Standby Britain
Discussion
Article from Independent the other day stating that a large amount of energy could be saved by switching appliances off rather than leaving them on standby.
However, I do find some of these figures hard to believe - what do you reckon??
http://news.independent.co.uk/uk/environment/story.jsp?story=649018
The mains offenders
* Dishwashers left "on" at the end of their cycle consume 70 per cent of the power used when they are running.
* The average television is left on standby for up to 17.5 hours a day.Last year Britain's 62 million television sets consumed about 8 per cent of their energy consumption in standby mode.
* Washing machines use just under 20 per cent of their normal electricity requirement on standby.
* Tumble-dryers can use 38 per cent of power while waiting at the end of a cycle.
* If lights were turned off when not in use it would prevent 375,000 tons of CO2 emissions and save £55m in bills.
* There is little difference between the power requirement of digital receivers when they are on and on standby.
* Experts say the total power used while an appliance is on standby can equal the electricity used during the time it is on.
* Other appliances with high standby power use are cordless telephones, radios and stereos.
However, I do find some of these figures hard to believe - what do you reckon??
http://news.independent.co.uk/uk/environment/story.jsp?story=649018
The mains offenders
* Dishwashers left "on" at the end of their cycle consume 70 per cent of the power used when they are running.
* The average television is left on standby for up to 17.5 hours a day.Last year Britain's 62 million television sets consumed about 8 per cent of their energy consumption in standby mode.
* Washing machines use just under 20 per cent of their normal electricity requirement on standby.
* Tumble-dryers can use 38 per cent of power while waiting at the end of a cycle.
* If lights were turned off when not in use it would prevent 375,000 tons of CO2 emissions and save £55m in bills.
* There is little difference between the power requirement of digital receivers when they are on and on standby.
* Experts say the total power used while an appliance is on standby can equal the electricity used during the time it is on.
* Other appliances with high standby power use are cordless telephones, radios and stereos.
You see, I've come to a conclusion about this:
It only matters when the ambient temperature is high (ie its summer).
In the winter, all these devices will be using electricity in their standby mode, which will eventually be converted to heat, which will heat the home, which will reduce the amount of time that the central heating is required.
It only matters when the ambient temperature is high (ie its summer).
In the winter, all these devices will be using electricity in their standby mode, which will eventually be converted to heat, which will heat the home, which will reduce the amount of time that the central heating is required.
I turn stuff off at night as I can see that it's wasting energy then, but during the day it's usually on standby.
However, doesn't the act of turning some things on and off use more energy? Doesn't it take excess energy constantly turning something mechanical on and off? I know cars use more fuel being constantly stopped and restarted in a traffic jam than just sitting there idly.
However, doesn't the act of turning some things on and off use more energy? Doesn't it take excess energy constantly turning something mechanical on and off? I know cars use more fuel being constantly stopped and restarted in a traffic jam than just sitting there idly.
* Dishwashers left "on" at the end of their cycle consume 70 per cent of the power used when they are running.
Several kW pump vs a little LED on? It's an incredibly inefficient circuit board if it uses over twice as much as a pump.
* The average television is left on standby for up to 17.5 hours a day.Last year Britain's 62 million television sets consumed about 8 per cent of their energy consumption in standby mode.
Probably true, if I remember I'll check our TV manual as it states the power usage when on and standby.
* Washing machines use just under 20 per cent of their normal electricity requirement on standby.
Again, I'm incredibly suspicious of this for the same reasons as the dishwasher - motors use huge amounts of power so I'm not quite sure where all the other power is going.
* Tumble-dryers can use 38 per cent of power while waiting at the end of a cycle.
Who is making these machines? Powergen?
* If lights were turned off when not in use it would prevent 375,000 tons of CO2 emissions and save £55m in bills.
Fair point.
* There is little difference between the power requirement of digital receivers when they are on and on standby.
Fair point.
* Experts say the total power used while an appliance is on standby can equal the electricity used during the time it is on.
Incredibly wooly an unspecific quote.
* Other appliances with high standby power use are cordless telephones, radios and stereos.
Only because they use so little power when turned on.
Now don't get me wrong, I'm a firm believer that this country needs to be much more fuel efficient if we're going to rely on renewable energy sources in the future, but this kind of pseudo-scientific article only adds to the ignorance of the general populace.
Scandinavian homes use a third less energy to heat than UK ones, despite the colder climate - it's this kind of difference we need to concentrate on rather than the tiny differences made by getting manufacturers to turn their dishwashers off after a cycle instead of staying on standby.
Several kW pump vs a little LED on? It's an incredibly inefficient circuit board if it uses over twice as much as a pump.
* The average television is left on standby for up to 17.5 hours a day.Last year Britain's 62 million television sets consumed about 8 per cent of their energy consumption in standby mode.
Probably true, if I remember I'll check our TV manual as it states the power usage when on and standby.
* Washing machines use just under 20 per cent of their normal electricity requirement on standby.
Again, I'm incredibly suspicious of this for the same reasons as the dishwasher - motors use huge amounts of power so I'm not quite sure where all the other power is going.
* Tumble-dryers can use 38 per cent of power while waiting at the end of a cycle.
Who is making these machines? Powergen?
* If lights were turned off when not in use it would prevent 375,000 tons of CO2 emissions and save £55m in bills.
Fair point.
* There is little difference between the power requirement of digital receivers when they are on and on standby.
Fair point.
* Experts say the total power used while an appliance is on standby can equal the electricity used during the time it is on.
Incredibly wooly an unspecific quote.
* Other appliances with high standby power use are cordless telephones, radios and stereos.
Only because they use so little power when turned on.
Now don't get me wrong, I'm a firm believer that this country needs to be much more fuel efficient if we're going to rely on renewable energy sources in the future, but this kind of pseudo-scientific article only adds to the ignorance of the general populace.
Scandinavian homes use a third less energy to heat than UK ones, despite the colder climate - it's this kind of difference we need to concentrate on rather than the tiny differences made by getting manufacturers to turn their dishwashers off after a cycle instead of staying on standby.
Not totally related to the original post... but I went to a talk this morning about alternative energy sources... looking at the facts and figure etc. it works out that the only viable one is solar power... e.g. if we were to meet the worlds energy needs by 2050 (24TW) by biofuels alone we would need to devote 33% of the worlds land area to growing the plants.... wind power is not enough... hydroelectricity likewise... geothermal power is not great as there are few places on the planet with think enough crusts to use it... Covering a smallish area of each continent with solar panels (10% efficiency ones) is enough to meet these energy needs apparently. It sort of makes sense given that the earth receives 10^5 TW of energy in the form of sunlight each year... that is a huge amount.
D_Mike said:
Not totally related to the original post... but I went to a talk this morning about alternative energy sources... looking at the facts and figure etc. it works out that the only viable one is solar power... e.g. if we were to meet the worlds energy needs by 2050 (24TW) by biofuels alone we would need to devote 33% of the worlds land area to growing the plants.... wind power is not enough... hydroelectricity likewise... geothermal power is not great as there are few places on the planet with think enough crusts to use it... Covering a smallish area of each continent with solar panels (10% efficiency ones) is enough to meet these energy needs apparently. It sort of makes sense given that the earth receives 10^5 TW of energy in the form of sunlight each year... that is a huge amount.
I've also wondered about the viability of solar-powered aircraft. I mean, once an aeroplane is in the air, the exposure to the light of the sun can be much greater, so powering turboprops or electric turbofans from solar panels mounted on the upper parts of the wings and fuselage would surely allow for less fuel to be used on long-distance flights. They're also likely to be more reliable, as there's no worries about running out of fuel at high altitudes, faulty fuel feed affected by G-forces and climb rates etc - just electric cable.
FunkyNige said:
Several kW pump vs a little LED on? It's an incredibly inefficient circuit board if it uses over twice as much as a pump.
.
FunkyNige said:
* Washing machines use just under 20 per cent of their normal electricity requirement on standby.
Again, I'm incredibly suspicious of this for the same reasons as the dishwasher - motors use huge amounts of power so I'm not quite sure where all the other power is going.
FunkyNige said:
* Tumble-dryers can use 38 per cent of power while waiting at the end of a cycle.
Who is making these machines? Powergen?
This whole standby thing is a new phenomenon. Once upon a time things were either ON or OFF.
Now, if I turn the room lights out after dark, my living room is dotted with little red, amber and green specks...
Never mind, it's all EU-conforming and, thank heavens, Eco-Friendly, so I guess it's OK after all!!!
Now, if I turn the room lights out after dark, my living room is dotted with little red, amber and green specks...
Never mind, it's all EU-conforming and, thank heavens, Eco-Friendly, so I guess it's OK after all!!!
FunkyNige said:
* Dishwashers left "on" at the end of their cycle consume 70 per cent of the power used when they are running.
Several kW pump vs a little LED on? It's an incredibly inefficient circuit board if it uses over twice as much as a pump.
* The average television is left on standby for up to 17.5 hours a day.Last year Britain's 62 million television sets consumed about 8 per cent of their energy consumption in standby mode.
Probably true, if I remember I'll check our TV manual as it states the power usage when on and standby.
* Washing machines use just under 20 per cent of their normal electricity requirement on standby.
Again, I'm incredibly suspicious of this for the same reasons as the dishwasher - motors use huge amounts of power so I'm not quite sure where all the other power is going.
* Tumble-dryers can use 38 per cent of power while waiting at the end of a cycle.
Who is making these machines? Powergen?
* If lights were turned off when not in use it would prevent 375,000 tons of CO2 emissions and save £55m in bills.
Fair point.
* There is little difference between the power requirement of digital receivers when they are on and on standby.
Fair point.
* Experts say the total power used while an appliance is on standby can equal the electricity used during the time it is on.
Incredibly wooly an unspecific quote.
* Other appliances with high standby power use are cordless telephones, radios and stereos.
Only because they use so little power when turned on.
Now don't get me wrong, I'm a firm believer that this country needs to be much more fuel efficient if we're going to rely on renewable energy sources in the future, but this kind of pseudo-scientific article only adds to the ignorance of the general populace.
Scandinavian homes use a third less energy to heat than UK ones, despite the colder climate - it's this kind of difference we need to concentrate on rather than the tiny differences made by getting manufacturers to turn their dishwashers off after a cycle instead of staying on standby.
Thanks Nige, my thoughts entirely. Why do people / organisations have to spout a lot of shite sometimes. If a dishwasher is finished surely the only current draw is the small ciruit that knows the led is on and the wash is finished AND the LED which draws sweet FA compared to the heating element and motor....
And what about the first time you boil the kettle in the morning, it must be about 100 times more than the TV Video, DVD player put together.
Lets ban tea and coffee (which I hardly drink anyway!!)
Cheers,
Steve
I never leave my TV on standby for two reasons
One of them is that one product range used to leave the heaters on the CRT but remove the EHT creating a quickstart from standby - hence reducing the life of the tube.
Another reason is house fires! some makes had a standby switch fault causing overheat.
One of them is that one product range used to leave the heaters on the CRT but remove the EHT creating a quickstart from standby - hence reducing the life of the tube.
Another reason is house fires! some makes had a standby switch fault causing overheat.
I reckon I could heat my house just from all the heat given off from devices left on standby 
Personal energy consumption is a spec in the ocean compared to industrial use. Until Dubya signs up to the Kyoto agreement, I'll be damned if I will spend five minutes every day switching things off. It won't make any appreciable difference.
Besides, the last time I switched my PC off, it died
What's the point in having all those remote controls if you have to get up to switch stuff on
Personal energy consumption is a spec in the ocean compared to industrial use. Until Dubya signs up to the Kyoto agreement, I'll be damned if I will spend five minutes every day switching things off. It won't make any appreciable difference.
Besides, the last time I switched my PC off, it died
What's the point in having all those remote controls if you have to get up to switch stuff on
Scaremoungering statistics like this is what turns people off listening to possibly more accurate figures that they may quote later,The old "cry wolf" syndrome.
A "dishwasher" that consumes: 70%! of its total power requirement whilst on standby? even when the pump (the largest item) is stopped?
A washing machine that requires 20% of its energy needs at the end of its cycle even though the motor and the heater are switched off?
A tumble dryer with a motor and 3 kw heater takes 38% of its energy needs when both these are off?
PLEEEeeese let me know where they buy these products, and I'll give them a wide berth. It's total Bolleaux! I seriously doubt if any of these products will cost you more than a few pence per year in stanby mode.
If we can't believe this sort of stuff, what chance the figures for accidents and KSI's?
A "dishwasher" that consumes: 70%! of its total power requirement whilst on standby? even when the pump (the largest item) is stopped?
A washing machine that requires 20% of its energy needs at the end of its cycle even though the motor and the heater are switched off?
A tumble dryer with a motor and 3 kw heater takes 38% of its energy needs when both these are off?
PLEEEeeese let me know where they buy these products, and I'll give them a wide berth. It's total Bolleaux! I seriously doubt if any of these products will cost you more than a few pence per year in stanby mode.
If we can't believe this sort of stuff, what chance the figures for accidents and KSI's?
Grr...
If it's got a stand-by then it's also got an OFF!
There's a few appliances where a SENSIBLY used standby is fine but all night - no.. and you all know it.
But energy conservation? Not my problem - right?
Bollox!!!
I reckon most people here practice energy conservation without realising it - good entry into that sweeping right hander? Not carrying too much speed? Don't need to touch the brakes & yet get it just right? That's energy conservation - the mark of an expert. So why not carry that over into day-to-day living - it does make a difference, believe me.
Part of my day job involves me flying over cities with sensors recording energy loss. The results of the survey can help local industry save quite literally millions off their energy expenditure - yet I still have to share the stage with lentilists - jumpers knitted from thir own beard clippings - who say it shouldn't have been done - because of the pollution from the survey aircraft!
Those idiots give all of us 'real' energy conservation pro's a bad name. yes, I agree with saving energy - it has a 'rightness' in engineering think but that doesn't stop me appreciatng a big V8!! You've gotta look at the big picture.
>> Edited by Pot Bellied Fool on Saturday 25th June 01:49
If it's got a stand-by then it's also got an OFF!
There's a few appliances where a SENSIBLY used standby is fine but all night - no.. and you all know it.
But energy conservation? Not my problem - right?
Bollox!!!
I reckon most people here practice energy conservation without realising it - good entry into that sweeping right hander? Not carrying too much speed? Don't need to touch the brakes & yet get it just right? That's energy conservation - the mark of an expert. So why not carry that over into day-to-day living - it does make a difference, believe me.
Part of my day job involves me flying over cities with sensors recording energy loss. The results of the survey can help local industry save quite literally millions off their energy expenditure - yet I still have to share the stage with lentilists - jumpers knitted from thir own beard clippings - who say it shouldn't have been done - because of the pollution from the survey aircraft!
Those idiots give all of us 'real' energy conservation pro's a bad name. yes, I agree with saving energy - it has a 'rightness' in engineering think but that doesn't stop me appreciatng a big V8!! You've gotta look at the big picture.
>> Edited by Pot Bellied Fool on Saturday 25th June 01:49
I think those stats are a bit iffy. There is a problem here though.
In the old days, when your washing machine shut down, it didn't consume any power at all.
These days, everything has a computer in it. Computers are inherently low voltage, and they all need transformers. The thing with a transformer is that it has a latent absorption ability.
Even if the computer is drawing very little power, the transformer is still using power from the mains, primarily to adjust the orientation of the spins of each of the iron atoms in the transformer core.
Since I'm talking about atoms, it migt not sound like a lot of energy, but I certainly couldn't count the number of atoms in a transformer core on one hand.
Certainly if you add up all of the transformers in all of the washing machines in all of the world, we'd be talking about quite a bit of energy. That's just washing machines.
There is a solution, but it requires the device in question to have a rechargable battery, and a relay to control the power on the supply side. The reason manufacturers are reluctant to go this route is because NiCd's and the like have a fixed lifespan. It doesn't look good for them if you cant turn their kit on because the NiCd died.
In the old days, when your washing machine shut down, it didn't consume any power at all.
These days, everything has a computer in it. Computers are inherently low voltage, and they all need transformers. The thing with a transformer is that it has a latent absorption ability.
Even if the computer is drawing very little power, the transformer is still using power from the mains, primarily to adjust the orientation of the spins of each of the iron atoms in the transformer core.
Since I'm talking about atoms, it migt not sound like a lot of energy, but I certainly couldn't count the number of atoms in a transformer core on one hand.
Certainly if you add up all of the transformers in all of the washing machines in all of the world, we'd be talking about quite a bit of energy. That's just washing machines.
There is a solution, but it requires the device in question to have a rechargable battery, and a relay to control the power on the supply side. The reason manufacturers are reluctant to go this route is because NiCd's and the like have a fixed lifespan. It doesn't look good for them if you cant turn their kit on because the NiCd died.
Gassing Station | The Pie & Piston Archive | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff