Tax (how much???)
Discussion
In the process of moving to France and looking for some very rough guidance on what level of income tax we can expect to pay, once everything has been deducted (ie CGS, RDS, ASSEDIC etc etc). As really have no clue. Both myself and my wife will be full time employed, living in rented accomodation with no kids!!
Any guidance (no matter how rough) much appreciated.
Also any advice or thots on how to deal with the incomes we receive from rental properties we own in the UK.
Thanks
Any guidance (no matter how rough) much appreciated.
Also any advice or thots on how to deal with the incomes we receive from rental properties we own in the UK.
Thanks
If you're running your own business then prepare to be arse raped over URSSAF.
See here http://www.anglais.urssaf.fr/
See here http://www.anglais.urssaf.fr/
When we decided to live in France, I asked a similar question of a French accountant - he said the tax would be about the same as the UK - he forgot to mention Social charges, which seem huge compared to the UK.
Employed friends tell me their payment slip is an A4 sheet detailing all the social charges which amount to about 45% of income - your employer will also pay heavily for the privilege of employing you so the state benefits are good. Tax is payable after Social charges are deducted.
I am sure that expat websites will give you a far clearer picture than this forum, but I would suggest that you expect them to be high.
Employed friends tell me their payment slip is an A4 sheet detailing all the social charges which amount to about 45% of income - your employer will also pay heavily for the privilege of employing you so the state benefits are good. Tax is payable after Social charges are deducted.
I am sure that expat websites will give you a far clearer picture than this forum, but I would suggest that you expect them to be high.
rdjohn said:
When we decided to live in France, I asked a similar question of a French accountant - he said the tax would be about the same as the UK - he forgot to mention Social charges, which seem huge compared to the UK.
Employed friends tell me their payment slip is an A4 sheet detailing all the social charges which amount to about 45% of income - your employer will also pay heavily for the privilege of employing you so the state benefits are good. Tax is payable after Social charges are deducted.
I am sure that expat websites will give you a far clearer picture than this forum, but I would suggest that you expect them to be high.
As you say, the social charges here make you Employed friends tell me their payment slip is an A4 sheet detailing all the social charges which amount to about 45% of income - your employer will also pay heavily for the privilege of employing you so the state benefits are good. Tax is payable after Social charges are deducted.
I am sure that expat websites will give you a far clearer picture than this forum, but I would suggest that you expect them to be high.
Alonso said:
Good shout, thanks!!!As others have said it's the social charges that kill the French. But for your interest the tax bands are as follows:
Tranches de revenus et taux applicables aux revenus 2009 (impôt 2010)
Jusqu’à 5 875 € 0 %
de 5 875 € à 11 720 € 5,5 %
de 11 720 € à 26 030 € 14 %
de 26 030 € à 69 783 € 30 %
Plus de 69 783 € 40 %
And of course these tax bands are cumulative and you take off any social security charges to start with then deduct a basic 10% reduction. So f'rinstance, if you earned 70,000€, deduct social charges of say 23% (typical), leaving 53,900. Take off 10% so taxable income would be 48,510 to pay tax on. And tax on that comes out at c8,700€ or just about 12% of your 70K income.
Also French tax is worked out as joint husband and wife family deal. So if you earn 25K and your wife earns 45K then as a family you've got income of 70K so divide by 2 and work the tax out on that using the above bands, then multiply the tax bill by 2. Oh and for each child you get an extra 0.5. So if you're married with two kids, you divide the family income by 3, do the tax calc and then multiply by 3. Sounds complicated but try it and it makes a lot of sense. On the above M+2 kids earning 70K example, you'd end up with a tax bill of just 2,800€ oir 4%. Not bad eh!!!! But you've got to be married (or sign a PACS), none of this living in sin rubbish. HTH.
As you can see it's not too difficult but OMHO worth paying an accountant to do it for you. I pay 210€ a year for my accountant and so far he's saved me well over 24K in the past 3 years.
Tranches de revenus et taux applicables aux revenus 2009 (impôt 2010)
Jusqu’à 5 875 € 0 %
de 5 875 € à 11 720 € 5,5 %
de 11 720 € à 26 030 € 14 %
de 26 030 € à 69 783 € 30 %
Plus de 69 783 € 40 %
And of course these tax bands are cumulative and you take off any social security charges to start with then deduct a basic 10% reduction. So f'rinstance, if you earned 70,000€, deduct social charges of say 23% (typical), leaving 53,900. Take off 10% so taxable income would be 48,510 to pay tax on. And tax on that comes out at c8,700€ or just about 12% of your 70K income.
Also French tax is worked out as joint husband and wife family deal. So if you earn 25K and your wife earns 45K then as a family you've got income of 70K so divide by 2 and work the tax out on that using the above bands, then multiply the tax bill by 2. Oh and for each child you get an extra 0.5. So if you're married with two kids, you divide the family income by 3, do the tax calc and then multiply by 3. Sounds complicated but try it and it makes a lot of sense. On the above M+2 kids earning 70K example, you'd end up with a tax bill of just 2,800€ oir 4%. Not bad eh!!!! But you've got to be married (or sign a PACS), none of this living in sin rubbish. HTH.
As you can see it's not too difficult but OMHO worth paying an accountant to do it for you. I pay 210€ a year for my accountant and so far he's saved me well over 24K in the past 3 years.
As per another thread I've done this has been an interesting read.
Subject to things going well I'm looking to move over to France with my long term (5 years) girlfriend. Unfortunately, she suffers from CFS/ME (Chronic Fatigue Syndrome) and as such isn't in a position to work at present.
This PACS setup sounds a bit like a civil partnership equivalent in England, but not as legally binding based on what I've read? If getting a PACS drawn up would mean we would be better off financially with regards to Tax that sounds pretty good news to me.....
Am I reading this right, or just looking for loopholes ¬_¬
Certainly interested in your use of an accountant, I guess as a permanent employee I'd be on the French equivalent of PAYE... but as I understand it, things aren't quite so straightforward as here in Blighty !
Subject to things going well I'm looking to move over to France with my long term (5 years) girlfriend. Unfortunately, she suffers from CFS/ME (Chronic Fatigue Syndrome) and as such isn't in a position to work at present.
This PACS setup sounds a bit like a civil partnership equivalent in England, but not as legally binding based on what I've read? If getting a PACS drawn up would mean we would be better off financially with regards to Tax that sounds pretty good news to me.....
Am I reading this right, or just looking for loopholes ¬_¬
Certainly interested in your use of an accountant, I guess as a permanent employee I'd be on the French equivalent of PAYE... but as I understand it, things aren't quite so straightforward as here in Blighty !
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