Exige S - 240 to 260?
Discussion
I believe you will notice the difference. I certainly could, esp over the last 1500 revs. 20bhp extra is quite a lot when your car only weighs 900kg.
To my surprise the 260 exige I drove was able to keep up with 911 gt3's down the straights at Spa (a serious power circuit). I don't think the 240 car that my friend owned before would have been able to do that. I think it's a storming engine and the spec I'd choose without hesitation.
No idea of the cost but I think to do properly not cheap.
To my surprise the 260 exige I drove was able to keep up with 911 gt3's down the straights at Spa (a serious power circuit). I don't think the 240 car that my friend owned before would have been able to do that. I think it's a storming engine and the spec I'd choose without hesitation.
No idea of the cost but I think to do properly not cheap.
The Pits said:
I think 'done properly' means new injectors, flywheel, ecu, upgraded fuel pump.
That's going to cost more than £1600 I'll wager.
CN's is £2k for a 220 - 260 upgrade and as said earlier around £1600 for the 240 - 260. Speak to Paul in the service dept, he has done several cars for people I know and it is geniune Lotus parts, so still keeps the warranty valid.That's going to cost more than £1600 I'll wager.
Add a Forge intercooler and you are talking nearer to 280 I beleive!
The Pits said:
I think 'done properly' means new injectors, flywheel, ecu, upgraded fuel pump.
That's going to cost more than £1600 I'll wager.
While you are at it I would also get the shear panel and uprated engine mounts fitted. The whole package is superb. Now the car is how I would have wanted it from the off. Superb handling, accurate gearbox, and acceleration to comfortably humiliate tailgating reps in big diesels.That's going to cost more than £1600 I'll wager.
Here's the difference between a 260 Cup and Exige S. Quite nice vid too for any Exige fan spin at the end too.
It's particularly clear from 3.46 onwards. I'd say it's clear evidence in favour of there being a noticable difference.
Those of you familiar with trackdays will know that you need a fair bit more power for it to show up on a track.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nEiXJNqsC54&fea...
It's particularly clear from 3.46 onwards. I'd say it's clear evidence in favour of there being a noticable difference.
Those of you familiar with trackdays will know that you need a fair bit more power for it to show up on a track.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nEiXJNqsC54&fea...
I went from 220 to (270ish) so can't comment on the difference from 240 but I picked up ~o.5s in 0-60 and ~1.5s 0-100 with the gap growing all the time. It now does a GPS 152 (160 indicated) whereas before it was struggling to hit an indicated 150.
The guy in that video is like a donkey on ice !
The guy in that video is like a donkey on ice !
The Pits said:
Here's the difference between a 260 Cup and Exige S. Quite nice vid too for any Exige fan spin at the end too.
It's particularly clear from 3.46 onwards. I'd say it's clear evidence in favour of there being a noticable difference.
Those of you familiar with trackdays will know that you need a fair bit more power for it to show up on a track.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nEiXJNqsC54&fea...
Clear evidence? I would like to go up against you in a court of law. There are so many holes in that film as a discussion about the differences in performance between the 240 and 260. I honestly dont know where to start. All I will say with regard to the film is that there is a considerable difference between a standard Exige S 220 and a 260. Probably a much greater difference than that half hearted track day driving will ever show. Judging by the engine note of the camera car I dont think he went above 6000rpm.It's particularly clear from 3.46 onwards. I'd say it's clear evidence in favour of there being a noticable difference.
Those of you familiar with trackdays will know that you need a fair bit more power for it to show up on a track.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nEiXJNqsC54&fea...
Your view is that the 260 is not noticably faster than the 240. So perhaps understandably you have clearly viewed this clip through that lens.
From my direct experience I believe the difference is, without question, noticable. The mere fact that you are claiming it's a 220 and speculating about the amount of revs used and the driver's ability, means it's very clear that you can see a clear difference in straight line performance in this video, so much so it 'must have been a 220' because the video evidence doesn't square with your view.
So at least we are agreed that the video shows there is a clear difference in performance. If anything the cup 260 driver is the guy who doesn't know his way round (might be his first time), the driver of the slower car's lines are actually pretty good (I know the Bugatti circuit quite well as it happens) which again must be the case because he's able to pass the 260 even if he is in a 220 and 'changing up at 6000'.
I guess what it boils down to is that some people's 'bum dyno's are more sensitive than others. My friend, the owner of a 260 Exige and former owner of a 240, was convinced there wasn't much difference too, whereas I was and still am. At Spa his 260 was keeping up with 911 GT3s, at Spa for crying out loud! I could hardly believe it myself. There's no way his previous car would have been able to do that. His 260 felt a good bit sharper over the last 2000 revs than the 240. Other than that, yes very similar. So maybe it's something you'll notice more on a track than on the road.
From my direct experience I believe the difference is, without question, noticable. The mere fact that you are claiming it's a 220 and speculating about the amount of revs used and the driver's ability, means it's very clear that you can see a clear difference in straight line performance in this video, so much so it 'must have been a 220' because the video evidence doesn't square with your view.
So at least we are agreed that the video shows there is a clear difference in performance. If anything the cup 260 driver is the guy who doesn't know his way round (might be his first time), the driver of the slower car's lines are actually pretty good (I know the Bugatti circuit quite well as it happens) which again must be the case because he's able to pass the 260 even if he is in a 220 and 'changing up at 6000'.
I guess what it boils down to is that some people's 'bum dyno's are more sensitive than others. My friend, the owner of a 260 Exige and former owner of a 240, was convinced there wasn't much difference too, whereas I was and still am. At Spa his 260 was keeping up with 911 GT3s, at Spa for crying out loud! I could hardly believe it myself. There's no way his previous car would have been able to do that. His 260 felt a good bit sharper over the last 2000 revs than the 240. Other than that, yes very similar. So maybe it's something you'll notice more on a track than on the road.
The Pits said:
Your view is that the 260 is not noticably faster than the 240. So perhaps understandably you have clearly viewed this clip through that lens.
From my direct experience I believe the difference is, without question, noticable. The mere fact that you are claiming it's a 220 and speculating about the amount of revs used and the driver's ability, means it's very clear that you can see a clear difference in straight line performance in this video, so much so it 'must have been a 220' because the video evidence doesn't square with your view.
So at least we are agreed that the video shows there is a clear difference in performance. If anything the cup 260 driver is the guy who doesn't know his way round (might be his first time), the driver of the slower car's lines are actually pretty good (I know the Bugatti circuit quite well as it happens) which again must be the case because he's able to pass the 260 even if he is in a 220 and 'changing up at 6000'.
I guess what it boils down to is that some people's 'bum dyno's are more sensitive than others. My friend, the owner of a 260 Exige and former owner of a 240, was convinced there wasn't much difference too, whereas I was and still am. At Spa his 260 was keeping up with 911 GT3s, at Spa for crying out loud! I could hardly believe it myself. There's no way his previous car would have been able to do that. His 260 felt a good bit sharper over the last 2000 revs than the 240. Other than that, yes very similar. So maybe it's something you'll notice more on a track than on the road.
I dont wear any glasses and so have not viewed this clip with any preconceptions or lens as you put it. I am just giving the postee my honest opinion. I couldnt care less which is the better car, it really is of no consequence to me. I dont get emotionally involved in cars like so many people do.From my direct experience I believe the difference is, without question, noticable. The mere fact that you are claiming it's a 220 and speculating about the amount of revs used and the driver's ability, means it's very clear that you can see a clear difference in straight line performance in this video, so much so it 'must have been a 220' because the video evidence doesn't square with your view.
So at least we are agreed that the video shows there is a clear difference in performance. If anything the cup 260 driver is the guy who doesn't know his way round (might be his first time), the driver of the slower car's lines are actually pretty good (I know the Bugatti circuit quite well as it happens) which again must be the case because he's able to pass the 260 even if he is in a 220 and 'changing up at 6000'.
I guess what it boils down to is that some people's 'bum dyno's are more sensitive than others. My friend, the owner of a 260 Exige and former owner of a 240, was convinced there wasn't much difference too, whereas I was and still am. At Spa his 260 was keeping up with 911 GT3s, at Spa for crying out loud! I could hardly believe it myself. There's no way his previous car would have been able to do that. His 260 felt a good bit sharper over the last 2000 revs than the 240. Other than that, yes very similar. So maybe it's something you'll notice more on a track than on the road.
Re my 220 comment you have totally misunderstood where i was coming from. I wasnt making excuses for the camera car I was stating that the validity of the film was negligible. Can you honestly say if the camera car was a 240. If it was a 220 posting the film is a complete waste of time.
Two owners who have owned both cars, to express similar views, holds more credibility than someone who hasnt owned either.
Edited by doggydave on Sunday 19th June 20:03
Edited by doggydave on Tuesday 21st June 11:07
The Pits said:
I believe you will notice the difference. I certainly could, esp over the last 1500 revs. 20bhp extra is quite a lot when your car only weighs 900kg.
To my surprise the 260 exige I drove was able to keep up with 911 gt3's down the straights at Spa (a serious power circuit). I don't think the 240 car that my friend owned before would have been able to do that. I think it's a storming engine and the spec I'd choose without hesitation.
No idea of the cost but I think to do properly not cheap.
Don't forget the standard gearing of a GT3 runs to just over 190mph vmax, its not just power and weight.To my surprise the 260 exige I drove was able to keep up with 911 gt3's down the straights at Spa (a serious power circuit). I don't think the 240 car that my friend owned before would have been able to do that. I think it's a storming engine and the spec I'd choose without hesitation.
No idea of the cost but I think to do properly not cheap.
Having driven a 240 for 35000 miles and then having the factory upgrade it to 260 for the next 10000 miles, I can inform you that there is a noticeable difference. Torque and top end combine to give a distinctly stronger, more linear pull from 3750 revs onwards, with no flat spots or tail-off. The old 240 spec was dogged by flat spots and top end tail off. This is very strong throughout. It is more of a vast improvement in the character of the engine and power delivery than night and day speed difference, although the latter is certainly there. There is a relentlessness about the acceleration through 3rd 4th and into 5th gear (and beyond if you have a runway) with the 260 map.
I am not sure what is the expectation from seeing the video. We do not know the skill level of the drivers nor the weight of the additional passengers, fuel load, or indeed if the white car had a passenger (actually i did not study it that closely. And you could bring tyre choice, psi,or tread wear into the equation
And more importantly what suspension set up and brakes were in use.
Speaking from 1st hand experience of 240's and 260's(my friend has his 240 upgraded to 260 in the factory)and it is lovely to drive, but that is nothing to do with the power upgrade it is to do with the lightweight flywheel.
On track a 240 cup whooped his asssssss, but that was not to do with power it was to do with the fully adjustable suspension and ohlin's found on the origional ltd edition race series cup cars.
I might also add that the cup had standard 288 discs and the 260 had 308's, now 308's are a substantial improvement over the 288's.
So what weight does a power upgrade from 243 to 257 carry?
And more importantly what suspension set up and brakes were in use.
Speaking from 1st hand experience of 240's and 260's(my friend has his 240 upgraded to 260 in the factory)and it is lovely to drive, but that is nothing to do with the power upgrade it is to do with the lightweight flywheel.
On track a 240 cup whooped his asssssss, but that was not to do with power it was to do with the fully adjustable suspension and ohlin's found on the origional ltd edition race series cup cars.
I might also add that the cup had standard 288 discs and the 260 had 308's, now 308's are a substantial improvement over the 288's.
So what weight does a power upgrade from 243 to 257 carry?
I'm pretty sure we're all aware of all of that.
All the video shows is evidence that at a 260 Cup has a straight line advantage over the other Exige. It's very clear at the point I mentioned. But I can't be bothered to get into another nit picky discussion about it. Make of it what you will. If you think the cup 260 got better corner exit speed then that's fine by me.
You save the money and stick with your 240, I'll have the 260. That's about all there is to it.
All the video shows is evidence that at a 260 Cup has a straight line advantage over the other Exige. It's very clear at the point I mentioned. But I can't be bothered to get into another nit picky discussion about it. Make of it what you will. If you think the cup 260 got better corner exit speed then that's fine by me.
You save the money and stick with your 240, I'll have the 260. That's about all there is to it.
Some fine answers and discussion there, thanks.
I think I'll hold off any major work this year and spend the money on track days and tyres.
See how it performs and then possibly do the upgrade over the winter.
I may even do the engine mounts sooner.
Anyway, it appears I'm halfway to whupping those 260 ass's.... I've already got Ohlins fitted
I think I'll hold off any major work this year and spend the money on track days and tyres.
See how it performs and then possibly do the upgrade over the winter.
I may even do the engine mounts sooner.
Anyway, it appears I'm halfway to whupping those 260 ass's.... I've already got Ohlins fitted
The Pits said:
At Spa his 260 was keeping up with 911 GT3s, at Spa for crying out loud! I could hardly believe it myself.
same here, no way will a (std) 260 cup be able to match the straight line speed/acceleration of a 911 GT3, all I can imagine is that either the GT3 was fubared/old/driven in the wrong gear.Imagine all you like.
I know different.
Above 100mph the porsche's straight line advantage increases of course.
But the 260 had enough to hang in there all the way round the lap bar the ludicrous kemmel straight but even there it was more of an eek than a streak away. And this is comparing with several GT3's, not just one.
I'm not so much raving about the Lotus on this occasion, just saying that it had enough to keep up with a vastly more expensive and imo hugely overrated car around a notorious power circuit. It's more a case of being underwhelmed by the 911 than being impressed with the Lotus. They really aren't 'all that'. My brother owns a 911, was in the car with me at the time and came to much the same conclusion. We were surprised how slow the GT3s are. After all the hype the magazines pour on them you keep expecting them to be more impressive.
Still refuse to believe it or accept it? Not much I can do about that but good luck to you.
I know different.
Above 100mph the porsche's straight line advantage increases of course.
But the 260 had enough to hang in there all the way round the lap bar the ludicrous kemmel straight but even there it was more of an eek than a streak away. And this is comparing with several GT3's, not just one.
I'm not so much raving about the Lotus on this occasion, just saying that it had enough to keep up with a vastly more expensive and imo hugely overrated car around a notorious power circuit. It's more a case of being underwhelmed by the 911 than being impressed with the Lotus. They really aren't 'all that'. My brother owns a 911, was in the car with me at the time and came to much the same conclusion. We were surprised how slow the GT3s are. After all the hype the magazines pour on them you keep expecting them to be more impressive.
Still refuse to believe it or accept it? Not much I can do about that but good luck to you.
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