Dealer gets stung?
Discussion
In my copy of 'The Automobile' one of the regular old car dealers is advertising an car which he purchased at an auction. It seems the sellers description on the paperwork was less than accurate in as much as the dealer has had to carry out an fair bit more remedial work to the car prior to his resale. Our dealer also names the seller in his advert 
Of course us mere mortals always assume the dealer takes the risk of purchase at auction, hence the legitimate 'mark up'. Can't see what his beef is TBH. Nobody likes being turned over but what do you say on this situation?
Of course us mere mortals always assume the dealer takes the risk of purchase at auction, hence the legitimate 'mark up'. Can't see what his beef is TBH. Nobody likes being turned over but what do you say on this situation? tough titties on the dealer - especially if bought at auction then they had every opportunity to view the car before bidding. If its drastically different to the description provided by the auction house (I assume) then he may have a little comeback there.
On the other hand, if its an ebay auction then you don't have to accept the car if its different from the description - we had to do this a couple of times, but if you have a copy of the description with you, its hard for the seller to argue.
On the other hand, if its an ebay auction then you don't have to accept the car if its different from the description - we had to do this a couple of times, but if you have a copy of the description with you, its hard for the seller to argue.
crankedup said:
In my copy of 'The Automobile' one of the regular old car dealers is advertising an car which he purchased at an auction. It seems the sellers description on the paperwork was less than accurate in as much as the dealer has had to carry out an fair bit more remedial work to the car prior to his resale. Our dealer also names the seller in his advert Of course us mere mortals always assume the dealer takes the risk of purchase at auction, hence the legitimate 'mark up'. Can't see what his beef is TBH. Nobody likes being turned over but what do you say on this situation?
I read The Automobile (best car magazine there is) cover to cover and didnt notice that, unless you got a copy today? Of course us mere mortals always assume the dealer takes the risk of purchase at auction, hence the legitimate 'mark up'. Can't see what his beef is TBH. Nobody likes being turned over but what do you say on this situation? Tough on the dealer I say, he should have looked it over more carefully.
Huntsman said:
crankedup said:
In my copy of 'The Automobile' one of the regular old car dealers is advertising an car which he purchased at an auction. It seems the sellers description on the paperwork was less than accurate in as much as the dealer has had to carry out an fair bit more remedial work to the car prior to his resale. Our dealer also names the seller in his advert Of course us mere mortals always assume the dealer takes the risk of purchase at auction, hence the legitimate 'mark up'. Can't see what his beef is TBH. Nobody likes being turned over but what do you say on this situation?
I read The Automobile (best car magazine there is) cover to cover and didnt notice that, unless you got a copy today? Of course us mere mortals always assume the dealer takes the risk of purchase at auction, hence the legitimate 'mark up'. Can't see what his beef is TBH. Nobody likes being turned over but what do you say on this situation? Tough on the dealer I say, he should have looked it over more carefully.
Ah yes, I read it last evening.
He mentions Dynastart and autocvac, in my mind these are engine ancilliaries and I'd not neccessarily expect them to have been rebuilt with a engine rebuild.
Mains, big ends, rings, timing gear, etc, yes.
Its not the sort of remark that would encourage me to buy a car from him.
He mentions Dynastart and autocvac, in my mind these are engine ancilliaries and I'd not neccessarily expect them to have been rebuilt with a engine rebuild.
Mains, big ends, rings, timing gear, etc, yes.
Its not the sort of remark that would encourage me to buy a car from him.
[quote=mattman]tough titties on the dealer - especially if bought at auction then they had every opportunity to view the car before bidding. If its drastically different to the description provided by the auction house (I assume) then he may have a little comeback there.
On the other hand, if its an ebay auction then you don't have to accept the car if its different from the description - we had to do this a couple of times, but if you have a copy of the description with you, its hard for the seller to argue.[/quote
Tought Titties on the dealer?. I think they too are human. Dealers are not the easy are not an option for some cheapscate homegrown mechanical cockup and neither are the public . The owners winneres here are the auction house.In my opinion if someone has duped another they they deserve to be strung up. Fraud is fraud after all
On the other hand, if its an ebay auction then you don't have to accept the car if its different from the description - we had to do this a couple of times, but if you have a copy of the description with you, its hard for the seller to argue.[/quote
Tought Titties on the dealer?. I think they too are human. Dealers are not the easy are not an option for some cheapscate homegrown mechanical cockup and neither are the public . The owners winneres here are the auction house.In my opinion if someone has duped another they they deserve to be strung up. Fraud is fraud after all
Huntsman said:
Tough on the dealer I say, he should have looked it over more carefully.
...Don't see why "the dealer" should have looked over it more carefully if it was mis-described - Maybe the seller should have described it more carefully????Auctions are fast paced - That's why the descriptiopns are there. If you get something that is factually inaccurately described you can get your money back.
When I was a kid I bought a Golf MK1 GTi out of an auciton. It had "new engine" as part of the description. When I got it home and it boiled over I went through the receipts and a second hand engine from a scrap car had been fitted.
As this was not a "new engine" I got my money back, so yes you can even get them on a technicality.
I have bought a car from a classic auction and they gave me more than enough time to look over the car and relevent paperwork. the auctioneer even allowed me to start the car and even suggested calling the owner if I needed to. The dealer has now doubt been to many a classic car auction and knows the score and should have looked over the car and done any investigations he felt were needed. I have no symphathy for the dealer he knows the score and should have known better. If he didn't have enough time to look over the car he should not have bid, maybee he thought he could make a quick buck.
What would occur if the dealer then said to you, the buyer, " you should have looked a little harder, or I`ve go no sympathies for you, tough titties mate! I believe those `comments` would be plastered all over the internet about how bad the dealer is.It seems a member of the public can do it and `thats ` okay is it?. Bad for everyone ,especially if you think you can get away with it.
As said, fraud is fraud and all should be aware of that fact.
As said, fraud is fraud and all should be aware of that fact.
jonpe69 said:
I have no symphathy for the dealer he knows the score and should have known better.
I think your problem is with the word "Dealer" - Is it ok if the desription was wrong or mis-leading?After all, this contributes greatly to what you base your bid on... and what's wrong with a "dealer" making a quick buck - If they were to win the auction, they are paying the highest price for the car that anybody is prepared to on the day. After that they can't force anyone to buy it at their asking price.
As a dealer in a previous life I've been unfortuante enough to fall foul of this before, but to my mind, and especially with classics where one persons gold is anothers bronze, you have to put the effort in. A couple of times I've had to use transport companies to collect cars I've bought unseen - most of the time they are OK, couple of times they've been rubbish, but I put that down to me not going and looking at it first. OK if there is a material problem or mis-decription then you can seek compensation, but you also need to take it on the chin a bit and learn for the next time - as a dealer you are looking to pay rock bottom and sell high, therefore part of your profit margins has to account for instances like this.
Its hard to judge from a post on the forum as you only have 1 side of the story, but usual adage applies to all - dealer and private buyer - buyer beware - do your homework, check it over carefully and if you don't know what your doing, get a friend along to help.
On the plus side, there have been a couple of little gems I bought unseen that did very well - you can't expect them all to go like that or we'd all be dealers!
I was simply very surprised that said dealer should whinge about the problem in an National magazine. Is he saying that all of the other cars he has purchased at auction required no attention other than an wash and polish perhaps. Just seems an little strange all round to me, which is why I posted the observation.
Of course it all depends if you know who A Gorvin is.
One version could be ...
Which puts a very different slant on the advert. Buy at auction and get caught, our buy from a dealer - see also the article on Orchid Cars, get a proper test drive and some come back. This has been a common theme in Automobile over the years with the auction hammer price often listed on the next page to a dealer's advert for the same car.
Of course Magneto's are Black Magic and people swear by, or at, their favourite Witch Doctor.
One version could be ...
crankedup said:
Our dealer also names the seller in his advert
The other is A Gorvin, aka (T/A) The Magneto Magician, rebuilt my Dynostart, thanks.Which puts a very different slant on the advert. Buy at auction and get caught, our buy from a dealer - see also the article on Orchid Cars, get a proper test drive and some come back. This has been a common theme in Automobile over the years with the auction hammer price often listed on the next page to a dealer's advert for the same car.
Of course Magneto's are Black Magic and people swear by, or at, their favourite Witch Doctor.
Speaking with another dealer this afternoon, I thought time to err on their side for a change ( a different perspective than my usual gripe)
It is virtually impossible to find good quality stock these days that has not been f
ked up by the public or some of the trade. Dealers can spend half their lives searching out good cars they feel confident of selling for good profit.If they have spent 3 weeks looking at 50 cars or more, one good one out of the mass of st may well give them the profit and the work we repairers need. We can thank the internet that every classic car owner thinks his car is concours,in reality alot are not woth the risk .
One dealer I know travels throughout Europe trying to find good stock. The public forget that this aspect relieves them of all that agro and cost of doing it themselves. The public will still buy crap though, rather than pay me to inspect. That still mystifies me.Most would not pay to look at 50 cars or more for an expert opinion . The dealer has to do this for nothing, or take a gamble he can budget for it in the next profitable transaction. everyone thinks of it as being easy, a piece of cake.I don`t envy them their profit.
It is virtually impossible to find good quality stock these days that has not been f
ked up by the public or some of the trade. Dealers can spend half their lives searching out good cars they feel confident of selling for good profit.If they have spent 3 weeks looking at 50 cars or more, one good one out of the mass of st may well give them the profit and the work we repairers need. We can thank the internet that every classic car owner thinks his car is concours,in reality alot are not woth the risk .One dealer I know travels throughout Europe trying to find good stock. The public forget that this aspect relieves them of all that agro and cost of doing it themselves. The public will still buy crap though, rather than pay me to inspect. That still mystifies me.Most would not pay to look at 50 cars or more for an expert opinion . The dealer has to do this for nothing, or take a gamble he can budget for it in the next profitable transaction. everyone thinks of it as being easy, a piece of cake.I don`t envy them their profit.
carmonk said:
If he can't check out a car how can he call himself a dealer? That's the primary skill required. Pathetic.
...and if a member of the public buys a car from a dealer at a knock down price, and 2 months and 29 days after they have bought it, used it and abused it, the headgasket goes... everyone shouts "The Dealer has to give you a 3 month warrantee by law.... Take it back" blah blah.....But if the member of the public can't look for adecent car, then (as you put it, surely the primary skill required ?to buy a car?), even though they have thrashed the living pants off it trouble free for 2 months and 29 days, then it's still the dealers fault.
Grow up.
Gallen said:
carmonk said:
If he can't check out a car how can he call himself a dealer? That's the primary skill required. Pathetic.
...and if a member of the public buys a car from a dealer at a knock down price, and 2 months and 29 days after they have bought it, used it and abused it, the headgasket goes... everyone shouts "The Dealer has to give you a 3 month warrantee by law.... Take it back" blah blah.....But if the member of the public can't look for adecent car, then (as you put it, surely the primary skill required ?to buy a car?), even though they have thrashed the living pants off it trouble free for 2 months and 29 days, then it's still the dealers fault.
Grow up.
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