new dealer start up. which car's?
Discussion
i'm currently looking for premises to start selling specifically classic 80's motors. i've had some sage advice on the business forum but want to pick the collective brains here on what to stock. i am new to this and so would appreciate your opinion's on my plans at present. i think my staple is going to be R107 SL's, i have owned several and so know my way around them and am aware of the costs involved in bringing one up to the standard i'll need to make a small profit on one and therefore i think i have a good chance at getting cars in with "potential".
currently my thoughts are turning towards 6 series bmw's and 3 series especially in convertible guise as presently these can be picked up for little money but have the potential once a bit of money has been spent to present as good value classics. my feelings are that the 3 series will be less risky but am more worried about the costs of refurb'ing the 6.
to clarify, i'm looking to pick up well looked after private cars, freshening up cosmetics and working over the stuff that typically gets neglected-suspension etc and so be able to present cars which drive like they should and polish up well.
so. i'm after advice on the 80's 6 series, potential pitfalls ( i am aware of front wings)
advice re 3 series bm's of the same era. i'm thinking 325's.
any cars i'm missing?
I'll be really grateful for any advice.
ps i'm not going to be going anywhere near 911's ( have had a few and realise the potential for expensive mistakes)
pps. 944's ?
currently my thoughts are turning towards 6 series bmw's and 3 series especially in convertible guise as presently these can be picked up for little money but have the potential once a bit of money has been spent to present as good value classics. my feelings are that the 3 series will be less risky but am more worried about the costs of refurb'ing the 6.
to clarify, i'm looking to pick up well looked after private cars, freshening up cosmetics and working over the stuff that typically gets neglected-suspension etc and so be able to present cars which drive like they should and polish up well.
so. i'm after advice on the 80's 6 series, potential pitfalls ( i am aware of front wings)
advice re 3 series bm's of the same era. i'm thinking 325's.
any cars i'm missing?
I'll be really grateful for any advice.
ps i'm not going to be going anywhere near 911's ( have had a few and realise the potential for expensive mistakes)
pps. 944's ?
What about the Hot Hatches of the decade? I've always thought there would be a market for nicely restored XR3i's, Uno Turbos, R5 GTT's, Golf GTi's etc...
You only have to look at the difference in price between a tired GT Turbo and a mint one. A friend of mine once bought a couple and sold them on. Mostly, they were sold by people that couldn't be bothered to fix them properly. He picked up one with a blown turbo, that he had done in a weekend, and another with droopy doors. A bit of welding sorted that one out.
You can pick up all the trim etc for next to nothing. Could be a great sideline to the 6 series you want to trade
You only have to look at the difference in price between a tired GT Turbo and a mint one. A friend of mine once bought a couple and sold them on. Mostly, they were sold by people that couldn't be bothered to fix them properly. He picked up one with a blown turbo, that he had done in a weekend, and another with droopy doors. A bit of welding sorted that one out.
You can pick up all the trim etc for next to nothing. Could be a great sideline to the 6 series you want to trade
i agree. had a 205 1.9 myself. there has got to be a market for these. renault 5 turbo's are something i never went near-i was driving X19's. but they all seem to be modified which defeats the point.but i always hankered after one, the monaco version was interesting...
i think the other no brainer would be VW GTi especially in cab form.i live in chelsea at present and both they and merc 107's are everywhere still.
i can see a market.
the mike wheeler thing's a good heads up. thanks.
i think the other no brainer would be VW GTi especially in cab form.i live in chelsea at present and both they and merc 107's are everywhere still.
i can see a market.
the mike wheeler thing's a good heads up. thanks.
I think the sensible boring answer here has to buy 'Whatever car you can lay your hands on that is in as good condition as you yourself would be happy to own and that may appeal to a decent audience'.
If I were in your position, I'd not worry about aiming specifically at a certain brand etc, but give yourself a selection of goodies which will entice different people in to have a look, then guage the market from there.
Hopefully once you get up and running, some of these people will either come back for more, or possibly offer you some other cars from the period you're aiming at.
Play it by ear and buy carefully on condition to begin with.
I'd love to have a go at this myself, but placement and finances wont allow just now.
Good luck anyway!
If I were in your position, I'd not worry about aiming specifically at a certain brand etc, but give yourself a selection of goodies which will entice different people in to have a look, then guage the market from there.
Hopefully once you get up and running, some of these people will either come back for more, or possibly offer you some other cars from the period you're aiming at.
Play it by ear and buy carefully on condition to begin with.
I'd love to have a go at this myself, but placement and finances wont allow just now.
Good luck anyway!
Edited by A911DOM on Wednesday 20th January 12:17
This is something I guess a good percentage of Classic car enthusiasts have considered in one way or another . Without the experience of working for a similar company , or having grown up around this type of business , it`s extremely difficult to break into an already crowded market place .
There are some great classic car dealers around ( capitalising on the benefits of the internet). One such is the SL Shop who appear to have cornered the market with reasonably priced 107`s . Other dealers come and go , and in my experience , you won`t make a living wage dealing with a such a narrow market as 80`s German luxury cars unless you already own a fully fitted out workshop and have the knowledge to repair and service your stock .
Ebay and the like has made classic car dealers of a great many people too ; the kind of buyers you`d be hoping to attract with cars like the 6 series , 107 SL , 944 etc know exactly what they want and how much to pay . There will always be top end dealers such as Charles Ironside and Crawley Mercedes who have built up a reputation and client base over a number of years .
I`ve never tried to make a living this way , but merely cover my annual motoring costs for my small fleet by buying one or two W124`s every year at the right price .
Good luck !
There are some great classic car dealers around ( capitalising on the benefits of the internet). One such is the SL Shop who appear to have cornered the market with reasonably priced 107`s . Other dealers come and go , and in my experience , you won`t make a living wage dealing with a such a narrow market as 80`s German luxury cars unless you already own a fully fitted out workshop and have the knowledge to repair and service your stock .
Ebay and the like has made classic car dealers of a great many people too ; the kind of buyers you`d be hoping to attract with cars like the 6 series , 107 SL , 944 etc know exactly what they want and how much to pay . There will always be top end dealers such as Charles Ironside and Crawley Mercedes who have built up a reputation and client base over a number of years .
I`ve never tried to make a living this way , but merely cover my annual motoring costs for my small fleet by buying one or two W124`s every year at the right price .
Good luck !
pneumothorax said:
i'm currently looking for premises to start selling specifically classic 80's motors......pps. 944's ?
Wish you all the best of luck! All I can say is good luck finding them (and although it sounds sarcastic, I mean it!).I have a search I run every day on eBay, quite a few times per day.
- I appreciate there's lots of other sources but 80's metal is increasingly decreasing, so to speak and ever more thin on the ground (thanks Scrappage by the way).
RE: 944's - At the risk of upsetting people (not my intention, nice cars) they aren't the most popular re-seller. Thrashed examples are easy to find. Careful for Head gasket issues and tricky gearboxes. Nice ones (i.e late Oval-dashers) will still command good money but not a fortune as there's a thin cieling between the later 90's Porkers now - so you need a committed buyer who doesn't want a newer Porsche (i.e Boxster) for only slightly more.
Exciting never the less! All the best,
Gallen.
Heres my few pennies, as someone who had exactly this business a couple of years ago..... and very good luck to you from the start!
Decide on your market early and what price range you want to hit. Having lovely shiny expensive things looks great on the website but if anything goes wrong it will cost you an arm and a leg to fix.
We used to specialise in 70's and 80's stuff around the 2-10k mark, as we found that was accessible to most people.
As has been said before, go for the best condition cars you can find, theres a wealth of cars out there but it takes a lot of time and effort to find, collect and return, all stuff that needs to be factored into your costs. Some restoration stuff looks tempting, but its amazing just how long and how expensive this stuff takes to do - all the time having much needed money tied up in it.
Be VERY careful with ebay - a lot of stuff is nowhere near as good as it looks in the photos, and its also not as cheap as it was before. Also if you're dealing with a specialist item, people may well have seen it and bid on it before buying from you, so will be aware what margins you are adding. If its possible, go and see a car before the auction ends, and if its good, try and buy it there and then for a price your happy to pay. Take a trailer too so you take it away on the spot - always a good bargaining tool!
Classic auctions can be good, but again just be careful, set a strict budget as there are more and more private buyers attending these who are happy to pay over the odds because they really want the car.
Best places we found were the local free ads, friday ad, loot etc, ebay sometimes. But if you have a good website and market prescence people will come to you to sell their cars or p/x. Don't turn away a comission sale either, especially in the early days as this can give your stock list a much needed boost for very little outlay - PM for more on this!
As for stock, buy what you like and what you know, but don't dismiss the more oddball stuff, you'll be amazed at what people like and how far they will travel for the right car.
I found that most fords sold well - BUT and this is a big BUT - avoid anything modified, the cleaner and more original you can get the better - there's very few out there and they are getting harder to find, therefore prices are rising. Go for Mk3 XR3's - not so much the XR3i's unless very very clean, Mk2 granadas, any cortina, mk2 escorts (especially 2 doors are worth more than their weight in gold!). Also look for Manta's, Astra GTE's, Pug GTi's and VW Golf Gti's - MUST BE ORIGINAL - am I statng that enough?
You may not like them, but also think about Dolomite Sprints, TR7's, Mercedes W123's (the 7 seater estates sell like hotcakes), Jaguar XJ6's (series 1 and 2's as the 3's haven't really hit classic status het), etc - all stuff people's dad used to have and they want to go back to that time.
You'll also be surprised to find that the stock or base models can sometimes do just as well as the more "sporty" models - again just get that condition right!
Personnally I would avoid the 6 series, we had a few but they tend to stick around for a while, good cars, but theres still lots around and they always have little electrical gremlins that take a while to fix.
Also - While I like Wheeler Dealers - PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE take the whole thing with a huge pinch of salt - We actually sold them the red 6 series featured for about 3 grand, although when it came to the programme Mike bought it from the 2nd owner in London for about 2 - didn't quite add up! Also, you'll find that the majority of those cars were sold on ebay after the series finished. They do a great job getting the cars back on the road but the finanical stuff is pure tripe (IMO)!!
Hope thats not too long, as i said at the start, VERY good luck to you, let me know your website and if you have any other questions, feel free to PM me!
Matt
Decide on your market early and what price range you want to hit. Having lovely shiny expensive things looks great on the website but if anything goes wrong it will cost you an arm and a leg to fix.
We used to specialise in 70's and 80's stuff around the 2-10k mark, as we found that was accessible to most people.
As has been said before, go for the best condition cars you can find, theres a wealth of cars out there but it takes a lot of time and effort to find, collect and return, all stuff that needs to be factored into your costs. Some restoration stuff looks tempting, but its amazing just how long and how expensive this stuff takes to do - all the time having much needed money tied up in it.
Be VERY careful with ebay - a lot of stuff is nowhere near as good as it looks in the photos, and its also not as cheap as it was before. Also if you're dealing with a specialist item, people may well have seen it and bid on it before buying from you, so will be aware what margins you are adding. If its possible, go and see a car before the auction ends, and if its good, try and buy it there and then for a price your happy to pay. Take a trailer too so you take it away on the spot - always a good bargaining tool!
Classic auctions can be good, but again just be careful, set a strict budget as there are more and more private buyers attending these who are happy to pay over the odds because they really want the car.
Best places we found were the local free ads, friday ad, loot etc, ebay sometimes. But if you have a good website and market prescence people will come to you to sell their cars or p/x. Don't turn away a comission sale either, especially in the early days as this can give your stock list a much needed boost for very little outlay - PM for more on this!
As for stock, buy what you like and what you know, but don't dismiss the more oddball stuff, you'll be amazed at what people like and how far they will travel for the right car.
I found that most fords sold well - BUT and this is a big BUT - avoid anything modified, the cleaner and more original you can get the better - there's very few out there and they are getting harder to find, therefore prices are rising. Go for Mk3 XR3's - not so much the XR3i's unless very very clean, Mk2 granadas, any cortina, mk2 escorts (especially 2 doors are worth more than their weight in gold!). Also look for Manta's, Astra GTE's, Pug GTi's and VW Golf Gti's - MUST BE ORIGINAL - am I statng that enough?
You may not like them, but also think about Dolomite Sprints, TR7's, Mercedes W123's (the 7 seater estates sell like hotcakes), Jaguar XJ6's (series 1 and 2's as the 3's haven't really hit classic status het), etc - all stuff people's dad used to have and they want to go back to that time.
You'll also be surprised to find that the stock or base models can sometimes do just as well as the more "sporty" models - again just get that condition right!
Personnally I would avoid the 6 series, we had a few but they tend to stick around for a while, good cars, but theres still lots around and they always have little electrical gremlins that take a while to fix.
Also - While I like Wheeler Dealers - PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE take the whole thing with a huge pinch of salt - We actually sold them the red 6 series featured for about 3 grand, although when it came to the programme Mike bought it from the 2nd owner in London for about 2 - didn't quite add up! Also, you'll find that the majority of those cars were sold on ebay after the series finished. They do a great job getting the cars back on the road but the finanical stuff is pure tripe (IMO)!!
Hope thats not too long, as i said at the start, VERY good luck to you, let me know your website and if you have any other questions, feel free to PM me!
Matt
BMWChris said:
I think E30 cabs a good idea. New enough to use, quality feel, useful size for cool urban types.
They do rust though (though there are suggestions that cabs were better rust proofed than normal E30s) and there are not many that haven't been worn out or modified.
SOTW a couple of weeks back was a bargain - G plate 325i Cab - MANUAL, Leather, nice colour and half decent condition - £1000 onoThey do rust though (though there are suggestions that cabs were better rust proofed than normal E30s) and there are not many that haven't been worn out or modified.
plenty of scope for a light resto leving a nice margin.
As said it is best to specialise in some ways in one brand, it will be easier to deal with in many many ways, yes you limit your market in some ways and gain it on other. Its also hard to be a expert and cover all bases if you are buying stock the chances of ending up with pup are higher
I always liked browsing these, but his stock list appears to have remained static for a long time, so perhaps all is not well. That would be a pity as he seems to have the right approach.
http://www.danielcurnock.co.uk/recentsales/
http://www.danielcurnock.co.uk/recentsales/
The more I think about this the more I think that MGs in most forms (B, C, Midget etc) would be wise, as well as Spitfires, GT6s, Dolly Sprint if you could find one - would be a good place to start.
If you happen upon to W123 merc (particularly estate) will sell like hotcakes, and I reckon people looking for something a bit racey would go for a decent 924/944.
All of the above to me sound like fairly reasonable investments in that it wont cost you and arm and a leg to buy in stock, and should appeal to a wide audience.
Im very interested to hear how you go with this, and what you find still sells despite the misery of economy etc.
Good luck
If you happen upon to W123 merc (particularly estate) will sell like hotcakes, and I reckon people looking for something a bit racey would go for a decent 924/944.
All of the above to me sound like fairly reasonable investments in that it wont cost you and arm and a leg to buy in stock, and should appeal to a wide audience.
Im very interested to hear how you go with this, and what you find still sells despite the misery of economy etc.
Good luck
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