Discussion
Roy C said:
They should have called it "A Fool and His Money..."
Why is that ? He seems passionate about his hobby and has the means to fulfil it. Good luck to him.I was surprised that more wasn't made of the failed engine rebuild - name and shame I say.
My old Jag XK120 fhc was totally rebuilt for it's new owner and compeleted the Mille Miglia without fault. The whole car probably cost less than his engine rebuild.
Also I can't understand why they didn't run-in the engine on the dyno before fitting it to the car.
mph said:
Roy C said:
They should have called it "A Fool and His Money..."
Why is that ? He seems passionate about his hobby and has the means to fulfil it. Good luck to him.Perhaps spending close to a million quid on a car he knows almost nothing about and has never driven or even seen doesn't make for the wisest investment. Although it's difficult to tell by following a story that's been tailored to create dramatic tension, it would seem that very little preparation of either car or drivers took place and, from the on-screen comments, that the engine had not even been run in.
I didn't think he came across all that well in the programme, but you can't tell as it's got to be dramatised as noted above. If all went well, prepared ages in advance and so on, it would have been quite boring. He does seem to be into his cars, though, and if he can afford to throw money around then why not.
I agree it would have been a much more interesting program if it he'd managed to complete the course!
Still, I would be interested to find out who built the engine, why they didn't run it in and what they found when they openend it up.
I would certainly expect reliability after spending that much on a rebuild.
Still, I would be interested to find out who built the engine, why they didn't run it in and what they found when they openend it up.
I would certainly expect reliability after spending that much on a rebuild.
mph said:
I was surprised that more wasn't made of the failed engine rebuild - name and shame I say.
Name and shame, oh dear, oh dear. Its hardly rare for engines that are rebuilt to have problems. The old man had an engine rebuilt in his classic and first time on a long journey spat a valve. Its not going to be a huge shock when it happens, bad luck yes but not a suprise. This is the thing with old cars, they go wrong no matter how much money you throw at them.
Martin seemed to have the total wrong attitude for this event and should probably stick to driving moderns. He seemed to think the MM was a race and not a regularity prominade. I'm sure the other competitors thought him equally daft when he challenged them to who would win. It was his co driver I felt for most.
This all turned into a slanging match a couple of years ago so don't really want to bring it up again but I just find it odd that Martin thought he could just throw money at the project and do everything so wrong and then I have to poke up with his blubing that was all his own doing. I made the wise decision this time to Sky + the programme so I could FFWD everytime he came onto camera and still be able to admire all the other cars that were shown.
The vast majority of cars on the mille miglia, etc are bought solely for investments. I'm sorry, but they are. Competing in such events (and others, including the silverstone classic, etc) adds provenance and value.
Perhaps the ultimate accolade for vehicles is to be allowed to compete at one of the two Goodwood events. Guaranteed provenance, cachet and an increase in value.
What James Martin did is what almost everyone else does- a lot of them are not even driven by their owners, but often a hired hand and an ace mechanic to ensure they finish.
He wanted to increase in value, and enjoy himself. Why not? As we are allc ar enthusiatss, we want to enjkoy cars. But having the car increase in value when we sell it has got to be what we all wanted, right? So whats the problkem with stating this at the very beginning: "I'm buying this car as an investment, but wnat to enjoy it..."
No different to everyone on here asking "what spec and colour should I choose on my new euro blandmobile...?". A question asked purely to maximise its resale value. Nothing wrong with that. (although it does annoy me when people say "oh, I 'had a slot as one of the first customers for the new xxx, but now I've changeed my circumstances, anyone want to buy me out for the value + £5k??")
But it was very unluck for the engine to go- if you spend money on prep for an event such as the Mille Miglia, you should be able to expect the engine to be run-in. There must have been a severe breakdown in communication if the engine builder didnt know it was for the event, or didnt bother to think of that first.
Perhaps the ultimate accolade for vehicles is to be allowed to compete at one of the two Goodwood events. Guaranteed provenance, cachet and an increase in value.
What James Martin did is what almost everyone else does- a lot of them are not even driven by their owners, but often a hired hand and an ace mechanic to ensure they finish.
He wanted to increase in value, and enjoy himself. Why not? As we are allc ar enthusiatss, we want to enjkoy cars. But having the car increase in value when we sell it has got to be what we all wanted, right? So whats the problkem with stating this at the very beginning: "I'm buying this car as an investment, but wnat to enjoy it..."
No different to everyone on here asking "what spec and colour should I choose on my new euro blandmobile...?". A question asked purely to maximise its resale value. Nothing wrong with that. (although it does annoy me when people say "oh, I 'had a slot as one of the first customers for the new xxx, but now I've changeed my circumstances, anyone want to buy me out for the value + £5k??")
But it was very unluck for the engine to go- if you spend money on prep for an event such as the Mille Miglia, you should be able to expect the engine to be run-in. There must have been a severe breakdown in communication if the engine builder didnt know it was for the event, or didnt bother to think of that first.
Presuming Ed said:
Name and shame, oh dear, oh dear.
Its hardly rare for engines that are rebuilt to have problems. The old man had an engine rebuilt in his classic and first time on a long journey spat a valve. Its not going to be a huge shock when it happens, bad luck yes but not a suprise. This is the thing with old cars, they go wrong no matter how much money you throw at them.
Why oh dear oh dear ?Its hardly rare for engines that are rebuilt to have problems. The old man had an engine rebuilt in his classic and first time on a long journey spat a valve. Its not going to be a huge shock when it happens, bad luck yes but not a suprise. This is the thing with old cars, they go wrong no matter how much money you throw at them.
If I'd paid thousands of pounds to a marque specialist to rebuild the engine I wouldn't expect it to fail. That's the reason you use a specialist in the first place.
I would also say it is extremely rare for properly rebuilt engines to have problems. Maybe your father used the same specialist ?
Roy C said:
Why is it the engine rebuilder's fault? I recall him being very uncertain about the rev limit he had been given, after insisting that he didn't want a sticker on the dial. Driver error?
Yep, co-driver said 3000, he said no, 4000. And no marking on the dash to indicate it 
He actually said himself when it broke that maybe he had pushed it. My understanding was that the 3000 limit was a run in limit. Maybe he just got a bit over excited, can't blame him for that
Piersman2 said:
Yep, co-driver said 3000, he said no, 4000. And no marking on the dash to indicate it
He actually said himself when it broke that maybe he had pushed it. My understanding was that the 3000 limit was a run in limit. Maybe he just got a bit over excited, can't blame him for that
If you watch the in-car footage, i didn't think his rev counter was even working. Regardles, i thought it was a great programme, nice bit of tension between his then-girlfreind and his lovely co-driver and hat's off to the chap for having a go. If i was in his position, i'd do the same....He actually said himself when it broke that maybe he had pushed it. My understanding was that the 3000 limit was a run in limit. Maybe he just got a bit over excited, can't blame him for that
Paul
The Surveyor said:
If you watch the in-car footage, i didn't think his rev counter was even working. Regardles, i thought it was a great programme, nice bit of tension between his then-girlfreind and his lovely co-driver and hat's off to the chap for having a go. If i was in his position, i'd do the same....
Paul
Absolutely. He did come across as a bit 'me,me,me...' which slightly annoyed me at the start. But it became clear during the programme just how much doing this meant to him, a dream come true from a true petrolhead, so good on him Paul
And the GF most definitely did NOT seem to happy with the co-driver
. I'm not sure why he had to employ quite so pretty a girl for that but can't blame him really You can almost imagine the conversation with the GF where he's had to offer her the 'photographer' role to keep her happy and allow her to come along and keep tabs on him and the co-driver.
I thought it was a brill programme with loads of gorgeous cars. I think he dropped the proverbial by not using his GF as co-driver (shes hot by the way). I wouldnt necessarily blame the engine builder, i've seen friends thrash the bejesus out of new engines then wonder why theres a strange knocking from below....
anyway - all that said, is there gonna be a "return" i would love to see one, come on James...
anyway - all that said, is there gonna be a "return" i would love to see one, come on James...
Roy C said:
They should have called it "A Fool and His Money..."
James Martin is no fool,but he has money,shed loads of it.The Mille Miglia is for people like him who love cars and can afford to do that type of event,not real enthusiasts .The entry fee alone is 6360euros and your car must be an original 1927-1957 etc etc.In my dreams I will do it in a 55 Merc SL Roadster but in reality I`ll take my old classic to Laon and have a few beers in the Ibis with real enthusiasts.If you hunt back through this forum to when the program first showed you'll find a long discussion about it from back then.
IIRC he did not in fact buy the car, it was bought by Maserati he was just the "celeb" to make the program. Pity they didn't choose one to do it justice.
The program spent almost the whole time focussing on him and his GF, with comparatively little time about the car. But then since he seemed to have blown it up rather quickly I guess they had nothing else to focus on.
IIRC he did not in fact buy the car, it was bought by Maserati he was just the "celeb" to make the program. Pity they didn't choose one to do it justice.
The program spent almost the whole time focussing on him and his GF, with comparatively little time about the car. But then since he seemed to have blown it up rather quickly I guess they had nothing else to focus on.
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