Has Howard lost the Conservatives chances ?
Discussion
I heard on the News that the Cnservative leader, Michael Howard, is going to sign up for the ID card system.
There was some wishy-washy caveat that they wanted assurances over costs and privacy.
After all the bad ID press and the DB saga, I feel Howard has thrown away a golden opportunity to get some strong suport for his party. I, for one, will now not vote Conservative.
Please help as I'm running out of suitable parties to vote for at the next election.
Piccy
There was some wishy-washy caveat that they wanted assurances over costs and privacy.
After all the bad ID press and the DB saga, I feel Howard has thrown away a golden opportunity to get some strong suport for his party. I, for one, will now not vote Conservative.
Please help as I'm running out of suitable parties to vote for at the next election.
Piccy
Irrespective of their policy on ID cards, I consider that having Howard as leader renders the conservatives unelectable. I hated him when he was the interior minister and was horrified to see him pushed to the fore as leader of the tories. As long as they keep him there can be no credible opposition to Tony's lot...
It's all very depressing - a democracy where you don't want to vote for any of them is not really a democracy. You're reduced to cynical, tactical voting and that's just bollocks.
It's all very depressing - a democracy where you don't want to vote for any of them is not really a democracy. You're reduced to cynical, tactical voting and that's just bollocks.
All politicians were going to go for them in the end. The political class like to control their peasants and this is just another way of doing so; even if they wanted so they can't resist their natural urge. Remember these are people who have dedicated their lives to telling everyone they know better.
ATG said:
I think supporting the ID card proposal is a big mistake, and goes against Conservative principles.
Pretty sure Howard proposed ID cards the last time he was in government himself. Would be pretty hypocritical to oppose them now?
Yep, I think that is the main reason he has persuaded his party to back them now.
This may not be a popular view, but I'm actually very comfortable with the idea of ID cards...but I do think the issue could easily become the new Poll Tax.
I think the point is that there should be proper consultation over the information that ID cards contain and how it is used. I do see that it could be helpful in combating illegal immigration, crime and the war on unlicenced, uninsured drivers.
Unfortunately, the incumbent Government's style will just be to whitewash consultation and foist it upon us all, which will naturally generate suspicion and resentment.
I think the point is that there should be proper consultation over the information that ID cards contain and how it is used. I do see that it could be helpful in combating illegal immigration, crime and the war on unlicenced, uninsured drivers.
Unfortunately, the incumbent Government's style will just be to whitewash consultation and foist it upon us all, which will naturally generate suspicion and resentment.
catretriever said:
You can't really expect to agree with all the policies of any single political party. The duty is to do your research and pick the candidate that you feel is the best of the bunch. No one ever suggested it was an easy decision. This isn't "The X Factor" we're talking about.
Quite so.
In the absence of a Texan in No.10, I'll quite happily take a vampyre.
Alex said:
I think supporting the ID card proposal is a big mistake, and goes against Conservative principles.
I have to say I was very disappointed to say the least to hear this.
There I am, convinced that the Lib Dems were the worst nannying control freaks and they (well Charles Kennedy anyway) are not in favour of them.
To me, this is a major voting issue.
The cards have been shown not to stop terrorism, in fact, those countries with them are some of the most terrorist-prone countries, so what straw are the pro-ID card people going to clutch at now to justify them?
Piccy mate said:
Please help as I'm running out of suitable parties to vote for at the next election.
Piccy
Unfortunately I think you have just run out of parties to vote for now. Lets wait until May time and see, but looks increasingly that Howard is doing his damnedest to loose the next election....
The Tories need a strong character to take charge and LEAD! Maggie was that sort of person (No I'm not going down the love/hate agree/disagree route, that's another thread). someone who stood up and said 'I believe in this.......'. Someone who doesn't suffer fools, and clears out the dead wood ruthlessly.
Bad similie, but the Germans were looking for something similar in 1933. I think that's why we have the UKIP - disaffected Tories. The Libdems and Labour are so close there's an orangey red blur around their edges where they touch and cross over.
There is no real point in voting, it reminds me of Italy since the war, so many parties and all the same!
Bad similie, but the Germans were looking for something similar in 1933. I think that's why we have the UKIP - disaffected Tories. The Libdems and Labour are so close there's an orangey red blur around their edges where they touch and cross over.
There is no real point in voting, it reminds me of Italy since the war, so many parties and all the same!
ATG said:
Pretty sure Howard proposed ID cards the last time he was in government himself. Would be pretty hypocritical to oppose them now?
That was a different proposal IIRC. There was none of this "we want a database containing all the possible information we can get on every single citizen" stuff that the current proposal has. The issue for the Tories is that Labour can bash them with the "tough on crime" rhetoric if they don't support it.
The problem is that ID cards are going to do nothing that proper use of existing systems can achieve. You need a (current) passport to open a bank account. You have an NHS number, a NI number, a driving license number etc. So what do you need another ID number for?
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