Exige 380 Cup vs 410 Sport
Discussion
Hi,
I’m in the process of selling my 997 GT3 RS and am considering an Exige. I’ve owned my RS for 15 years and absolutely love it, I don’t want to sell it but am based in the French alps (the RS is still on U.K. plates) so it’s a real pain travelling back every year for an MOT / service.
I’m happy to replace with a LHD GT3 RS but at the same time wonder if I’m missing a trick by not trying an Exige after 15 years of RS ownership.
I’m considering either a 380 Cup or a 410 Sport and am wondering if there are any real / noticeable differences. I know the Cup is more geared towards track driving but most of my driving will be on smooth tarmac mountain passes, so I’m thinking there won’t be any downsides to the Cup? Il only 2hrs of Monza so would definitely plan on doing some trackways there. I’m thinking the Cup will be a bit rawer and noisier as well but I see that as a bonus
Appreciate any thoughts.
Cheers,
Martin
I’m in the process of selling my 997 GT3 RS and am considering an Exige. I’ve owned my RS for 15 years and absolutely love it, I don’t want to sell it but am based in the French alps (the RS is still on U.K. plates) so it’s a real pain travelling back every year for an MOT / service.
I’m happy to replace with a LHD GT3 RS but at the same time wonder if I’m missing a trick by not trying an Exige after 15 years of RS ownership.
I’m considering either a 380 Cup or a 410 Sport and am wondering if there are any real / noticeable differences. I know the Cup is more geared towards track driving but most of my driving will be on smooth tarmac mountain passes, so I’m thinking there won’t be any downsides to the Cup? Il only 2hrs of Monza so would definitely plan on doing some trackways there. I’m thinking the Cup will be a bit rawer and noisier as well but I see that as a bonus
Appreciate any thoughts.
Cheers,
Martin
Technically, 410. Bigger supercharger, chargecooled, higher rev limit (380s have the lowest of all Exige V6s), 3-way Nitrons (but see below).
Cup 380s are rare, have lots of carbon (and OEM carbon bits aren't cheap), and are a little more difficult to price, but are probably a little bit cheaper.
If it were a Sport 380 and 410, 410 would be an easy choice. Cup 380's carbon bits make that a little bit more challenging.
2-way Nitrons could be upgraded to 3-way (and you can definitely do better than Nitron's stock valving anyway).
If you're going to catch upgrade-itis, 410 is the best of the bunch really. There are easier routes to big power (aftermarket ECU and headers/cat gets you to near 500hp without much outlay, or you can go Komo-Tec EX475/490.
EDIT: Looking at a couple of your other recent posts, if you only care about road usage, you may also be happy with simply a 350 and an exhaust upgrade. Test drives are key (despite the fact that a number of us have indeed just gone out and bought 410s without a moment's thought!).
Consider Tillett B10 seats as an upgrade too; I'm just waiting for my second one to turn up!
Cup 380s are rare, have lots of carbon (and OEM carbon bits aren't cheap), and are a little more difficult to price, but are probably a little bit cheaper.
If it were a Sport 380 and 410, 410 would be an easy choice. Cup 380's carbon bits make that a little bit more challenging.
2-way Nitrons could be upgraded to 3-way (and you can definitely do better than Nitron's stock valving anyway).
If you're going to catch upgrade-itis, 410 is the best of the bunch really. There are easier routes to big power (aftermarket ECU and headers/cat gets you to near 500hp without much outlay, or you can go Komo-Tec EX475/490.
EDIT: Looking at a couple of your other recent posts, if you only care about road usage, you may also be happy with simply a 350 and an exhaust upgrade. Test drives are key (despite the fact that a number of us have indeed just gone out and bought 410s without a moment's thought!).
Consider Tillett B10 seats as an upgrade too; I'm just waiting for my second one to turn up!
Edited by jmcvaughn on Friday 27th June 12:46
Thanks for the info, I wasn’t too bothered about the Cups carbon bits, I just thought it might be an even rawer experience than a ‘regular’ 410, I appreciate either of them are likely much more visceral than my RS
You are right about my usage, it will mostly be fast road use with the very occasional track day. I really like the 350 rear end with the double lights but a few guys on the Porsche forum thought I might think it lacked a bit of punch vs my RS. I realise upgrades are fairly straightforward (I’ve already been thinking how I could empty my wallet on the Komotec site😀) but think if I was to go down that route then I might as well go for the 410 straight off the bat. And the 410 having a higher rev limit is definitely a bonus, there’s something special about winding a GT3 up to 8500rpm!
Definitely some test drives will need to be in order!
You are right about my usage, it will mostly be fast road use with the very occasional track day. I really like the 350 rear end with the double lights but a few guys on the Porsche forum thought I might think it lacked a bit of punch vs my RS. I realise upgrades are fairly straightforward (I’ve already been thinking how I could empty my wallet on the Komotec site😀) but think if I was to go down that route then I might as well go for the 410 straight off the bat. And the 410 having a higher rev limit is definitely a bonus, there’s something special about winding a GT3 up to 8500rpm!
Definitely some test drives will need to be in order!
Only the 380/410/430 have chargecoolers so if you are doing any track work you'd be better off with one of these.
You may also find you need one exhaust for run road driving and another for track days as the track-specific boxes don't sound great IME, although I have definitely not tried them all! It depends how quiet you need to get the exhaust for your track of choice.
Edited to strike out the 380
You may also find you need one exhaust for run road driving and another for track days as the track-specific boxes don't sound great IME, although I have definitely not tried them all! It depends how quiet you need to get the exhaust for your track of choice.
Edited to strike out the 380
Edited by BillyB on Monday 30th June 17:53
Unpopular opinion here, but having owned Elise’s and driven an Exige 410 on UK B roads I much prefer the Elise.
Might be worth test driving an Elise too if you can?
The Elise won’t have the ultimate speed and has less presence but it’s more agile, with better steering, a smaller footprint and much less weight in the wrong place. Although it sounds good the V6 probably won’t stand comparison with your 911 in terms of character too.
Might be worth test driving an Elise too if you can?
The Elise won’t have the ultimate speed and has less presence but it’s more agile, with better steering, a smaller footprint and much less weight in the wrong place. Although it sounds good the V6 probably won’t stand comparison with your 911 in terms of character too.
giveitfish said:
Unpopular opinion here, but having owned Elise s and driven an Exige 410 on UK B roads I much prefer the Elise.
Might be worth test driving an Elise too if you can?
The Elise won t have the ultimate speed and has less presence but it s more agile, with better steering, a smaller footprint and much less weight in the wrong place. Although it sounds good the V6 probably won t stand comparison with your 911 in terms of character too.
Me too. 430 Cup went. S2 Elise SC stayed. Personally I don' think 400bhp cars are much fun on the road once you've got over the initial fun of very short bursts of acceleration. But tbf, I have another car for track days. If I just had one car to do it all, I'd have been more tempted to keep the 430 Cup.Might be worth test driving an Elise too if you can?
The Elise won t have the ultimate speed and has less presence but it s more agile, with better steering, a smaller footprint and much less weight in the wrong place. Although it sounds good the V6 probably won t stand comparison with your 911 in terms of character too.
BillyB said:
Only the 380/410/430 have chargecoolers so if you are doing any track work you'd be better off with one of these.
You may also find you need one exhaust for run road driving and another for track days as the track-specific boxes don't sound great IME, although I have definitely not tried them all! It depends how quiet you need to get the exhaust for your track of choice.
I think the noise limit at Monza is 103db although I’ve read that for 37 days a year there are no limits You may also find you need one exhaust for run road driving and another for track days as the track-specific boxes don't sound great IME, although I have definitely not tried them all! It depends how quiet you need to get the exhaust for your track of choice.
. I have seen decatted / straight piped GT3 RS’ and Exiges making some lovely noises so I think if I choose the right day, noise shouldn’t be an issue!BillyB said:
Only the 380/410/430 have chargecoolers so if you are doing any track work you'd be better off with one of these.
I'll be looking for either a charge cooled car soon, or will fit a charge cooler if not present. There's a few full ring lap vids of an Exige 350/380, by the time it gets onto the main straight after 7 minutes it's absolutely on it's arse power wise, I wouldn't be surprised if they are 100bhp+ down by that point.BillyB said:
giveitfish said:
Unpopular opinion here, but having owned Elise s and driven an Exige 410 on UK B roads I much prefer the Elise.
Might be worth test driving an Elise too if you can?
The Elise won t have the ultimate speed and has less presence but it s more agile, with better steering, a smaller footprint and much less weight in the wrong place. Although it sounds good the V6 probably won t stand comparison with your 911 in terms of character too.
Me too. 430 Cup went. S2 Elise SC stayed. Personally I don' think 400bhp cars are much fun on the road once you've got over the initial fun of very short bursts of acceleration. But tbf, I have another car for track days. If I just had one car to do it all, I'd have been more tempted to keep the 430 Cup.Might be worth test driving an Elise too if you can?
The Elise won t have the ultimate speed and has less presence but it s more agile, with better steering, a smaller footprint and much less weight in the wrong place. Although it sounds good the V6 probably won t stand comparison with your 911 in terms of character too.
I love the 430 Cups but they are quite a step up in price in France (€135 - €150k).
The 410 is Chargecooled but the 380 isn’t , for that reason alone the 410 is a better option
Weight wise the 410 was lightest dry weight of 1,054 kg the Cup 380 was no lighter.
The early 410’s 2018-2019 were of a much higher standard specification more akin to the Cup430’s. Later ones had less carbon unless optioned but were cheaper.
The 3 way Nitrons are an additional benefit but not a game changer.
In all the 410 is a more capable car on road and track but it isn’t a Cup car and to obtain more power is more expensive than the 410
Weight wise the 410 was lightest dry weight of 1,054 kg the Cup 380 was no lighter.
The early 410’s 2018-2019 were of a much higher standard specification more akin to the Cup430’s. Later ones had less carbon unless optioned but were cheaper.
The 3 way Nitrons are an additional benefit but not a game changer.
In all the 410 is a more capable car on road and track but it isn’t a Cup car and to obtain more power is more expensive than the 410
giveitfish said:
Unpopular opinion here, but having owned Elise s and driven an Exige 410 on UK B roads I much prefer the Elise.
Might be worth test driving an Elise too if you can?
I agree. I have had a VX220 Turbo, Elise 111R and an Exige 410 Anniversary I recently sold. The Exige was a stunning looking and sounding thing. Like a mini supercar. But ultimately my Elise was probably a better road car. Might be worth test driving an Elise too if you can?
You can't really go wrong with either, but the 410 will have the edge as far as tech / spec goes. Will you notice the difference when driving on the road? Probably not.... other than better mpg with the 410. Looks wise the 380 Cup is probably the best V6 out there.
On track, the 410 will be an improvement over the 380 once you start to get the hang of it. If you're a learner trackdayer then maybe not. Both cars are still very good.
I've had my 410 for 6 years and nearly 40k miles. Takes some beating, in both meanings.
On track, the 410 will be an improvement over the 380 once you start to get the hang of it. If you're a learner trackdayer then maybe not. Both cars are still very good.
I've had my 410 for 6 years and nearly 40k miles. Takes some beating, in both meanings.
Re the sound differences between the Elise and Exige :
Jim Valentine kindly made up a Tubular back box for my naturally aspirated Chrome Orange 189bhp Elise R ( 2010 S3 version )
I asked him to make it as loud and tuneful as possible as I do not do track days in my own cars .
Jim obliged brilliantly , and on startup and running through the revs, esp past the cam changeover point at 6200 rpm, the Elise sounds not totally dissimilar to my Arancio Atlas Murcielago Roadster - in fact one looks and sounds like a mini-me of the other.
I would speak to Jim whether you go for an Elise or an Exige.
The naturally aspirated 189bhp Elise R allows you to enjoy the following without risking your license as much as with a SC Elise or an Exile and this was instrumental in my decision to go for a naturally aspirated car :
1) more opportunity for high rev sound while staying within legal limits
2) more frequent gear changes within legal limits
3) less weight than having a supercharger or 2 additional cylinders
4) less complexity and cost than a V6
5) cheaper and easier servicing without having to change the sc belt
I don’t feel shortchanged in terms of speed for road driving at all ( again , I don’t track this car ) , in fact quite the contrary, with more involvement for any given speed.
Jim Valentine kindly made up a Tubular back box for my naturally aspirated Chrome Orange 189bhp Elise R ( 2010 S3 version )
I asked him to make it as loud and tuneful as possible as I do not do track days in my own cars .
Jim obliged brilliantly , and on startup and running through the revs, esp past the cam changeover point at 6200 rpm, the Elise sounds not totally dissimilar to my Arancio Atlas Murcielago Roadster - in fact one looks and sounds like a mini-me of the other.
I would speak to Jim whether you go for an Elise or an Exige.
The naturally aspirated 189bhp Elise R allows you to enjoy the following without risking your license as much as with a SC Elise or an Exile and this was instrumental in my decision to go for a naturally aspirated car :
1) more opportunity for high rev sound while staying within legal limits
2) more frequent gear changes within legal limits
3) less weight than having a supercharger or 2 additional cylinders
4) less complexity and cost than a V6
5) cheaper and easier servicing without having to change the sc belt
I don’t feel shortchanged in terms of speed for road driving at all ( again , I don’t track this car ) , in fact quite the contrary, with more involvement for any given speed.
ecain63 said:
You can't really go wrong with either, but the 410 will have the edge as far as tech / spec goes. Will you notice the difference when driving on the road? Probably not.... other than better mpg with the 410. Looks wise the 380 Cup is probably the best V6 out there.
On track, the 410 will be an improvement over the 380 once you start to get the hang of it. If you're a learner trackdayer then maybe not. Both cars are still very good.
I've had my 410 for 6 years and nearly 40k miles. Takes some beating, in both meanings.
Gorgeous looking car on some gorgeous roads! Hoping I can replicate soon On track, the 410 will be an improvement over the 380 once you start to get the hang of it. If you're a learner trackdayer then maybe not. Both cars are still very good.
I've had my 410 for 6 years and nearly 40k miles. Takes some beating, in both meanings.
As mentioned, the majority of my driving will be on mountain roads so I doubt I would notice the difference in performance. In the end it could come down to what cars are available (assuming my one sells).
carspath said:
Re the sound differences between the Elise and Exige :
Jim Valentine kindly made up a Tubular back box for my naturally aspirated Chrome Orange 189bhp Elise R ( 2010 S3 version )
I asked him to make it as loud and tuneful as possible as I do not do track days in my own cars .
Jim obliged brilliantly , and on startup and running through the revs, esp past the cam changeover point at 6200 rpm, the Elise sounds not totally dissimilar to my Arancio Atlas Murcielago Roadster - in fact one looks and sounds like a mini-me of the other.
I would speak to Jim whether you go for an Elise or an Exige.
The naturally aspirated 189bhp Elise R allows you to enjoy the following without risking your license as much as with a SC Elise or an Exile and this was instrumental in my decision to go for a naturally aspirated car :
1) more opportunity for high rev sound while staying within legal limits
2) more frequent gear changes within legal limits
3) less weight than having a supercharger or 2 additional cylinders
4) less complexity and cost than a V6
5) cheaper and easier servicing without having to change the sc belt
I don t feel shortchanged in terms of speed for road driving at all ( again , I don t track this car ) , in fact quite the contrary, with more involvement for any given speed.
Now you have me intrigued, I'll have to see if there are any sounds clips of Exiges with a Jim Valentine special! You realise you can post this and then not provide a video clip Jim Valentine kindly made up a Tubular back box for my naturally aspirated Chrome Orange 189bhp Elise R ( 2010 S3 version )
I asked him to make it as loud and tuneful as possible as I do not do track days in my own cars .
Jim obliged brilliantly , and on startup and running through the revs, esp past the cam changeover point at 6200 rpm, the Elise sounds not totally dissimilar to my Arancio Atlas Murcielago Roadster - in fact one looks and sounds like a mini-me of the other.
I would speak to Jim whether you go for an Elise or an Exige.
The naturally aspirated 189bhp Elise R allows you to enjoy the following without risking your license as much as with a SC Elise or an Exile and this was instrumental in my decision to go for a naturally aspirated car :
1) more opportunity for high rev sound while staying within legal limits
2) more frequent gear changes within legal limits
3) less weight than having a supercharger or 2 additional cylinders
4) less complexity and cost than a V6
5) cheaper and easier servicing without having to change the sc belt
I don t feel shortchanged in terms of speed for road driving at all ( again , I don t track this car ) , in fact quite the contrary, with more involvement for any given speed.
I understand what your saying about having less power and being able to use more of it, more of the time, I think theres a lot to be said for wringing the neck of a lower powered car. Not quite in the same leauge but my father in law used to have a mini cooper S and it was an absolute hoot!
I think I'd still rather have more power available though, just incase the Gendarmes or Carabinieri asked to give it the beans away from a tollbooth, it would be rude not to oblige
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