Seized Engine

[majicthise]

Hi

I have recently started work on my dad's 1934 Rover 14, it's been sitting ouside in bits for the last 20 years so it's going to be a big job.

First thing i want to do is get the engine running, it spun 15 years ago or so, supposedly, but is now completely seized. I am pouring diesel into the cylinders at regular intervals at the moment but does anyone have any advice on other methods of unseizing engines? any help would be much appreciated, cheers.

[lowdrag]

It may sound daft but years back we used Coca Cola

[GreenV8S]

After all that time it's likely the rings are badly rusted to the bores. Take the head off, disconnect the big ends from the crank, and carefully tap each piston down to free it, using a block of wood as a drift. If it's rusted badly you should probably plan on honing and new rings as a minimum, but presumably you're planning a full rebuild.

[majicthise]

I have a a second identical engine so my plan is to mix and match the good parts from each, the cylinders in one are filled with rust because it has sat outside the last ten years, this one doesn't seem so bad so i'm making it the base.

ETA: Cheers for the help BTW

Edited by majicthise on Saturday 12th May 15:07

[jith]

majicthise said:

Hi

I have recently started work on my dad's 1934 Rover 14, it's been sitting ouside in bits for the last 20 years so it's going to be a big job.

First thing i want to do is get the engine running, it spun 15 years ago or so, supposedly, but is now completely seized. I am pouring diesel into the cylinders at regular intervals at the moment but does anyone have any advice on other methods of unseizing engines? any help would be much appreciated, cheers.

Hi,

My first car was a '38 Rover 12, very similar indeed to your dad's car, and the car that eventually gave me the incentive to take me from production engineering into the motor trade.
I will help you as much as possible with this, but I have to really stretch my memory to do so: it was a long time ago!!!
Diesel is a waste of time and is really one of those things that is based on an old wives tale.
The best procedure to get the engine turning when you have the head off is to drop the sump, which I am sure comes straight off from underneath.
You will find that nos. 1&4 cylinders are in the same position as are nos. 2&3.
Slacken off the big end caps and gently tap them down the studs but don't remove them.
This will allow you to move the crank a few degrees in either direction.
Move the crank so that it moves away from two of the con rods.
Get your hands on a three legged carborundum hone, the type that fits into an electric drill and slowly hone the exposed area of the bores right down to the piston crown, lubricating the stones with WD 40 or similar.
This will leave them spotlessly clean of all corrosion and accumulated dirt.
With a very small screwdriver or scribe scrape any remainder of residue from between the edge of the piston crown and the bore: this will enable any penetrant to get into the rings, the very area where it has to work.
Obtain some alloy wheel cleaner, but check that it contains dilute phosphoric acid; most of the good ones do, and spray it round the bores above the pistons so that it runs down between the pistons and bores: WEAR A MASK AND GOGGLES!! It will burn your eyes and the back of your throat!
Give it about 15 minutes to work and then, using a round hardwood block and a copper mallet, tap the piston crown down the bore until the big end contacts the crank. Liberally spray it with WD 40 to neutralise the cleaner. Do the same with the other piston and then try it with the next pair and, if successful, retighten the big end caps and turn the engine slowly with the starting handle several times, spraying the bores firstly with WD and then coating them with oil.
If they don't come free the first time, apply another spray of alloy cleaner.
This has never let me down on the case of an engine seized through lack of use or water ingress.
If however the engine was overheated and seized to a standstill, you might have a fight on your hands!
Personally, after freeing it I would pull all the pistons out and examine the bores and rings and stick a clock gauge on them just to be sure.
OK, memories of Rover 12: beautiful to drive, despite only having synchromesh on 3rd and top, and with a free wheel on the transmission. Smooth, quiet engine and terrific handling for a car of this age.
The worst aspect was the cable brakes, involving no less than three compensators and numerous cable adjusters.
If you stood on them each wheel started to brake when it felt like it, and you had to be bloody quick on the steering or you would either find yourself on the pavement staring at a wide eyed pedestrian, or playing chicken with oncoming traffic on the other side of the road.
Although they would probably be much better if you fully overhauled the cables and linkages.
I had a friend with a '46 16 Sports Saloon, which had the six cylinder engine with hydraulic brakes and it was utterly wonderful to drive, and stopped very quickly indeed.
I think it would be a worthwhile conversion to go to hydraulic brakes.
The car also has a superb chassis lubrication system, slowly bleeding oil into the parts that grease can't reach.
My car had an optional Smith's electric fire, I use the word "fire" deliberately because it actually had red hot, glowing elements installed in front of a fan!!
The problem was you could only use it for about five minutes on a winter's morning because the dynamo could not keep up with the power drain!
Oh, one final warning, and a great story.
I bought the car before I passed my test and managed to talk my father into driving it back from the Hampden area in Glasgow to our home which involved a trip on the old Renfrew Ferry across the Clyde.
After parting with some hard earned dosh and firing the car up on the handle, we departed with a warning from the old chap who had owned it about the battery not being good ringing in our ears.
Now you should understand at this point my father owned an utterly pristine Jaguar 3.8 Mk9 manual, and this Rover was, well... a bit of a cultural shock to him. There was much gnashing of teeth and grinding of gears, (or maybe it was the other way round) as we proceeded to the Ferry.
To board, you have to go down a steep cobbled ramp and up the steel loading ramp into the car deck; as the Rover jolted up onto the steel ramp, there was a sound like a felled tree cracking and my father, complete with driver's seat shot through the floor onto the deck stalling the old girl!!
It took three of the ferry men and myself to lift him out, mainly because we could not control ourselves, it was right out of a sitcom!!
Suitably equipped with a couple of oily planks bestowed on us with the compliments of the engine room, my old dad shakily managed to get us home.
First job the next day was to strip out the whole interior to discover the worst excesses of woodworm; incredible.
The floor pans and rear seat cradles are all made of timber, you MUST check them or suffer the impending humiliation!
Having said that all it will cost you is a sheet of marine ply, so it can't be that bad a fault.
I will never forget that old car as it was so much fun to own and never once let me down.
What did I pay for it?
Twenty five pounds!
Those really were the days.

[crankedup]

Interesting and informative as alaways, thanks jith, even tho its not me with this particular problem (makes a change)

[majicthise]

jith said:

First job the next day was to strip out the whole interior to discover the worst excesses of woodworm; incredible.
The floor pans and rear seat cradles are all made of timber, you MUST check them or suffer the impending humiliation!
Having said that all it will cost you is a sheet of marine ply, so it can't be that bad a fault.

This one is without a floor at the moment. I'm going to have to replace all the wood in it as alot of the ply has split apart.

See photos on my website www.diain.me.uk/photos/thumbnails.php?album=8

I've got the engine to turn, next job is to drain the sump and get into the crank case. I just joined the Rover sports register in order to get the workshop manual for the P2, hopefully i'll be making good progress once i've got that.