Bullying, what to do?
Discussion
Over past couple of weeks, our kids (aged 9 for stepson and 11 for stepdaughter) have been subjected to bullying from a boy a few doors down, Damian (!!!), who is 12. He has, to date bent Kirsten's fingers back to such an extent that they hurt for days, and Ethan came back from the park crying yet again, because he suffered physical abuse from this little monster. Chantelle (the mother and my wife), has been round twice to complain about the unacceptable behavior, and twice the dad refused to come to the door, sending instead his (lot nicer) 16 year old daughter.
The bully even pulled faces at me earlier in defiance of Chantelle having a word yesterday (Lot of good that did!!), and I have to admit, I would love to give him a taste of his own medicine, but I can’t! It is so frustrating having your children bullied by someone so cowardly and a lot older.
What can I do? If I insist on having a word, I know that I will end up doing time, as I have witnessed the complete upset and physical marks on both kids. If I threaten his dad, it will probably be twisted around to portray me as the thug (he’s 60!)
Why should we restrict our children’s movements because of a single out of control bully?
Any advice most welcome, (before I end up killing someone!) :(
Only at times like this I realise how little power we have to discipline children, I feel completely helpless in protecting our children!
The bully even pulled faces at me earlier in defiance of Chantelle having a word yesterday (Lot of good that did!!), and I have to admit, I would love to give him a taste of his own medicine, but I can’t! It is so frustrating having your children bullied by someone so cowardly and a lot older.
What can I do? If I insist on having a word, I know that I will end up doing time, as I have witnessed the complete upset and physical marks on both kids. If I threaten his dad, it will probably be twisted around to portray me as the thug (he’s 60!)
Why should we restrict our children’s movements because of a single out of control bully?
Any advice most welcome, (before I end up killing someone!) :(
Only at times like this I realise how little power we have to discipline children, I feel completely helpless in protecting our children!
I can think of a lot of things to suggest but sadly none of them are legal and are likely to get your kids in trouble.
Best form of defence is often offence. Out of interest is there a big difference in size/strength etc, between him and your two?
Might be an idea for you to enrol them in some sort of self defence class.
If you want to get really difficult report the assault to the Police and get them to have a word. First time they might send a PC round to have a word and that might stop it. If not it is unlikely they will bother to send a copper round again until one have yours has lamped said lad with a piece of 2x4.
Make sure you catalogue every incident and photograph any injuries he causes.
Best form of defence is often offence. Out of interest is there a big difference in size/strength etc, between him and your two?
Might be an idea for you to enrol them in some sort of self defence class.
If you want to get really difficult report the assault to the Police and get them to have a word. First time they might send a PC round to have a word and that might stop it. If not it is unlikely they will bother to send a copper round again until one have yours has lamped said lad with a piece of 2x4.
Make sure you catalogue every incident and photograph any injuries he causes.
Combination of what Muncher and Tank Slapper said.
There are classes these days for self defence specifically to help bullied kids. A friend of mine's daughter - great kid, very laid back - got a few tips and earned a heap of respect when she laid a bully out. The police knew of the earlier problem so when the mother of the "little darling" bully cried to the police, she got nowhere.
The classes are very practical and don't need the karate outfit paraphernalia for learning a martial art. Just a little psychology lesson about bullies and how/where to strike for best effort.
Swift palm straight up the little f
kers chin works however big/hard they think they are. Bitten tongue, cracked teeth, sore neck - maybe even a bloody nose - and quite often they land square on the arse. 
There are classes these days for self defence specifically to help bullied kids. A friend of mine's daughter - great kid, very laid back - got a few tips and earned a heap of respect when she laid a bully out. The police knew of the earlier problem so when the mother of the "little darling" bully cried to the police, she got nowhere.
The classes are very practical and don't need the karate outfit paraphernalia for learning a martial art. Just a little psychology lesson about bullies and how/where to strike for best effort.
Swift palm straight up the little f
kers chin works however big/hard they think they are. Bitten tongue, cracked teeth, sore neck - maybe even a bloody nose - and quite often they land square on the arse. 2 stories
A colleagues daughter won junior all England Karate champion a few years ago, aged 12. Her school Head ever chasing good publicity called in the Press and re-presented her with the trophy in school assembly. 2 year 11 chavs decided to see how good she was at break time. Like most little girls she burst into tears the first time they hit her. The two really hard heros then decided putting the boot in was a good idea. Little girl realises she is now in serious trouble and uses her skills to get out of it. Eye witnesses said her last roundhouse kick actually made one of her assailants heads hit the floor before his body did. The previously proud (Lentil munching member of T2K I might add) calls the police and asks them to charge the little girl
The PC got in touch with the Inspector and the head got a bollocking for being a prat.
Another colleague was told by his daughter that his grandson was being bullied. He advised her to find out who it was and get the parents address and phone number. When she had done so he told her to give them a call and tell them if the bullying continued the father would get battered. The response from the chav mother was to say "I wish I had recorded this conversation"
Following day the grandson returns from school with a black eye and a fat lip. My colleague went round with boys uncle (his son) and a pick axe handle. They dragged the father out into the garden and the son held his hands on the garden wall while my colleage broke them with the pick axe handle. No more bullying occured. The moral of the story is deal with the parents directly however you feel able.
A colleagues daughter won junior all England Karate champion a few years ago, aged 12. Her school Head ever chasing good publicity called in the Press and re-presented her with the trophy in school assembly. 2 year 11 chavs decided to see how good she was at break time. Like most little girls she burst into tears the first time they hit her. The two really hard heros then decided putting the boot in was a good idea. Little girl realises she is now in serious trouble and uses her skills to get out of it. Eye witnesses said her last roundhouse kick actually made one of her assailants heads hit the floor before his body did. The previously proud (Lentil munching member of T2K I might add) calls the police and asks them to charge the little girl
The PC got in touch with the Inspector and the head got a bollocking for being a prat. Another colleague was told by his daughter that his grandson was being bullied. He advised her to find out who it was and get the parents address and phone number. When she had done so he told her to give them a call and tell them if the bullying continued the father would get battered. The response from the chav mother was to say "I wish I had recorded this conversation"
Following day the grandson returns from school with a black eye and a fat lip. My colleague went round with boys uncle (his son) and a pick axe handle. They dragged the father out into the garden and the son held his hands on the garden wall while my colleage broke them with the pick axe handle. No more bullying occured. The moral of the story is deal with the parents directly however you feel able.chris watton said:
Over past couple of weeks, our kids (aged 9 for stepson and 11 for stepdaughter) have been subjected to bullying from a boy a few doors down, Damian (!!!), who is 12. He has, to date bent Kirsten's fingers back to such an extent that they hurt for days, and Ethan came back from the park crying yet again, because he suffered physical abuse from this little monster.
This is physical abuse which comes under the realm of the Children Act.
Therefore you should contact your local Social Services department and ask to make a child protection referral.
Child on child abuse (physical and sexual) is becoming more and more common and there are specific procedures to address this.
Don't be worried that 'social workers steal kids' as the Daily Mail would have you believe, they work, alongside specially trained police officers to protect children from harm, children who are removed into the care of the local authority are at risk from those responsible for their care.
What I would envisage happening is for a SW or police officer to have a word with Damian's parents about his behaviour, also to ensure they are aware of the consequences as he is old enough to have criminal responsibility.
If you need any specific advice on these procedures email me through PH.
Good luck
Nonegreen beat me to it, but I'd have gone for the appraoch of..
Go round to see father of 'Damien'
Take lump hammer with you.
Lay his hand out on the nearest hard surface and strike, firmly, down on his little finger.
Tell him his thumb will be next unless 'has a chat' with his unruly son about his behaviour.
In fact, make sure unruly son is in the room at the time, it might make him change his mind about being a little dickhead.
HTH
Go round to see father of 'Damien'
Take lump hammer with you.
Lay his hand out on the nearest hard surface and strike, firmly, down on his little finger.
Tell him his thumb will be next unless 'has a chat' with his unruly son about his behaviour.
In fact, make sure unruly son is in the room at the time, it might make him change his mind about being a little dickhead.
HTH
nonegreen said:
2 stories
Another colleague ... They dragged the father out into the garden and the son held his hands on the garden wall while my colleage broke them with the pick axe handle. No more bullying occured. The moral of the story is deal with the parents directly however you feel able.
Harsh, but fair I feel. Would have rather seen it happen to the bully with victim on the other end of the pick axe handle though.
You never know if the dad was actually doing all he reasonabley could but was being ignored by the child and obstructed by the mother. I've seen it happen.
>> Edited by Rude-boy on Tuesday 6th September 19:10
Well the bully sounds like the product of a dad that doesnt give a damn,try not to get bitter with the kid although i could understand if you feel that way,initialy you could have a word with a copper,to see if he can go around and have a word with the family,more often than not the sight of a uniform at such a young age is scarey.
Another way means you have to dig deep past your own emotions and somehow perhaps accompany your boy to the play area and let the bully know you are there,ignoring any childish actions from him,after all you are an adult,in time you might thru interacting with your son strike a chord with the kid and in turn show some mutual interest in each other if you can get some sort of relationship going then there is a chance the bullying of your child can stop,
Also your kids will have to learn like mentioned before self defence so they can stand up for themselves against any other prospective bullies
Boys even bulies like cars especially a TVR,take your son for a ride and on the way home stop near where the bully is and open the bonnet,talk with your son about the engine and try to get the bullies attention with a freindly body language then once youve got him near show him around the car,gain his trust and respect and go from there,you will probably be surprised at a different side to the bully and can build from there.
Another way means you have to dig deep past your own emotions and somehow perhaps accompany your boy to the play area and let the bully know you are there,ignoring any childish actions from him,after all you are an adult,in time you might thru interacting with your son strike a chord with the kid and in turn show some mutual interest in each other if you can get some sort of relationship going then there is a chance the bullying of your child can stop,
Also your kids will have to learn like mentioned before self defence so they can stand up for themselves against any other prospective bullies
Boys even bulies like cars especially a TVR,take your son for a ride and on the way home stop near where the bully is and open the bonnet,talk with your son about the engine and try to get the bullies attention with a freindly body language then once youve got him near show him around the car,gain his trust and respect and go from there,you will probably be surprised at a different side to the bully and can build from there.
glocko said:
Over past couple of weeks, our kids (aged 9 for stepson and 11 for stepdaughter) have been subjected to bullying from a boy a few doors down, Damian (!!!), who is 12. He has, to date bent Kirsten's fingers back to such an extent that they hurt for days, and Ethan came back from the park crying yet again, because he suffered physical abuse from this little monster.
This is physical abuse which comes under the realm of the Children Act.
Therefore you should contact your local Social Services department and ask to make a child protection referral.
Child on child abuse (physical and sexual) is becoming more and more common and there are specific procedures to address this.
Don't be worried that 'social workers steal kids' as the Daily Mail would have you believe, they work, alongside specially trained police officers to protect children from harm, children who are removed into the care of the local authority are at risk from those responsible for their care.
What I would envisage happening is for a SW or police officer to have a word with Damian's parents about his behaviour, also to ensure they are aware of the consequences as he is old enough to have criminal responsibility.
If you need any specific advice on these procedures email me through PH.
Good luck
I am sorry to say that the track record of government employees in such cases is appalling and both police and social workers have betrayed the law abiding publics trust to the extent that only those who live in sheltered environments have any espect left for any of them. The last people I would get involved are the so called authorities. You will probably end up getting accused of child abuse, your kids excluded and being convicted of an assault charge while Damian and family get a free holiday. Best deal with it yourself, keep those with NVQ level 3 well away.
Daily Mail reader said:
I am sorry to say that the track record of government employees in such cases is appalling and both police and social workers have betrayed the law abiding publics trust to the extent that only those who live in sheltered environments have any espect left for any of them. The last people I would get involved are the so called authorities. You will probably end up getting accused of child abuse, your kids excluded and being convicted of an assault charge while Damian and family get a free holiday. Best deal with it yourself, keep those with NVQ level 3 well away.
Misinformed generalisation, irresponsible reply.
>> Edited by glocko on Tuesday 6th September 19:24
Thank you for the (yet again!) great advice, I have calmed down somewhat now after taking dogs for a long walk!!
Ethan's father is 6'2", and his mother is 5'7"; I have always told Chantelle that 'Damien'(who's dad is around 5'7"
had better hope that Ethan does not hold a grudge, (Kirsten, my stepdaughter is already a lot taller than girls a year older than her at school!)as he will, over next few years grow up to be a big strong lad.
In the meantime, my heart tells me to advise Ethan to lay into him,give him hell; as bullies rely on complete submissiveness from their victims, if he knows he won't be the only one with cuts, he would think twice,,,,,, but that means changing his very nice placid character, he is as good as gold, that's what makes me see red! (I was very close to knocking his dads door down earlier!)
If there are anymore 'incidents', we shall take photographs of any possible injuries and seek the help of social services, thats what my calm head tells me, but I know what should really be done
Ethan's father is 6'2", and his mother is 5'7"; I have always told Chantelle that 'Damien'(who's dad is around 5'7"
had better hope that Ethan does not hold a grudge, (Kirsten, my stepdaughter is already a lot taller than girls a year older than her at school!)as he will, over next few years grow up to be a big strong lad. In the meantime, my heart tells me to advise Ethan to lay into him,give him hell; as bullies rely on complete submissiveness from their victims, if he knows he won't be the only one with cuts, he would think twice,,,,,, but that means changing his very nice placid character, he is as good as gold, that's what makes me see red! (I was very close to knocking his dads door down earlier!)
If there are anymore 'incidents', we shall take photographs of any possible injuries and seek the help of social services, thats what my calm head tells me, but I know what should really be done
Rude-boy said:
2 stories
Another colleague ... They dragged the father out into the garden and the son held his hands on the garden wall while my colleage broke them with the pick axe handle. No more bullying occured. The moral of the story is deal with the parents directly however you feel able.
Harsh, but fair I feel. Would have rather seen it happen to the bully with victim on the other end of the pick axe handle though.
You never know if the dad was actually doing all he reasonabley could but was being ignored by the child and obstructed by the mother. I've seen it happen.
>> Edited by Rude-boy on Tuesday 6th September 19:10
Ok you go round and bosh the dad,next minute you are well and truely nicked and while you are being detained your family are now at the mercy of the bullies,great move!, you have now stooped lower than the bully and become a bully yourself.
These sort of things happen all the time do we admit that brawn beats brains or do we have a go at trying to deal with it in a proper way?,all the kids(bully included) are going to learn this way is violence is the answer.
ZR1cliff said:
Well the bully sounds like the product of a dad that doesnt give a damn,try not to get bitter with the kid although i could understand if you feel that way,initialy you could have a word with a copper,to see if he can go around and have a word with the family,more often than not the sight of a uniform at such a young age is scarey. [quote]
Spot on!, his parents are divorced and he has a 'girlfriend', no excuse though, Kirsten and Ethan's parents are divorced, but we would NEVER allow our kids to act like that, and they don't.
[quote=ZR1cliff]
Boys even bulies like cars especially a TVR,take your son for a ride and on the way home stop near where the bully is and open the bonnet,talk with your son about the engine and try to get the bullies attention with a freindly body language then once youve got him near show him around the car,gain his trust and respect and go from there,you will probably be surprised at a different side to the bully and can build from there.
Thats part of the problem, I feel. When we first arrived here back in November 2003, Damien thought he had all the 'best toys' for example, one Xmas, Ethan was outside playing with his R/C Mini, so Damien and his dad come out with a HUGE R/C buggy, and thats how its been!
Damien brags all the time on what he's got, up to last week, I actually felt sorry for him that he felt he had to show off like that! When I sold my Chim, Damien (I found out last week!), told Kirsten and Ethan that his dad said we're poor, and he was going to get a Lexus (!!!), oh, and, (still has his old Mondeo, which he smashed the other week, making the front pages of the Forrester!),,, I wondered why they looked as sick as dogs when I pulled up in the Tamora, now I know why! How petty, how can you reason with a narrow minded man like that? However, you're right, I am an adult, I know kids at some point invariably have to go through this kind of 'initiation' of growing up, I just shocked myself that I had the thoughts I did, didn't think I'd react like that!
glocko said:
I am sorry to say that the track record of government employees in such cases is appalling and both police and social workers have betrayed the law abiding publics trust to the extent that only those who live in sheltered environments have any espect left for any of them. The last people I would get involved are the so called authorities. You will probably end up getting accused of child abuse, your kids excluded and being convicted of an assault charge while Damian and family get a free holiday. Best deal with it yourself, keep those with NVQ level 3 well away.
Misinformed generalisation, irresponsible reply.
>> Edited by glocko on Tuesday 6th September 19:24
A very well informed reply based on working with them for the last 25 years. I never read the daily mail.
I do however listen to the opinions of those directly involved. In case you had not noticed my post said 2 things, one was dont trust the authorities they are idiots and two here are some extreem examples of what may happen if you do, they are inserted as humour as this is a serious subject but everyone needs to lighten up a little. What you are suggesting is a war of attrition that will involve all sorts of red tape, making the victims feel like a piece of dirt while they have photographs of injuries taken Social workers, case conferences and other BS which will all take months and months and months and achieve SFA. My honest opinion having seen them perform and listened to their views on all sorts of subjects is to scrap local government employment alltogether. It is a completely unnecessary tier of administrivia that is using up much needed roadbulding labour. 
chris watton said:
Well the bully sounds like the product of a dad that doesnt give a damn,try not to get bitter with the kid although i could understand if you feel that way,initialy you could have a word with a copper,to see if he can go around and have a word with the family,more often than not the sight of a uniform at such a young age is scarey. [quote]
Spot on!, his parents are divorced and he has a 'girlfriend', no excuse though, Kirsten and Ethan's parents are divorced, but we would NEVER allow our kids to act like that, and they don't.
[quote=ZR1cliff]
Boys even bulies like cars especially a TVR,take your son for a ride and on the way home stop near where the bully is and open the bonnet,talk with your son about the engine and try to get the bullies attention with a freindly body language then once youve got him near show him around the car,gain his trust and respect and go from there,you will probably be surprised at a different side to the bully and can build from there.
Thats part of the problem, I feel. When we first arrived here back in November 2003, Damien thought he had all the 'best toys' for example, one Xmas, Ethan was outside playing with his R/C Mini, so Damien and his dad come out with a HUGE R/C buggy, and thats how its been!
However, you're right, I am an adult, I know kids at some point invariably have to go through this kind of 'initiation' of growing up, I just shocked myself that I had the thoughts I did, didn't think I'd react like that!
Surely then if this parent is a jealous loser you must be able to take him on one side and have a word in such a way as to leave him will no illusions as to your thoughts and have the effect of making him and his son climb down?
ZR1cliff said:
nonegreen said:
2 stories
Another colleague ... They dragged the father out into the garden and the son held his hands on the garden wall while my colleage broke them with the pick axe handle. No more bullying occured. The moral of the story is deal with the parents directly however you feel able.
Harsh, but fair I feel. Would have rather seen it happen to the bully with victim on the other end of the pick axe handle though.
You never know if the dad was actually doing all he reasonabley could but was being ignored by the child and obstructed by the mother. I've seen it happen.
>> Edited by Rude-boy on Tuesday 6th September 19:10
Ok you go round and bosh the dad,next minute you are well and truely nicked and while you are being detained your family are now at the mercy of the bullies,great move!, you have now stooped lower than the bully and become a bully yourself.
These sort of things happen all the time do we admit that brawn beats brains or do we have a go at trying to deal with it in a proper way?,all the kids(bully included) are going to learn this way is violence is the answer.
Very sensible and of course totally right.
If it were my lad I know I would feel like doing what nonegreen’s colleague did, or my suggested alternative. Fact is there is no way in hell I would ever do anything like this, even if every bone in my body was screaming out to do so. My livelihood relies on me not having a criminal record. As such I could never risk any sort of altercation with anyone like this lad’s father. I also have the ‘problem’ of my size and strength - if I hit someone the chances are it’s not just going to leave a mark.
At the end of the day if you’ve got 23 previous and the boy’s following in dad’s footsteps a nice chat over tea and crumpets with PC Plod isn’t going to sort things out. The only thing they will understand is 5 mins with Uncle Dave and his pick axe handle.
On the other hand if Traquin is just being ‘spirited’ PC Plod will put the fear of God in him.
When I was at school I was one of those who was bullied almost to the point almost submission. Then I struck back. I literally took a large number of bullies apart using both fair and foul means. Apart from a few isolated incidents the bullying stopped within a few days. I’m not proud of some of the things I did but I got my self respect back and that means one hell of a lot more.
So I suppose you might think that what I have just said proves your point? Only in part I’d say. Violence isn’t always the right answer, if you have to resort to violence you might say that you have lost. Fact is sometimes it is the right answer, the only thing that someone will understand.
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