Retromod - GTE - Alloy V6
Discussion
Recently finished fitting a modern engine into my 1970's Lotus 7, [replaced the boat anchor Ford X Flow], with a EFI Ford Zetec, Gives the car great performance and sensible economy.
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Looking for new project and was wondering whether a modern lightweight alloy V6 into a GTE had been done?? I searched online and couldn't find anything.
I was thinking of a 3 litre[Ford or Jag] for example where the donor car could be bought - used for awhile to sort mechanicals etc before the transplant.
What do you guys think - anybody done something similar - was it straightforward - what problems did you encounter?
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Looking for new project and was wondering whether a modern lightweight alloy V6 into a GTE had been done?? I searched online and couldn't find anything.
I was thinking of a 3 litre[Ford or Jag] for example where the donor car could be bought - used for awhile to sort mechanicals etc before the transplant.
What do you guys think - anybody done something similar - was it straightforward - what problems did you encounter?
Don't listen to the crap about it being sacriligeous, A modern engine in a classic gives you the best of everything - cheap Insurance - maybe tax exempt too - don't know much about the Volve V6 - I'd have thought the Ford/Jag option would be cheaper - could be wromg of course, depends on the donor cost??
Like Rene7 I've also put a modern engine into a classic lotus. If it were my project I'd go for the lightest/cheapest/easiest available engine gearbox combo' A modern alloy 3litre V6 will have 50-80% more power than the Crappy overweight thirsty essexV6 and weigh maybe 100kg's less whilst giving 50% improvement in MPG - whats not to like about this??
Go for it let us know how you're getting on
Like Rene7 I've also put a modern engine into a classic lotus. If it were my project I'd go for the lightest/cheapest/easiest available engine gearbox combo' A modern alloy 3litre V6 will have 50-80% more power than the Crappy overweight thirsty essexV6 and weigh maybe 100kg's less whilst giving 50% improvement in MPG - whats not to like about this??
Go for it let us know how you're getting on
Don't listen to the crap about it being sacriligeous, A modern engine in a classic gives you the best of everything - cheap Insurance - maybe tax exempt too - don't know much about the Volve V6 - I'd have thought the Ford/Jag option would be cheaper - could be wromg of course, depends on the donor cost??
Like Rene7 I've also put a modern engine into a classic lotus. If it were my project I'd go for the lightest/cheapest/easiest available engine gearbox combo' A modern alloy 3litre V6 will have 50-80% more power than the Crappy overweight thirsty essexV6 and weigh maybe 100kg's less - whats not to like about this??
Go for it let us know how you're getting on
On second thoughts - why not make it easier still and fit a 2 litre zetec - a simple drop in will also fit to your existing gearbox
A standard 2 litre zetec will have a genuine 160BHP which is probably 50BHP more than the Essex, hope this helps
Like Rene7 I've also put a modern engine into a classic lotus. If it were my project I'd go for the lightest/cheapest/easiest available engine gearbox combo' A modern alloy 3litre V6 will have 50-80% more power than the Crappy overweight thirsty essexV6 and weigh maybe 100kg's less - whats not to like about this??
Go for it let us know how you're getting on
On second thoughts - why not make it easier still and fit a 2 litre zetec - a simple drop in will also fit to your existing gearbox
A standard 2 litre zetec will have a genuine 160BHP which is probably 50BHP more than the Essex, hope this helps
Edited by S47 on Sunday 14th May 18:13
Edited by S47 on Sunday 14th May 18:14
This gives plenty of power and is pretty cheap. An easily achievable 300 brake and bullet proof reliability.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/VOLVO-XC90-T6-2-9-PETROL...
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/VOLVO-XC90-T6-2-9-PETROL...
Thanks for suggestions guys - The volvo engine is turbo [Not for me thanks I'd rather N/A] plus for the cost of that engine you can buy the Whole donor car which will have other items to contribute such as all electrics - exhaust manifold, fuel pump, ECU - etc. etc!!
I like the zetec idea but it is the engine possibly too long being 4straight cylinders? [I don't know] plus at 2 litres it's a bit small/negative. I'd like to keep a V6 3 litre engine if poss.
Alfa is Alfa with all Italian probs including parts etc, possible though Ford/Jag would be easier/cheaper, There's also a toyota V6 which fits the bill - for me the Retromod thing is an economical way of improving a classic - it's part of the fun IMO, cheap donor with decent mechanicals = well worth the time and effort spent to achieve it [ I've plenty of time and effort to give FOC - I'm retired], not an excessive amount of money,[ but enough to do a pukka job without being wasteful]- shall we say.
I like the idea of bolting to existing scimitar gearbox 'a la Zetec', any decent alloy v6 bolt straight to the original gearbox? - I hadn't considered this possibilty!
Well done keep up the suggestions
I like the zetec idea but it is the engine possibly too long being 4straight cylinders? [I don't know] plus at 2 litres it's a bit small/negative. I'd like to keep a V6 3 litre engine if poss.
Alfa is Alfa with all Italian probs including parts etc, possible though
Ford/Jag would be easier/cheaper, There's also a toyota V6 which fits the bill - for me the Retromod thing is an economical way of improving a classic - it's part of the fun IMO, cheap donor with decent mechanicals = well worth the time and effort spent to achieve it [ I've plenty of time and effort to give FOC - I'm retired], not an excessive amount of money,[ but enough to do a pukka job without being wasteful]- shall we say.I like the idea of bolting to existing scimitar gearbox 'a la Zetec', any decent alloy v6 bolt straight to the original gearbox? - I hadn't considered this possibilty!
Well done keep up the suggestions
If you want a whole donor, perhaps then the bombproof Jaguar AJ16 supercharged straight six is a good candidate which can be mated to either manual or GM GL80e autobox?
You can buy a dead or dying XJR for peanuts (and it's the body that goes, not the engine). Get a Link ECU or some such, bigger pulley for the supercharger, Maxbore-type throttle body conversion, decat and you're looking at around 400bhp (reliable) without major mucking around with the engine. Should help shift the car along. IIRC, the engine is a good 200lbs lighter than the XJ engine of the 40s-80s.
The only real complexity is the need to mate the engine to an aftermarket ECU.
P
You can buy a dead or dying XJR for peanuts (and it's the body that goes, not the engine). Get a Link ECU or some such, bigger pulley for the supercharger, Maxbore-type throttle body conversion, decat and you're looking at around 400bhp (reliable) without major mucking around with the engine. Should help shift the car along. IIRC, the engine is a good 200lbs lighter than the XJ engine of the 40s-80s.
The only real complexity is the need to mate the engine to an aftermarket ECU.
P
I still like the older 940 engine. 4 cylinder 2.3 litre wit a LPT is makes 130bhp but with a MBC inserted it'll make upwards of 200bhp, with loads of torque and built of granite reliability.
On a different tack, I was enquiring about a GTC yesterday which has a modded 3.1 Cologne V6 under the bonnet.
You need to be careful with engine swops now though. Too may changes, chassis, axles or whatever and the DVLA Mafia get you. I'm getting more concerned about things we used to do without worrying back in the "good old days".
On a different tack, I was enquiring about a GTC yesterday which has a modded 3.1 Cologne V6 under the bonnet.
You need to be careful with engine swops now though. Too may changes, chassis, axles or whatever and the DVLA Mafia get you. I'm getting more concerned about things we used to do without worrying back in the "good old days".
Spoke to SWMBO about this - she'll be looking for a new ride soon, and likes the Idea of a classic with its running cost savings Tax exempt/cheap Insurance etc. so a Scimitar GTE 'Retromod' is a distinct possibility well done rene7, you may have found us a new project too
Done some more research on this:-
Engine weights/power -
Ford Essex - 200Kg/ 140BHP probably more like 120-125 PS
Jaguar V6 - 160Kg/ 220BHP PS - [real horses]
On the road weights are rather different too:- GTE approx 1200Kg - Jag 'S'type V6 approx 1600Kg
If and when I fit the Jag V6 the car ought to be about 50Kg less overall which will be a good improvement.
OOI Fitted with Essex the GTE gets maybe 20MPG + The alloy V6 Jag gets 27MPG but,that when fitted to GTE [because of significantly lower weight] 30MPG should be easy to achieve, there's about 500Kg less to hump about!!
Now that improvement is really significant, we also ain't mentioned the extra BHP which should make the GTE really 'NIPPY'
Done some more research on this:-
Engine weights/power -
Ford Essex - 200Kg/ 140BHP probably more like 120-125 PS
Jaguar V6 - 160Kg/ 220BHP PS - [real horses]
On the road weights are rather different too:- GTE approx 1200Kg - Jag 'S'type V6 approx 1600Kg
If and when I fit the Jag V6 the car ought to be about 50Kg less overall which will be a good improvement.
OOI Fitted with Essex the GTE gets maybe 20MPG + The alloy V6 Jag gets 27MPG but,that when fitted to GTE [because of significantly lower weight] 30MPG should be easy to achieve, there's about 500Kg less to hump about!!
Now that improvement is really significant, we also ain't mentioned the extra BHP which should make the GTE really 'NIPPY'
S47
Go for it - email me through PH and we'll swop tips and info' etc
You seem to know what to look for in a major upgrade, like you I'm going for the Jag engine/box combo, I'd prefer the Autobox, don't know whether that will make the process more difficult though - any thoughts on this?
Go for it - email me through PH and we'll swop tips and info' etc
You seem to know what to look for in a major upgrade, like you I'm going for the Jag engine/box combo, I'd prefer the Autobox, don't know whether that will make the process more difficult though - any thoughts on this?
Get over to scimitarweb for Gte projects with Omega V6, Alfa V6, Jag V6, Lexus V8 among the standard cars.
Don't under-estimate engine conversions, though. Getting an engine and gearbox into any car is easy. Modifying coolant systems, exhausts systems, etc., etc., etc. is where the challenges and expenditure happen.
Don't under-estimate engine conversions, though. Getting an engine and gearbox into any car is easy. Modifying coolant systems, exhausts systems, etc., etc., etc. is where the challenges and expenditure happen.
Darryl247W said:
Don't under-estimate engine conversions, though. Getting an engine and gearbox into any car is easy. Modifying coolant systems, exhausts systems, etc., etc., etc. is where the challenges and expenditure happen.
^^^ This.I put a modern 2.8 straight six into an E21 and the knock-on effect pushed the build cost pretty high. It was well worth it though.
e21Mark
Installing a different engine is normally OK provided you have the lifting tackle etc.
Piping up the cooling and exhaust systems depends on the skills of the installer, for me I'd consider these Very simple tasks indeed,
I've done 4 retromods without any probs at all, the scimitar will be easy coz the exhaust is hidden under the car, unlike my 7 which runs along the side of car for all to see [ and pick faults with]
thanks for the concern tho'
any helpful suggestions
Installing a different engine is normally OK provided you have the lifting tackle etc.
Piping up the cooling and exhaust systems depends on the skills of the installer, for me I'd consider these Very simple tasks indeed,
I've done 4 retromods without any probs at all, the scimitar will be easy coz the exhaust is hidden under the car, unlike my 7 which runs along the side of car for all to see [ and pick faults with]
thanks for the concern tho'
any helpful suggestions
I've got a SE5a GTE here in the US and I too have thought a restomod using a modern V6 would be a great way to go, add aircon too. I was thinking along the lines of a Toyota, Honda or Nissan V6 engine. Just about every Camry and Accord over here has a V6 but I think most are FWD and 99% automatic (which isn't the end of the world). What about the engine from a Nissan 350Z? Aren't they available in a manual and RWD? Surely there must be some of those creeping into breakers yards now?
Its the wiring and engine management that would scare the heck out of me.
I would have thought 200hp would be more than adequate for a lively ride.
Would like to hear how you get on.
Its the wiring and engine management that would scare the heck out of me.
I would have thought 200hp would be more than adequate for a lively ride.
Would like to hear how you get on.
Geeman237
Nissan 350z would be ok - buy the complete car and use as much as you can off it, for example if the electrics frightens you, then transfer the whole nissan wiring loom to the GTE, if you want aircon this would make the electrics for that much easier too
Buying an engine and then trying to find a suitable gearbox is do-able but a lot more aggro. for a major swop it's far easier to use as much from the engine donor car as possible - hope this helps. Just remember to replace items that wear out, such as timing belt/water pump/clutch etc when the donor engine's on the garage floor!
OOI didn't the naughties V6 'S' type Jag make it to USA? in UK I'd say that it makes the ideal donor for this swop coz they can be bought for peanuts here [who wants a 10 year old rusty Jag?]- other potential donors would be toyota supras or rear wheel drive alfa's as already mentioned
Nissan 350z would be ok - buy the complete car and use as much as you can off it, for example if the electrics frightens you, then transfer the whole nissan wiring loom to the GTE, if you want aircon this would make the electrics for that much easier too
Buying an engine and then trying to find a suitable gearbox is do-able but a lot more aggro. for a major swop it's far easier to use as much from the engine donor car as possible - hope this helps. Just remember to replace items that wear out, such as timing belt/water pump/clutch etc when the donor engine's on the garage floor!
OOI didn't the naughties V6 'S' type Jag make it to USA? in UK I'd say that it makes the ideal donor for this swop coz they can be bought for peanuts here [who wants a 10 year old rusty Jag?]- other potential donors would be toyota supras or rear wheel drive alfa's as already mentioned
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