '03 facelift). The steering is too light and has a worying dead zone "wobble area" and the clutch is odd. The anti-stall is also far too over eager and generally the car is immensely hard to drive smoothly. It is not a nice experience to drive a 2000 model BMW 330ci - I'm selling mine - it's rubbish.
Do test drive a more recent 330ci though - it may be worth it. If you need a large boot, four seats and quite motorway cruising I can't think of another car that does it all so well. 4WD and FWD understeer too much, and RWD leaves you with Mercs or BMWs!
The BMW 3 series is better than any other saloon car I've ever driven because it is RWD and has sharper handling than most things. I can't stand FWD, so it is a natural choice for me.
The main reason that I hate my 330ci is the fly-by-wire throttle, which gives a delay between throttle input and engine response. My 330 is a 2000 model and the problem is very bad indeed. All modern saloons that I have tried have this problem. I believe that modern BMWs are much better in this area. Today I have a 118d, which has a delay, but it doesn't bother me much because it is a very small delay.
The other issue is that the controls don't really gel on earlier models (pre '03 facelift). The steering is too light and has a worying dead zone "wobble area" and the clutch is odd. The anti-stall is also far too over eager and generally the car is immensely hard to drive smoothly. It is not a nice experience to drive a 2000 model BMW 330ci - I'm selling mine - it's rubbish.
Do test drive a more recent 330ci though - it may be worth it. If you need a large boot, four seats and quite motorway cruising I can't think of another car that does it all so well. 4WD and FWD understeer too much, and RWD leaves you with Mercs or BMWs!
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