being screwed by your ex landlord
Discussion
and I aint talking the biblical sense here... tho some thoughts as where to shove Ace-T's unwanted xmas pressent are front of my mind right now.
I was renting the old place for nearly 4 years paying over £1500/month which I stupidly assumed meant that the landlord would be a little understanding in our somewhat frenzied exit to move over to Ireland.
Not so - even though he was holding a £1500 deposit he now wants an additional £1238 based on the following.
(His report is quite detailed - I could'nt post it directly so have summarised it)
Now some of this I don't have a problem with, but a £50 quid soap dish that is in exactly the same state as when we moved in smarts a bit.
Cleaning £500 - that hurts - we did give the place a once over but it was done in a rush and likely after 4 years you are gonna need a professional cleaner in to make the place sparkle.
The garden sutff I can live with - £100 odd quid.
More importantly we'd had verbal agreement that he would cover the cost of redecoration when I moved out so that's another £700 accounted for, but where do I stand on that?
Carpets - how long is a carpet supposed to last before needing replacement - 20 years? do I have any grounds here.
Still a bit stunned by this - would love some advice from PH landlords/tennants on how to fight this.
Needless to say the contract is pretty tight...
but - should I have been given any notice or opportunity to rectify any of these things before he went ahead and had them sorted?
Is a letting contract a licence for the landlord to do as he pleases the moment you hand back the keys
Looks like it's gonna be a very quiet xmas.
Ex
>>> Edited by TheExcession on Thursday 9th December 21:23
I was renting the old place for nearly 4 years paying over £1500/month which I stupidly assumed meant that the landlord would be a little understanding in our somewhat frenzied exit to move over to Ireland.
Not so - even though he was holding a £1500 deposit he now wants an additional £1238 based on the following.
(His report is quite detailed - I could'nt post it directly so have summarised it)
bastard landlord said:
Room Cleaning:
General cleaning £500.00
Carpets and curtains cleaning. £345.00
Misc MAintenance £280.00
Soap Dish £50
Gardening - genral tidying, weeding etc
Waste disposal cost: £50.00
Labour cost £50.00
Total £100.00
Decorating
Cost @ £ 100.00 per room (approx.) £700.00
i.e. four bedrooms, two reception room and hall, stairs and ldng.
Misc. painting and repair £ 50.00
The following carpets could not be cleaned satisfactorily and require replacement.
Back bed room carpet - 14sq M @ £ 36 psm £504.00
Back reception carpet - 18sq M @ £ 30 psm £540.00
Carpet fitting £110.00
(per quote @ carpet right) £1,154.00
Total cost : £2,738.00
Deposit : £1,500.00
Shortfall : £1,238.00
Now some of this I don't have a problem with, but a £50 quid soap dish that is in exactly the same state as when we moved in smarts a bit.
Cleaning £500 - that hurts - we did give the place a once over but it was done in a rush and likely after 4 years you are gonna need a professional cleaner in to make the place sparkle.
The garden sutff I can live with - £100 odd quid.
More importantly we'd had verbal agreement that he would cover the cost of redecoration when I moved out so that's another £700 accounted for, but where do I stand on that?
Carpets - how long is a carpet supposed to last before needing replacement - 20 years? do I have any grounds here.
Still a bit stunned by this - would love some advice from PH landlords/tennants on how to fight this.
Needless to say the contract is pretty tight...
but - should I have been given any notice or opportunity to rectify any of these things before he went ahead and had them sorted?
Is a letting contract a licence for the landlord to do as he pleases the moment you hand back the keys
Looks like it's gonna be a very quiet xmas.
Ex
>>> Edited by TheExcession on Thursday 9th December 21:23
Unfortunately, if you disappeared before the inventory was carried out, it is a licence for him to print money. My mother used to work in lettings management and the one thing she always drummed in to me was to make sure you were present when the inventory was done and agreed the charges up front. Carpet after 4 years - he is taking the p!ss - especially as he has probably been offsetting 10% of your rent against tax to allow for wear and tear.
If you are in Ireland and not planning to come back for a while, you can always tell him to
off. It is up to him to come chasing after you via the small claims court and he may well not bother.
Glen
If you are in Ireland and not planning to come back for a while, you can always tell him to
off. It is up to him to come chasing after you via the small claims court and he may well not bother. Glen
wedg1e said:
I was renting the old place for nearly 4 years paying over £1500/month
Has anybody got an Industrial Strengthsmiley?
That's my mortgage for 7 months.
Robbing bastard. I hope it was at least a castle, if not a palace.
It was/is a very nice place - and when there was good money in IT with a few of us in there it didn't seem that bad.
Needless to say my gentleman's agreement with the other lodgers in terms of deposits has left me friendless when it comes to the cost of replacing carpets that had other poeples coffee stains on them.
oh woe is me -
don't know whether to laugh or cry...
Ex
Go see the Citizens Advice Bureau. They have a big chunk of literature on how to deal with unreasonable landlords. My case of dealing with it is the opposite - we moved in to discover thhe previous tennants had wrecked the place and notin had been done about it.
I have the following leaflets, if you wanted me to post them that would be OK.
Private Tenancies
Private tenants' right to fire safety
Private tenancies - paying your rent
Private tenancies - paying a deposit
Rent arrears
They are all "Shelter Guide"s
It includes the lines:
"If you are prepared to accept responsibility for some costs and not others, write back and say so, stating the balance you expect to have returned. If you think the level of the costs (such as those for repairing damage or cleaning)are unreasonably high, you are entitled to ask for reciepts to be provided."
It also goes on to say you should set deadlinies for them to reply and to refund money. At some point, you can take them to court to get your money back. You have to remember, the landlord cannot charge you for "reasonable wear and tear". I would argue that he should not be charging for redecoration as 4 years is a reasonable time for them t o require re-decorating, and the carpet stuff is BS.
It looks like this link will do the same as my little book: http://england.shelter.org.uk/advice/advice-245.cfm That website is well worth a look. I think you should be getting cash back, not paying it out.
Good luck
Cheers
Duncan
I have the following leaflets, if you wanted me to post them that would be OK.
Private Tenancies
Private tenants' right to fire safety
Private tenancies - paying your rent
Private tenancies - paying a deposit
Rent arrears
They are all "Shelter Guide"s
It includes the lines:
"If you are prepared to accept responsibility for some costs and not others, write back and say so, stating the balance you expect to have returned. If you think the level of the costs (such as those for repairing damage or cleaning)are unreasonably high, you are entitled to ask for reciepts to be provided."
It also goes on to say you should set deadlinies for them to reply and to refund money. At some point, you can take them to court to get your money back. You have to remember, the landlord cannot charge you for "reasonable wear and tear". I would argue that he should not be charging for redecoration as 4 years is a reasonable time for them t o require re-decorating, and the carpet stuff is BS.
It looks like this link will do the same as my little book: http://england.shelter.org.uk/advice/advice-245.cfm That website is well worth a look. I think you should be getting cash back, not paying it out.
Good luck
Cheers
Duncan
TheExcession said:
Not so - even though he was holding a £1500 deposit he now wants an additional £1238 based on the following.
CAB sounds good.
If he refuses to change, you could always tell him to stick it where the sun don't shine... would he do a CCJ, and can you handle one if he does?
Looking at that computation, I'd say he's trying to justify witholding your deposit.
Like the Council Tax ruse...give us a 15% shock so we're relieved when the increase in "only" 5%, as originally intended.
Give him some grief...bet he settles for £1500.....
Then again, do you really think £1500 is reasonable.....? Did he do everything required by the contract during your tenancy? If not, argue about the £1500, too.
Like the Council Tax ruse...give us a 15% shock so we're relieved when the increase in "only" 5%, as originally intended.
Give him some grief...bet he settles for £1500.....
Then again, do you really think £1500 is reasonable.....? Did he do everything required by the contract during your tenancy? If not, argue about the £1500, too.
Well, when it comes to getting some of the deposit back, that is going to be a struggle for you. But no worse than it will be for him to get the additional money he wants out of you. He can bleat all he likes, but he is highly unlikely to pursue this as his claim looks dodgy. As has been said, normal wear and tear is the landlord's problem, not yours. Nonetheless, standard operating procedure is for landlord to try to bill you for redecorating his property when you leave ... he's no doubt been living in la-la land, not budgeting on several months sans rental income, and not budgeting for the inevitable hundreds of quid needed to spruce a place up. He is suddenly awoken to the real expense of renting out the flat and decides to pass on as much as he can to you. Remeber Alexei Sayle in The Young Ones? He was a bleeding amateur compared to some of the gits I've rented from.
1. Don't sent any more money - I think that is a no-brainer.
2. Re-read your tenancy agreement. If it is any good it should specifically mention exclusions for reasonable wear and tear. You can use this as leverage against the redecorating costs.
3. Ask to see receipts - £50 for a soap dish? Is it gold plated or something?
You are highly unlikely to see much (if any) of your deposit back without a fight, but similarly your landlord should not expect to get another penny out of you either (providing you're not stupid enough to send any money!
)
2. Re-read your tenancy agreement. If it is any good it should specifically mention exclusions for reasonable wear and tear. You can use this as leverage against the redecorating costs.
3. Ask to see receipts - £50 for a soap dish? Is it gold plated or something?
You are highly unlikely to see much (if any) of your deposit back without a fight, but similarly your landlord should not expect to get another penny out of you either (providing you're not stupid enough to send any money!
) simpo two said:
Did he do everything required by the contract during your tenancy? If not, argue about the £1500, too.
Good point: counterclaim.
Jesus - you know - I thought this let was gonna be pretty cool - we'd essentially left each other alone for the 4 years - me thinking - 'well - the place is in pretty good nick, the inevitable cup of coffee booted over the odd carpet in drunken stupour - 2 rooms" - never thought he'd try and claim the whole carpet back.
But apart from that - I never needed/bothered to call him about anything - there was no need - and he rarely called me.
I distinctly remember his wife saying - 'you're the perfect tennant' - i.e. I never hassled them about anything - the rent was only late twice I think over the 4 years. I didn't bill them for all the paint when I cleared out the garage whitewashing the walls and red painting the floor, nor did I give them any shit when I whitewashed the front garden wall - saving him a trip up to do that.
To be honest - I'm still utterly gobsmaked about this whole thing - I mean shit they could fight to the point of saying 'well we think we need to keep your deposit' - but to drive it to the degree where they think I now owe them another £1238 is not something I'm going to let lie - ffs - I've been paying their mortgage on the place (and some) for the last 48 months of my life - I kinda expect a bit of gratitude for that.
D'ya know - meeting them - you would never have thought they'd have this attitude in them - jeezus - it's like neighbours from hell.
What is this world coming to?
best
Ex
One more thing -
If anyone wants to take a look at his itemeised summary of the work then I have it in a word document - I tried to post the entire doc but the formatting didn't work so I just summarised the big bits let me know and I'll forward - at the very least you could print & take it down the pub and have a laugh at it.
This has all got to go out as a warning to those of you renting property.
COVER YOUR ARSES and take nothing as being gentlemenly or given.
I wish I'd taken photo's of the place before I left - I wish we hadn't agreed to do the handover on the day I had to finish packing the lorry and then drive from Essex to Pembroke to get a ferry.
I wish I'd stayed back and agreed everything, going through each room carefully.
I thought the guy was a reasonable human being who was glad that I'd been 'the perfect tennant' for 4 years and would cut me a little slack.
Contrast this whole sorry affair to me selling my ZZR-1100 when we discovered a problem with the frame and I went out of my way to fix it and make sure the guy was happy - see my ebay feed back for third_excession "Top quality seller, excellent integrity"
It's not in my nature to short shrift people and I'm stunned at this guy's attitude - maybe it's because I just can't find it in myself to treat people this way.
Ex
If anyone wants to take a look at his itemeised summary of the work then I have it in a word document - I tried to post the entire doc but the formatting didn't work so I just summarised the big bits let me know and I'll forward - at the very least you could print & take it down the pub and have a laugh at it.
This has all got to go out as a warning to those of you renting property.
COVER YOUR ARSES and take nothing as being gentlemenly or given.
I wish I'd taken photo's of the place before I left - I wish we hadn't agreed to do the handover on the day I had to finish packing the lorry and then drive from Essex to Pembroke to get a ferry.
I wish I'd stayed back and agreed everything, going through each room carefully.
I thought the guy was a reasonable human being who was glad that I'd been 'the perfect tennant' for 4 years and would cut me a little slack.
Contrast this whole sorry affair to me selling my ZZR-1100 when we discovered a problem with the frame and I went out of my way to fix it and make sure the guy was happy - see my ebay feed back for third_excession "Top quality seller, excellent integrity"
It's not in my nature to short shrift people and I'm stunned at this guy's attitude - maybe it's because I just can't find it in myself to treat people this way.
Ex
JonRB said:
I'd send him a bill for the whitewashing and painting, including labour.
See what response that provokes.
yep - I need to play this cool - I'm gonna take a few days to prepare a response and then review it.
Right now a few glasses of red are taking their toll and getting my backup.
However I'm damned if he's gonna see any more money out of me - point being do I fight to get some of the deposit back or should I just say 'no way' and let it lie
and breath....
Ex
one of Ex's mates said:
I've seen some home make-over shows where £1500 would carpret an entire house.
Not that I watch daytime TV or anything or, god forbid, BBC1
to which
the excession said:
a very valid point my friend - I shall add that to my arse-anal of responses
>> Edited by TheExcession on Thursday 9th December 23:48
I don't think you should be had for decorating unless there were actual problems like shoe marks on doors etc. Wedding as well can feck off. However, did it say in tenancy agreement that you had to tend garden..?
Money for carpets. Well that s a bit harsh, but if damage to carpets caused by you (or other tenants) then he has a point. However, has he actually changed them - wouldn't be surprised if you went back witha cheque for him to see old carpets laid down still!
I got done over similarly (Albeit for not as much) even though i completely went over teh place. You don't make money by being nice ol' chap!
Money for carpets. Well that s a bit harsh, but if damage to carpets caused by you (or other tenants) then he has a point. However, has he actually changed them - wouldn't be surprised if you went back witha cheque for him to see old carpets laid down still!
I got done over similarly (Albeit for not as much) even though i completely went over teh place. You don't make money by being nice ol' chap!
wedg1e said:
I was renting the old place for nearly 4 years paying over £1500/month
My flatmate and I were paying £950/month last year for a 1bed flat with the lounge turned into a second bedroom. This is for a small flat in Pimlico, London. Thats the going rate too!
Therefore i no longer rent as its cheaper to have a mortgage!
rico said:
TheExcession said:
I was renting the old place for nearly 4 years paying over £1500/month
Robbing bastard. I hope it was at least a castle, if not a palace.
My flatmate and I were paying £950/month last year for a 1bed flat with the lounge turned into a second bedroom. This is for a small flat in Pimlico, London. Thats the going rate too!
Therefore i no longer rent as its cheaper to have a mortgage!
I realised some years ago that rent is paying somebody else's mortgage for them, plus an undefined amount of profit. Much better to get your own mortgage, buy an appreciating asset and put the undefined amount in your back pocket.
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