Icelandic bank - just nationalised!! Their 3rd biggest

[Welshbeef]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/7641753.stm

Oh dear.... so far this week
B&B
Fortis
Icelandic Bank.

Things are getting really bad very quickly.

[V8mate]

I really wish governments would step back and leave this to the market to sort out.

We're looking at a good ten years of fiscal misery to settle all this debt. Why should I pay for the poor performance of other people's businesses?

[sleep envy]

you will one way or another

you think if a bank collapses it won't affect the public purse?

[Welshbeef]

What if the $700billion vote today goes the wrong way ... what next?

[Fittster]

Welshbeef said:

What if the $700billion vote today goes the wrong way ... what next?

What is the wrong?

[Welshbeef]

The UK's annual tax revenue is around the £480billion mark.

We are taking on B&B Mortgage debt - which is risky.

I guess the Govt will combine NR & B&B mortgage divisions (which might lessen the risk of the mortgage books).

[V8mate]

sleep envy said:

you will one way or another

you think if a bank collapses it won't affect the public purse?

A bank is simply a pile of credits and a pile of debits - both have a marketable value. People who owe banks money would not notice anything if their bank failed as the debt, together with its T&Cs would simply be transferred/sold through administration. People with large financial deposits are likely to be affected, but as I'm not one of them it doesn't affect me. Apart from when the government decides that I should be affected by having to 'help' cover those lost investments.

I never signed an agreement authorising the state to take a portion of my income for the greater 'social' benefit of the country I live in. I CERTAINLY didn't sign any agreement to help pay back poorly invested money to wealthy people and the wealthy people employed to feck about with that capital.

[cs02rm0]

V8mate said:

sleep envy said:

you will one way or another

you think if a bank collapses it won't affect the public purse?

A bank is simply a pile of credits and a pile of debits - both have a marketable value. People who owe banks money would not notice anything if their bank failed as the debt, together with its T&Cs would simply be transferred/sold through administration. People with large financial deposits are likely to be affected, but as I'm not one of them it doesn't affect me. Apart from when the government decides that I should be affected by having to 'help' cover those lost investments.

I never signed an agreement authorising the state to take a portion of my income for the greater 'social' benefit of the country I live in. I CERTAINLY didn't sign any agreement to help pay back poorly invested money to wealthy people and the wealthy people employed to feck about with that capital.

Whoever voted the labour party in did just that for you.

[sleep envy]

V8mate said:

Apart from when the government decides that I should be affected by having to 'help' cover those lost investments.

will you be affected more or less if the bank were left to go to the wall rather than being nationalised by the govt?

[Welshbeef]

Fittster said:

Welshbeef said:

What if the $700billion vote today goes the wrong way ... what next?

What is the wrong?

My point exactly!
Clearly in the land of theory its totally the wrong thing to do - the market should ride out the storm and there will be winners & losers.
However in the real world where peoples lives could be ruined Im not sure which is the right way to go. Its a dire situation, truely is.

[V8mate]

cs02rm0 said:

V8mate said:

sleep envy said:

you will one way or another

you think if a bank collapses it won't affect the public purse?

A bank is simply a pile of credits and a pile of debits - both have a marketable value. People who owe banks money would not notice anything if their bank failed as the debt, together with its T&Cs would simply be transferred/sold through administration. People with large financial deposits are likely to be affected, but as I'm not one of them it doesn't affect me. Apart from when the government decides that I should be affected by having to 'help' cover those lost investments.

I never signed an agreement authorising the state to take a portion of my income for the greater 'social' benefit of the country I live in. I CERTAINLY didn't sign any agreement to help pay back poorly invested money to wealthy people and the wealthy people employed to feck about with that capital.

Whoever voted the labour party in did just that for you.

True. But don't imagine for one moment that a Cameron-led Nu-Tories would have done anything any differently. When even the Americans start baling out failed commercial enterprises you just know that the whole bl00dy world has taken a socialist turn for the worst.

[Welshbeef]

sleep envy said:

V8mate said:

Apart from when the government decides that I should be affected by having to 'help' cover those lost investments.

will you be affected more or less if the bank were left to go to the wall rather than being nationalised by the govt?

Reading Prestons blog he thinks its going to cost the UK banks between £9 - 10 billion.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/robertpest...

And reading it in full you can see that what will happen is the consumer pays. Im pretty sure we will now see the end of "free banking" so everyone get ready for that, also get ready for much higher Mortgage costs interest rates are going to be much higher for a very long time.

[Welshbeef]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/7642126.stm

This is getting worse - nnow Citi Group are buying Wachovia thats the 4th largest US bank which was failing. And its willing to absorb its £23billion losses!!

Where will this end?

Fortis
B&B
Wachovia
3rd largest bank of Iceland
NR
HBOS
LB
Freddie Mac
Fannie Mae
Alliance & Leicester
Those 2 mutuals which asked nationwide to take them over
Washington Mutual


Can anyone else add to this?

[Timmy35]

sleep envy said:

V8mate said:

Apart from when the government decides that I should be affected by having to 'help' cover those lost investments.

will you be affected more or less if the bank were left to go to the wall rather than being nationalised by the govt?

try selling your house or getting a car/business loan if the banking system ceases to exist.

[sleep envy]

not forgetting public spending and revenue...

[V8mate]

Timmy35 said:

sleep envy said:

V8mate said:

Apart from when the government decides that I should be affected by having to 'help' cover those lost investments.

will you be affected more or less if the bank were left to go to the wall rather than being nationalised by the govt?

try selling your house or getting a car/business loan if the banking system ceases to exist.

Who said anything about the entire system ceasing to exist? What a facile response. We're talking about the failure of a small number of banking companies who have chosen to follow a poor business model.

If M&S went bust this week, would/should the governmet step in there too? Why are banks considered any differently to any other commercial organisation?

[Welshbeef]

Timmy35 said:

sleep envy said:

V8mate said:

Apart from when the government decides that I should be affected by having to 'help' cover those lost investments.

will you be affected more or less if the bank were left to go to the wall rather than being nationalised by the govt?

try selling your house or getting a car/business loan if the banking system ceases to exist.

Try getting a credit limit increase on your credit card, try getting an overdraft limit increase on your current account.

Car loan - forget about it.

[sleep envy]

your thinking has been seen in practice before

Andrew W. Mellon, he got it wrong

[Soir]

Welshbeef said:

Timmy35 said:

sleep envy said:

V8mate said:

Apart from when the government decides that I should be affected by having to 'help' cover those lost investments.

will you be affected more or less if the bank were left to go to the wall rather than being nationalised by the govt?

try selling your house or getting a car/business loan if the banking system ceases to exist.

Try getting a credit limit increase on your credit card, try getting an overdraft limit increase on your current account.

Car loan - forget about it.

this is the root of the problem, credit culture. Maybe it will become like previous generations...if you cannot save for it (bar mortgage) then you can't have it.

[Welshbeef]

Soir - Im with you on that one, but its going to be hard to change for many people 15 years of this culture of boom boom boom now the Bust is here well its a long time ago/ can everyone still remember how to live like that?

I always demand we pay cash (well credit card and pay in full 56 days later)and if we want something lets save up for it and oddly enough when it comes down to it its now an extra say £80pcm into a savings pot oh "Im a bit short this month" "well tough we either want it or we dont or it will take us longer to get it".

Many times once saved up we rethink do we really really want this? If we dont - additional mortgage payment.