First classic - Midget vs. Spitfire?

[MKH9130]

I'm looking to get into classic cars and hopefully start a small (low value) collection at some point in the future. I've always liked the classics but have never done anything about it.

I wouldn't really want to spend more than £3.5k on my first, so we'll use that as a budget. I quite fancy the Mk1 Midget (Early 60's chrome-bumper vintage) and also the Spitfire (Mid-late 60's). Trouble is, looking on www.carandclassic.co.uk and I'm soon overwhelmed by the sheer choice of different cars out there!

It doesn't have to be convertible, as I already have an MX5. I am ideally looking for a small investment, something easy to maintain and keep running in good usable condition.

Answers on a postcard to...

[Combover]

Spitfires are ok, but lack any sort of real performance. Good looking car though and are very easy to maintain and parts are never a problem. Same with the midget really.

If I were you i'd go for the 6-cyl GT6, unless having a drop top is essential. Just don't get a Mk1 as the suspension was....errm....primative to say the least.

Just as a suggestion, MGBs are bloody good cars (Sir Stirling uses one for raod rallies and Rowan Atkinson races one) and you could get a 'decent' GT for your budget. Just a thought.

[a8hex]

Combover said:

Spitfires are ok, but lack any sort of real performance. Good looking car though and are very easy to maintain and parts are never a problem. Same with the midget really.

Bloke at the place I first worked had a rather breathed on Doli Sprint engine in his Spit. That went rather well. I think, he reckoned it was producing about 180BHP

[rustyspit]

The GT6 is generally regarded as more desirable, and is inevitably more expensive. The disadvantage of the GT6 compared to the spitfire is the very heavy engine - a spitfire would be more 'chuckable'. Spitfires can be tuned to produce a reasonable amount of power, comparable with a tuned midget. The nice thing about the Spitfire and GT6 is the ease of maintenance - lifting the bonnet exposes the entire engine bay, and the front wheels make handy seats when you are working on them!

Overdrive is considered a desirable option on both cars, and if you're looking at earlier Spitfires, you might want to consider upgrading to the later 'swing-spring' rear suspension which made the handling a bit less 'interesting' at the limit. As with most classic cars, the important thing is the bodywork as mechanical problems can generally be fixed cheaply and easily in comparison.

The Club Triumph forum would be a good place to start finding out about any of the Triumph cars:
http://club.triumph.org.uk/forum/ 

This thread might be useful:
http://club.triumph.org.uk/cgi-bin/forum/Blah.pl?b-spit/m-1210177015/ 

Edited by rustyspit on Sunday 8th June 12:48

[mph]

I would go for the midget every time - or the mgb if you can stretch to it.

[Huntsman]

mgb OR MK3 spit with overdrive.

[SB - Nigel]

Believe me stay away from a GT6, not enough money for a really decent Midget but Wildoliver may be along in a moment, MGB GT is an option or a 60s or 70s saloon

MG are by far the easiest to maintain because of the spares availibility

BUT with all classics it's rust that's the killer

You must drive (a decent) classic first to see if you enjoy or can even put up with an old car

Remember a lot of old cars are usually old bangers unless they have a popular badge and then somehow they become classics or collectors

Unless you're very, very, very lucky you will lose money so buy to enjoy

[215cu]

SB - Nigel said:

Believe me stay away from a GT6, not enough money for a really decent Midget but Wildoliver may be along in a moment, MGB GT is an option or a 60s or 70s saloon

MG are by far the easiest to maintain because of the spares availibility

BUT with all classics it's rust that's the killer

You must drive (a decent) classic first to see if you enjoy or can even put up with an old car

Remember a lot of old cars are usually old bangers unless they have a popular badge and then somehow they become classics or collectors

Unless you're very, very, very lucky you will lose money so buy to enjoy

I'll second the rust thing, get the very best tub you can buy, don't let anything welded put you off as long as it's been done to a good standard.

MGs/Triumphs are the 'quintessential' British classic but don't take anything at face value, the good thing is there are loads around to don't dive in to ownership in haste. When looking over a car, a good owner will be happy to point out the good and bad points.

Join the owner's clubs, get the buyer's guides. Buy the very best you can afford, watch out for rust and mechanical maladies as these are the ££££'s to fix. Scruffy cosmetics usually affect the price but are fairly simple to sort out.

[Gnostic Ascent]

What sort of drive are you looking for? In other words do you want the car to feel older than it actually is. This drove (see what I did there) my choice of car.

I went to see MG's and drove a midget and a B having said that I would never have a spitfire. I was a bit disappointed because when it came down to it the midget was just too small a car and the B drove like a modern monocoque. Then I spied at the back of the garage, where I was testing machinery, a white spit mk3. I had never seen a mk3 and loved the shape. Took that out for a spin and it was the drive I was looking for. Very old fashioned partly due to the body bolted onto a chassis. I didn't buy this one as this car was concourse condition but looked around and got another which had some mechanical issues but had a perfect body and chassis. I would have been scared of driving the concourse car and ruining it which just isn't the point of having an old car IMHO.

I still have my spit mk3 and have added an overdrive to it. It's a great car. Look to spend between 3 and 4k and you could have a good useable car. I would ask John Yarnell at www.jyclassics.co.uk to take a look at any prospective spit you want to buy.

[Penguinracer]

What about a Triumph Vitesse? Should be within budget & has the silky six-cylinder engine without the GT6 price tag?

[SB - Nigel]

Gnostic Ascent said:

I still have my spit mk3 and have added an overdrive to it. It's a great car. Look to spend between 3 and 4k and you could have a good useable car. I would ask John Yarnell at www.jyclassics.co.uk to take a look at any prospective spit you want to buy.

MK3 Spit a proper 70s sportscar (they all were basically a 50s design with if you're lucky some 60s bits on) not a sporting as a Midget (of course) but perhaps even more usable especially with overdrive

Truimph small chassis cars (Spit, GT6 and Heralds) all are very 50s feel with the seperate chassis

Herald is another car to consider

I too, strongly recommend contacting John, if you're going down to see him (and Max and Spencer) his directions to his place are good but a SATNAV or GOOGLE EARTH help, or go down by train

Triumph replica parts and components are absymal BTW

[niva441]

What surprised me comparing the Spitfire and MGB is that the Spitfire takes up the same space in the garage, yet the MGB has so much more space inside.

[jonnylayze]

TVR S2

I love classic cars and drove a 1380cc Midget before buying my TVR - a very different experience to say the least...

[52classic]

Just returned from the Swansea Classic Car show in our Spit and was reminded what a lovely car they are to drive. Feels much more ancient that its 'M' reg suggests. At about 70 your bottle runs out before the roadholding. Noisy, rattly, your arse is on the floor but you have a smile on your face.

Hard to imagine anything easier to work on and every part is available cheaply although there are some compromises to be made on quality unless you're good at fettling stuff for yourself.

At my age I wouldn't consider one as my only car though.

[lowdrag]

Join the MGOC and go from there; they have enough really knowledgable people to really help you out and vet a car. Through club sources you'll find a sound and usable car although frankly I'd save up a bit more and buy later in the year as winter sets in. Better prices then.

[Will1602]

Midgets, MGBs, Spitfires aren't really to my taste so the suggestions i make might be completely inapropirate.

Ford Escort, Cortina, Capri (parts and performance parts are really easy to get and not too expensive)
BMW (i would say this) 2002
Mini (real '60s classic minis are really nice and i hate front wheel drive)
Fiat 124 Spider

If you could strech to a bit more (£4,000-£5,000):

Alfa Bertone Coupe/later GTV (you might get a real duff one for that money but you would soon learn about body work if you did get one)
Lancia Fulvia (again gorgeous as long as you dont mind front wheel drive)

[morgrp]

The problem with a Spitfire is its 1500cc engine - although if sorted and looked after its tough and reliable, they are pretty limited in performance upgrades - Upgrades are limited and its less responsive to tuning than the A series. Of course the 1500 is in the late midgets too but you have the option of the 1275 a series too - A much more tuneable engine - thanks mainly to the popularity of the Mini - The Spits separate chassis does make restoration work a bit easier though. My choice would be a chrome bumper 1275 midget maybe with the round rear wheel arches too - Neither are out right performance cars but on a sunny day they take some beating for fun. My mate runs a 1500 Midget all year round and it never lets him down, it doesn't leak and even the optional Smiths heater is pretty good!

[lowdrag]

Interstingly I've been helpng a friend with his 1250cc Spitfire. The distributor was in need of changing and frnakly they seem to be unobtainable and he paid £150 for it From what I've learned it seems that parts for the 1500 are readily available but for the earlier models hard to find. I still prefer the Midget - look at the current C&SC magazine.

[grahamw48]

morgrp said:

The problem with a Spitfire is its 1500cc engine - although if sorted and looked after its tough and reliable, they are pretty limited in performance upgrades - Upgrades are limited and its less responsive to tuning than the A series. Of course the 1500 is in the late midgets too but you have the option of the 1275 a series too - A much more tuneable engine - thanks mainly to the popularity of the Mini - The Spits separate chassis does make restoration work a bit easier though. My choice would be a chrome bumper 1275 midget maybe with the round rear wheel arches too - Neither are out right performance cars but on a sunny day they take some beating for fun. My mate runs a 1500 Midget all year round and it never lets him down, it doesn't leak and even the optional Smiths heater is pretty good!

Only the later (to old blokes like me) Spits had the 1500 engine.
Most had Herald motor, but with twin carbs.

The size of the driver hasn't been mentioned yet.
I am 6'1", and in the Midget, fab little car as it is... not enough leg room.
The 'B' and Spitfire are much more spacious.

Looking back to when these were 'current' sports cars, the Midget was cheap fun, the MGB a man's car which always sounded the business, and fraid to say...Spitfire was more for the ladies, GT6 much more macho.

My vote goes to TVR every time...Vixen,M-Series/Taimar if we're talking 60s/70s, will wipe the floor with all of them, but hardtop only.

[convert]

I've had a 1275 (1360) midget, and a Spitfire 1500.

Spitty was much easier to work on, but Midget was more fun.

Rust really is your enemy with any old BL car of 60's/70's vintage though.

I'd agree that the A series is a great little engine (still have one in the garage) that has loads of tuning options; makes a great noise as well.

All these older sports cars tend to provide smiles at much lower speeds than 'greater' sports cars.

If you want aural drama though, you'll need to be looking at TVR's.

£3.5K will get you a decent 350i wedge, and the noise (if not the fuel economy) will make you go weak at the knees.

As has been said by others, buy to enjoy, not as an investment.

Whatever you choose, get out in it and enjoy it; while the government still allows you to.