"Fathers"

[ChristianZS]

Right.. Im gonna try keep this as short as possible and not go into much detail. Sorry If it comes out as bumbled rambling.

Things have never been Father/Son between us really. A lot of water has gone under the bridge and a lot of promises broken, arguments, and also some happy times.

He's been with his current partner for about 11years or so and my younger brother and myself have tried our best to accept her and always been open and loving towards her including myself mainly having the odd arguement of feeling hard done by and mainly the kids "Out of sight, out of mind" despite being told he thinks about us everyday and all that rubbish.

We dont see each other very often and are probably both at fault on that one, I do try calling him every couple of weeks but nobody ever answers or his mobile is switched off(99.9% of the time). The only go between we really have is my nanna(his mum) who I see including Father2(Grandfather) a good few times a week and spend most of my saturdays sat drinking tea, smoking cigs, and eating all the food nanna`s make you eat.

I finally managed to get hold of my dad and his partner on Saturday afternoon and drove the 30mins to where they live.

I walked through the door to be greeted with a table full of "Congratulations" cards and a photo of them prooudly in the registry office signing those all important papers. Being in my slightly laid back state I sat down and he blerted it all out. Two weeks previous they had both decided to get married and decided to have a "Small Do" and only invite 8 people.. Alright I thought.. My nanna & grandad apparently had a lovely time and whatnot, plenty of drunken moments and all the rest and so everyone had a fantastic time. He asked me a few times if I were bothered and I just replied "No..Not at all. Well done and all the rest", I stayed civil for a whole hour and went through the usual not been doing much, Im off here and there in the next couple of months, While they happily sipped away the next can of lager.

Upon leaving the usual "You should come round more" line were uttered. I told him I call regularly and all he could come out with very sheepishly is "Try More then,Or Ring me at work". I agreed stupidly and set off back home.

Sunday.

I popped down to my Nanna`s as usual for a cup of tea and a cig and to just get my head around the previous day, while nursing a hangover to rival most. My "Father" had managed to get her and my Grandad to swear absolute fking secrecy and them being honest people respected his wishes albeit totally against their morals. Apparently my Grandad(On holiday with his chaps drinking) had thrown an absolute wobbler about what was going on but kept schtum. My Nanna said it felt really wrong doing so and it would have made the day if me and my brother were there with them.

I have no bad feelings against my Nanna and Grandad and never could .no matter what. They have always been there through a hell of a lot of st. My Nanna also said "Well I dont think I'l be seeing your dad for a while now", Im unsure what she exactly meant by this, None of us really see him too often. I totally accept that 15years has gone since the split and people are living their lives.

My Dad and his now "Wife" have suggested that when I get back from Orlando that them and my missus of 2years(He has never met her. Not through anything else that finding time when we are all about and free) That we should go out for a meal and a drink or whatever. I know they arent exactly chucking it about so I accept on this I will be paying and I will happily pay as I have spare. Im in two minds whether to actually bother. I dont want to be sat there in some restaurant playing that everything is rosey and happy hey hey when its not. Im not a false person, Im honest and straight with people and expect to be treated that way too.

RE: The Wedding... Now 8 people is My Nanna and Grandad (2), their friends(2), Her mother(1), ..Im trying to guess the rest as nobody wants to say but I'm assuming its her two sons. I dont want to get absolutely bhy,but, Exactly what is so bad about me and my brother that he/they didnt tell us that they were getting married??

Im not a bad lad, I dont get in trouble, do drugs, Im no workshy layabout.. I have a respectable job for 21, and I feel I'm happy with life and the missus.. My younger brother is neither a bad lad. 19, Web Developer for the company I have worked with for 5years, and never gets into any trouble.

I'm absolutely racking my brains for ideas Why such a thing as he is re-marrying simply gets forgot to tell his own sons?? Take her sons... One is 21 also, Has packed catalogues in boxes for the past 5years. The other is a little bit older, wandering drug addict, job to job, no real path in life. Im sure they got told by their mother that she was remarrying.

I'm guessing that its just come to the point now where I'm tempted for my own sake just to cut all ties with him and have done with this headfk of ste. We dont know whether we are coming or going with him and just feel basically let down with the past 5/6+years of events of being let down and left out of everything really. I have my own life to live and people do move on or whatever but I'm just finding it hard. As much as we dont see eye to eye in the end of the day he is my Dad. I dont ever forget that fact either...

Im in no way wanting sympathy, Just opinions or thoughts.. What do I do next? Should I keep in contact after that last stunt?

Sorry for the crap grammar, spelling, sentence structure or anything else you can pick out.

[ATTAK Z]

Tell me about your cars

[xllifts]

Because your Dad didn't invite you or your brother doesn't mean that it was done with malice.
He may well have thought that you and your brother may have not coped with it very well and was trying to spare feelings.
That said you may tell me different.

Whatever you do don't cut ties with him you will regret it,if not now but later in life.

I have a similar situation with my 10 year old i am about to marry my new fiance but am struggling with do i tell him or not.

What you need to do is meet your Dad with your Nana and TALK tell him how you feel really feel and try to work through it,it will take time and effort from both sides and a lot of giving.

Hope all works out for you, i really mean that too.
I lost a daughter when i left the ex she got into STUFF and regret that in some ways i contributed to that

Life is too short to hold grudges.

[RobJShe]

I must say you are in a situation I do not envy. Now, not wanting to sound a w**ker, why don`t you and your Dad meet up together, just the two of you and settle the score as it were. Easier said than done I admit but, I think he will be expecting his Sons to want to know more pretty soon so he is probably half-prepared for it. Keep your good lady out of it for now and between you and your brother try and find out more whilst still being the loving son that you come across as being.

[moleamol]

ChristianZS said:

What do I do next? Should I keep in contact after that last stunt?

I was never extremely close with my dad and he died a week ago. My advice is don't make a big deal of it and do your best to get to know him better. They're a long time gone.

[outlaw biker]

Yep, life is short, grow up, don't be a tt.

[ozzerr]

Tell him how you feel dont just walk away,I am guessing he feels like he has been bad to you guys and because of this he now finds it hard to get close to you.Talk to him it will deffo build a bridge.

[H_Kan]

outlaw biker said:

Yep, life is short, grow up, don't be a tt.

Sorry, but his dad has just got married on the sly and made the OP's grandparents swear secrecy.

He's hardly throwing a temper tantrum over a little thing. I get the impression that he makes effort to ring etc but this is largely fruitless.

Xllift's I get what you are saying about your kid, but I would urge you to tell them, anything else isn't really fair on them. Also, the fact that the OP's father made no effort to conceal the wedding when he went round suggests this wasn't really his motivation.

OP, whether you sever ties etc is upto you, but I would urge you to clear the air in a meeting with him and your brother. Don't get your missus involved till you are sure where you stand, get this sorted first. Also make sure your brother is involved as well, otherwise he could end up feeling more left out then the 2 of you already feel.

[Famous Graham]

My old man was persona non grata after he played away and was the instrument of my parents' divorce some 12 years or so ago.

However, he, my sister and I got together to go to the Rugby World Cup in Oz back in '03 and, while I can never really forgive him for what happened, it turned out to be a fantastic trip in terms of getting things resolved and mending bridges and all that (quite apart from the result of the tournament )

Fast forward to this year and I attended his wedding in Melbourne (not to the woman involved at the beginning, I hasten to add - I'd never have gone to that) and it seemed to be the final piece of the jigsaw that enabled us to draw a line under the crap from years ago and start afresh.

It did take some effort of will (and emotion if I'm honest) on both trips to broach various subjects, but I'm very glad that I did.

So, while your old man's obviously been, at the very least, rather insensitive, I'd swallow your pride and sort out a beer or three with just the two of you and try and clear the air.

[moleamol]

TVR Moneypit said:

moleamol said:

ChristianZS said:

What do I do next? Should I keep in contact after that last stunt?

I was never extremely close with my dad and he died a week ago. My advice is don't make a big deal of it and do your best to get to know him better. They're a long time gone.

The problem is, some Fathers don't want to know their sons. I guess they see them as some sort of embarasment?

Take my old man for example. I'm 31, he's 61. I'm self employed and I do ok. Married to a wonderfull woman, no kids. Never been in trouble either. I never went to uni, in fact, I haven't even got a single GCSE as I left school at 14 to work 70+ hours a week for a local 'charactor'.

In my 31 years, I honestly cant remember one single occasion where my Father has praised a single thing that I have done. I even got a beating for only getting an "A" in wood work, and not an "A" *

My parents may be going away for the weekend. "Dad, would you like to borrow the TVR?" "No, it's crap" according to him. "Dad, would you like to go clay pidgeon shooting?" "Not with you I wouldn't" will be his response. "Dad, do you want to go off-roading?" "No." "Dad, do you want to go to Monaco to watch the F1 GP?" Again, "Not if your taking me".

Never says please, never says thankyou, even when I bought him several hundred pounds worth of fine Scotch whiskey for his 60th birthday present.

After he got bummed in a dodgy property deal in Spain, I offered to bail him out to the tune of 5 figures, only to get it thrown back in my face.

Some Fathers simply don't want to know their children, full stop. I suspect that the OP's is one of them.

My advice would be to tell the guy exactly what you think, not only of his current behaviour, but his failings as a Father and a man in the past, then walk. As you have said, your better off without the head f#ck.

A week after your dad dies, come back and tell me if you feel the same way.

Edited by moleamol on Thursday 11th September 03:51

[carerra g tea]

TVRMoneyPit,
I suspect your dad puts up a brave front and it's just gotten worse and worse over time, resulting in today's acerbic persona. I don't think he hates you. Underneath it all, there might be some resentment, at having to be bailed out by his son. Not an easy thing to accept/cope with for any proud old-fashioned guy. He loves you and spends time with you and thinks this is normal, acceptable behaviour at this point. I suggest you think about how you want to be treated and where you want to be in the relationship, aim to get there in a year's time, and SLOWLY make changes to get there. Anything abrupt will destroy the relationship. You could give examples of similar behaviour by others, and explain how much it hurt you or bothered you. And when he talks to you in a way you don't like, just say "You can't possibly mean that as it came across, do you know how it sounds?" and then describe what is unacceptable about his tone or words. Then tell him what you think he meant to say and ask if you are right. That might make him change (gradually). Or it might not. Good luck.

Same with the OP. I don't suggest a confrontation. It would lead to defensive denials, shock, hurt, resentment, anger. Slow change of course and attitude, and you will be fine. You are angry and hurt, don't let it become a permanent cancer. Don't break off all ties. I bet he didn't mean any malice towards you. Or he wouldn't be reaching out now (however small and crappy the gesture).

People are complicated and relationships are hard.

[carerra g tea]

TVR Moneypit said:

My advice would be to tell the guy exactly what you think, not only of his current behaviour, but his failings as a Father and a man in the past, then walk. As you have said, your better off without the head f#ck.

Anger. It subsides and leaves you feeling very empty and desolate if you do things like this while angry. Don't do this or you will damage yourself for life. Long after dad is dead and gone, leaving you wondering what the funeral was like and who said what and who threw the first clump. Don't do this to yourself.

[moleamol]

TVR Moneypit said:

Sorry to hear of your loss and all that, but I do wonder why some people even bother to have children if they are never going to take an interest in them.

Cheers mate, it means a lot.

[carerra g tea]

TVR Moneypit said:

carerra g tea said:

I bet he didn't mean any malice towards you.

I'm sorry, but he didn't even get invited to his own Fathers wedding. Personally, I'd consider that to be quite a strong f#ck off tablet. How could it not be meant with anything but malice? It's not like he could have forgotten that he had a couple of children that may appriciate an invite is it?

Because he was uncomfortable about it and thought his sons might feel awkward as well. Because they are his flesh and blood and his wife's kids are not, so he thought he could make the bigger sacrifice and expected/imposed the bigger sacrifice on his sons as well. People shy away from what they have difficulty facing. He has difficulty facing his kids when he might be thinking that they see him as deserting their mother or dishonouring their mother. It might not even be that explicit, just a feeling the father has or had, that led him to his (mistaken) course of action. We all make mistakes. Some bigger than others, admittedly, but nothing that a bit of understanding/compassion/maturity can't overcome. At least, that's my take from the OP. I am convinced that cutting off all communications with the father will not resolve anything, and lead to a lifetime of guilt, hurt, anger, bitterness, etc. Worth it? I don't think so. On the other hand, making the best of it will mean that he will know he did what he could, and that's all anyone can do...clear conscience, and some good memories, some bad, perhaps some whopping bad ones, but on the whole, like everyone else.

[Jazzer77]

ChristianZS - I have had my fair share of family drama.
Straight talking within the family is the only route I see forward, your father has messed you about for years. Allowing this to happen has made you seem like a doormat and hence no invite to the wedding - not even a phone call to let you know what happened.
I'd tell him to stick his idea of a cosy dinner where the sun dont shine , explaining why and then cut all ties.

[Cara Van Man]

ChristianZS,

Your father sounds like a weak little man. So weak, he couldn't even insist his sons were at his wedding.

Shameful.

Keep what you have with your grandparents as it sounds as though they are your true family. It sounds like they have 'sided' with you.

fk him and his new wife.

Hope things work out for you.

Edited by Cara Van Man on Thursday 11th September 08:25

[Jasandjules]

Sounds like a face to face will get all confrontational.

What about writing a small note (you can take your time, and get it right) to explain that you are most upset that you weren't invited to his wedding and you would have liked to have been invited.

See what he says?

[968CSReading]

Look at it from his point of view. Maybe he feels that you should be making more effort.

Life is too short. My Dad died 3 years ago and it was sudden. There isnt a day go by that I dont miss him so stop feeling sorry for yourself and start fresh with him cos he might not be around for ever.

[Pvapour]

your father is prioritizing the well fare of his lady, he may feel that you will not get on with the in laws & cause trouble? I would imagine he's looking to make it a memorable day (in the right way) for him and his wife to be.

Dont take it personally it doesn't mean he loves you any less.

Your father will not be around forever so dont waste the valuable time you have by bickering.

[ALawson]

At least he hasn't got Dementia, so just deal with it. I wish I could have a chat with my "dad" not the shell that has been left by his illness.