triumph herald
Discussion
What would be the largest capacity engine you could drop in a triumph herald 1200 with minimal modification ,
would a later GT6 Vitesse engine 2 litre or Triumph spitfire 1500 fit ?
this looks like is has great potential based on the chassis of the herrald if fitted with a more powerful engine ?
any reccomendations
the figures for the standard 1200 are a bit asthmatic any reccommendations on improving performance , or would the light weight body be enough car weighs around 650kg
would a later GT6 Vitesse engine 2 litre or Triumph spitfire 1500 fit ?
this looks like is has great potential based on the chassis of the herrald if fitted with a more powerful engine ?
any reccomendations
the figures for the standard 1200 are a bit asthmatic any reccommendations on improving performance , or would the light weight body be enough car weighs around 650kg
Edited by DBSV8 on Thursday 20th January 05:41
With Vitesse engine mounts (and brakes/gearbox/diff/rad of course), any of the straight 6 Triumph lumps drop in (1.6 - 2.5) and they sound great with a more liberated exhaust. 
My Vitesse 6 had a Herald bonnet most of it's life so no probs there, also the trans tunnels are fibreboard and screw to the chassis so easily modified if needs be.
My Vitesse 6 had a Herald bonnet most of it's life so no probs there, also the trans tunnels are fibreboard and screw to the chassis so easily modified if needs be.
Edited by Motown Junk on Thursday 20th January 07:24
Originality or performance that is the question. Seems like you'd be more performance orientated so I will give you my experience. I had the 1200 and I rebuilt it but really ought to have not wasted the cash, I would have been better off dropping a bigger engine in. Don't make the mistake I made by spending money getting that wheezy 1200 up to speed if you want much better performance just spend the money on a bigger engine. You can try sourcing a rot box vitesse and swap the mechanicals over - worse case scenario you need to rebuild the transplant engine and box but at least you are chucking good money at a worthy engine.
RV8 said:
Originality or performance that is the question. Seems like you'd be more performance orientated so I will give you my experience. I had the 1200 and I rebuilt it but really ought to have not wasted the cash, I would have been better off dropping a bigger engine in. Don't make the mistake I made by spending money getting that wheezy 1200 up to speed if you want much better performance just spend the money on a bigger engine. You can try sourcing a rot box vitesse and swap the mechanicals over - worse case scenario you need to rebuild the transplant engine and box but at least you are chucking good money at a worthy engine.
discovered that the Vitesse 6 2 litre / gt6 will fit with no major modification so this seems to be the best direction any reccommendations on a company that will rebuild a GT6 and ideas of costs DBSV8 said:
RV8 said:
Originality or performance that is the question. Seems like you'd be more performance orientated so I will give you my experience. I had the 1200 and I rebuilt it but really ought to have not wasted the cash, I would have been better off dropping a bigger engine in. Don't make the mistake I made by spending money getting that wheezy 1200 up to speed if you want much better performance just spend the money on a bigger engine. You can try sourcing a rot box vitesse and swap the mechanicals over - worse case scenario you need to rebuild the transplant engine and box but at least you are chucking good money at a worthy engine.
discovered that the Vitesse 6 2 litre / gt6 will fit with no major modification so this seems to be the best direction any reccommendations on a company that will rebuild a GT6 and ideas of costs As for rebuilders just join a Triumph forum and see who they recommend or perhaps find a decent local garage with a good reputation for old engines. My rebuild was a simple one and involved, Block honed, new rings, big end shells and gudgeon pins, all new gaskets and setting up the valves properly. That is the basics of it - It's worth sending the head away to get the valve seats sorted and run on unleaded fuel, perhaps have some work done on the head while it's off for better flowing. Get a webber and get it all timed and tuned up, will be a big difference.
In the short term you could stick an SU or secondhand Weber on the 1200 (I only say this because you can easily flog webers and get your money back) Cant remember, I think the Herald 1200 came with a solex carb and mine was junk, changing that alone would have made a difference as an engine is just a big pump really so if it cant breath properly it will seem like it's got no power.
Looking at the angle of the rad and the sloping nose of the bodywork, you might struggle to get a 6 in there with the standard mounting (which effectively puts the two extra cylinders forward of the current 4).
You can put the Herald engine front plate on the 6 engine and mount the front of the engine in the original manner, this puts the two extra cylinders behind the current 4 with consequent weight distribution benefits. The Triumph 6 is an enormously heavy lump! Bear in mind though that you will then need to shorten the gear selector, modify the rear gearbox mount, shorten the prop and address all the other little issues like exhaust manifold etc.
Alternatively, look to a modern, more powerful 4 pot like an 1800 K series - lighter and much more powerful than the current lump and will mate nicely with a T9 box to give you 5 gears.
You can put the Herald engine front plate on the 6 engine and mount the front of the engine in the original manner, this puts the two extra cylinders behind the current 4 with consequent weight distribution benefits. The Triumph 6 is an enormously heavy lump! Bear in mind though that you will then need to shorten the gear selector, modify the rear gearbox mount, shorten the prop and address all the other little issues like exhaust manifold etc.
Alternatively, look to a modern, more powerful 4 pot like an 1800 K series - lighter and much more powerful than the current lump and will mate nicely with a T9 box to give you 5 gears.
Hairspray said:
My dad is currently putting a 2.5 V6 in his, don't know how much of it he's had to move around to make it fit...
I guess you mean a 2.5 straight 6 in a Herald - a fairly straightforward job.The issue I raised is that the OP's car is not a Herald, it's just a Herald chassis with another body on. Given the shape of the front of the body I suspect that he may have issues fitting the S6 in the original (Vitesse) position. The kit manufacturer could probably confirm though.
itiejim said:
Hairspray said:
My dad is currently putting a 2.5 V6 in his, don't know how much of it he's had to move around to make it fit...
I guess you mean a 2.5 straight 6 in a Herald - a fairly straightforward job.The issue I raised is that the OP's car is not a Herald, it's just a Herald chassis with another body on. Given the shape of the front of the body I suspect that he may have issues fitting the S6 in the original (Vitesse) position. The kit manufacturer could probably confirm though.
heres one fitted with the Vitesse straight 6 and newer bonnet
I have had a variety of Spitfires Heralds and GT6 cars.
On every one despite rebuilding all with revamped suspension at the rear they were lethal in the wet.
IN STANDARD FORM with little power.
Frankly whilst I am a speed freak cornering a car with a V8 at one end and a seriously defective transverse suspension at the other is downright dangerous.
Unsafe at ANY speed.
The Triumph Herald rear suspension even with the full modification, rubber doughnuts + SAH roll bar etc is DANGEROUS WITH A STANDARD POWER OUTPUT.
I remember a Herald convertible flipping in Billesdon on a tricky corner 50 years ago and decapitating the driver.
With three times the power AND 50% more weight up front this is suicidal.
SURELY a Ford (Mazda!) Twin can Duratech would be a better engine and weight prospect.
Do not misunderstand me I LOVE the V8 roar and pure thrust.
But in a Herald? NO
On every one despite rebuilding all with revamped suspension at the rear they were lethal in the wet.
IN STANDARD FORM with little power.
Frankly whilst I am a speed freak cornering a car with a V8 at one end and a seriously defective transverse suspension at the other is downright dangerous.
Unsafe at ANY speed.
The Triumph Herald rear suspension even with the full modification, rubber doughnuts + SAH roll bar etc is DANGEROUS WITH A STANDARD POWER OUTPUT.
I remember a Herald convertible flipping in Billesdon on a tricky corner 50 years ago and decapitating the driver.
With three times the power AND 50% more weight up front this is suicidal.
SURELY a Ford (Mazda!) Twin can Duratech would be a better engine and weight prospect.
Do not misunderstand me I LOVE the V8 roar and pure thrust.
But in a Herald? NO
Steffan said:
I have had a variety of Spitfires Heralds and GT6 cars.
On every one despite rebuilding all with revamped suspension at the rear they were lethal in the wet.
IN STANDARD FORM with little power.
Frankly whilst I am a speed freak cornering a car with a V8 at one end and a seriously defective transverse suspension at the other is downright dangerous.
Unsafe at ANY speed.
The Triumph Herald rear suspension even with the full modification, rubber doughnuts + SAH roll bar etc is DANGEROUS WITH A STANDARD POWER OUTPUT.
I remember a Herald convertible flipping in Billesdon on a tricky corner 50 years ago and decapitating the driver.
With three times the power AND 50% more weight up front this is suicidal.
SURELY a Ford (Mazda!) Twin can Duratech would be a better engine and weight prospect.
Do not misunderstand me I LOVE the V8 roar and pure thrust.
But in a Herald? NO
Inflammatory bOn every one despite rebuilding all with revamped suspension at the rear they were lethal in the wet.
IN STANDARD FORM with little power.
Frankly whilst I am a speed freak cornering a car with a V8 at one end and a seriously defective transverse suspension at the other is downright dangerous.
Unsafe at ANY speed.
The Triumph Herald rear suspension even with the full modification, rubber doughnuts + SAH roll bar etc is DANGEROUS WITH A STANDARD POWER OUTPUT.
I remember a Herald convertible flipping in Billesdon on a tricky corner 50 years ago and decapitating the driver.
With three times the power AND 50% more weight up front this is suicidal.
SURELY a Ford (Mazda!) Twin can Duratech would be a better engine and weight prospect.
Do not misunderstand me I LOVE the V8 roar and pure thrust.
But in a Herald? NO
ks. Go away.Steffan said:
I have had a variety of Spitfires Heralds and GT6 cars.
On every one despite rebuilding all with revamped suspension at the rear they were lethal in the wet.
IN STANDARD FORM with little power.
Frankly whilst I am a speed freak cornering a car with a V8 at one end and a seriously defective transverse suspension at the other is downright dangerous.
Unsafe at ANY speed.
The Triumph Herald rear suspension even with the full modification, rubber doughnuts + SAH roll bar etc is DANGEROUS WITH A STANDARD POWER OUTPUT.
I remember a Herald convertible flipping in Billesdon on a tricky corner 50 years ago and decapitating the driver.
With three times the power AND 50% more weight up front this is suicidal.
SURELY a Ford (Mazda!) Twin can Duratech would be a better engine and weight prospect.
Do not misunderstand me I LOVE the V8 roar and pure thrust.
But in a Herald? NO
out of interest , who mentioned fitting a V8 ?On every one despite rebuilding all with revamped suspension at the rear they were lethal in the wet.
IN STANDARD FORM with little power.
Frankly whilst I am a speed freak cornering a car with a V8 at one end and a seriously defective transverse suspension at the other is downright dangerous.
Unsafe at ANY speed.
The Triumph Herald rear suspension even with the full modification, rubber doughnuts + SAH roll bar etc is DANGEROUS WITH A STANDARD POWER OUTPUT.
I remember a Herald convertible flipping in Billesdon on a tricky corner 50 years ago and decapitating the driver.
With three times the power AND 50% more weight up front this is suicidal.
SURELY a Ford (Mazda!) Twin can Duratech would be a better engine and weight prospect.
Do not misunderstand me I LOVE the V8 roar and pure thrust.
But in a Herald? NO
my original queery was could a standard GT6 / vitesse 6 or Triumph spitfire 1500 fit , obviously they can according to the above photos
Steffan - Being as some people have dropped Ford black tops in with more standard power than I get from my V8 what you are saying is contradictory as he'd be safer with my V8 if that was the case, which it was not.
I agree the rear is twitchy but I think it's fair to say that even if you have limited driving experience they are perfectly safe, honestly, if you think otherwise you'd be shocked by the way AC cobras, clio V6's or early 911's can catch you out without much warning but people cope just fine with these too and shrug at their reputation, mainly because they know how to drive.
I agree the rear is twitchy but I think it's fair to say that even if you have limited driving experience they are perfectly safe, honestly, if you think otherwise you'd be shocked by the way AC cobras, clio V6's or early 911's can catch you out without much warning but people cope just fine with these too and shrug at their reputation, mainly because they know how to drive.
Grassroots Motorsports Magazine put a 200 BHP Mazda rotary in their corner carver to good effect.
Complete story http://grassrootsmotorsports.com/project-cars/ro-s...
Complete story http://grassrootsmotorsports.com/project-cars/ro-s...
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