Elise 111S "better" than 111R?

Elise 111S "better" than 111R?

Author
Discussion

BadgerLad

Original Poster:

21 posts

191 months

Monday 3rd November 2008
quotequote all
Hi, first post here so I thought I'd fire off with this poser. In your opinion which is the better all-round car, the Toyota engined Elise 111S or the 111R?

The reason I'm asking is tomorrow I collect my 54 plate 111R, and to be honest, anything to while away the minutes is a good thing. However, in coming to the decision of which model to buy I test drove a 111S at the a Lotus garage in Milton Keynes. The salesman did his utmost to convince me the S was the better model: torquer engine, smoother, less gears (?!), a more "drivable" car. I failed to see his logic based on specs and left with the feeling that they has plenty of S models to sell me and no Rs in stock and he was therefore being biased. A theory I believe more after test driving the R for 30 seconds, the engine characteristic better matching my previous car and all-in-all feeling better to drive than the S. However, I wondered if anyone else shared his thinking and perhaps he actually believed what he was saying?

corinnemartin

15 posts

192 months

Monday 3rd November 2008
quotequote all
the 111s is not a toyota engine???? its a k-series

corinnemartin

15 posts

192 months

Monday 3rd November 2008
quotequote all
and you have bought a 54 plate doom blue 111r ?? how come you did not go for a 06 model elise with probax seats?led lights? later pedal box?

BadgerLad

Original Poster:

21 posts

191 months

Tuesday 4th November 2008
quotequote all
corinnemartin said:
the 111s is not a toyota engine???? its a k-series
Late 2004 onwards are MR2 engines.

Edited by BadgerLad on Tuesday 4th November 08:46

BadgerLad

Original Poster:

21 posts

191 months

Tuesday 4th November 2008
quotequote all
corinnemartin said:
and you have bought a 54 plate doom blue 111r ?? how come you did not go for a 06 model elise with probax seats?led lights? later pedal box?
Money. Would have liked the probax seats, test drove an 08 model with them, very nice.

corinnemartin

15 posts

192 months

Tuesday 4th November 2008
quotequote all
BadgerLad said:
corinnemartin said:
the 111s is not a toyota engine???? its a k-series
Late 2004 onwards are MR2 engines.

Edited by BadgerLad on Tuesday 4th November 08:46
no there not mr2 engines!!!!!!!! 2004 the 111r came out it was a 189bhp out of a celica!!!! the elise s is a toyota engine which came out in 2006!!! which was a mr2 engine the 111s you refer to came out 2002 in a s2 elise and its a k-series 156 bhp!! sounds like where you bought your car from fed you a load of bull!!

Sonicboon

74 posts

206 months

Tuesday 4th November 2008
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I have an elise S 2007. It's refered to by almost everyone i've met as an elise S2 S (as opposed to an elise 111R which has the numbers). It's actually got written on the V5 and down the side of the car 111S. So it is a 111S the guy in the garage was correct about that anyway (Lee or Tim i'd imagine). Why Lotus have given two different engined cars the same name, albeit in different years confuses me totally.

I too have driven both and the only reason I didn't buy an R is because i'd been driving for 4 months and thought it wasn't a good idea. I'm now hopefully getting an exige (same engine as the 111R) because I love the cam switch over and the whole peaky-ness of the engine.

Too be perfectly honest I wish i'd of bought an R in the first place and not wussed out (although insurance had a part to play, and yes it did make a difference).

Get an R, if you never use the second cam on the road, big whoop. At least you know it's there

beez

217 posts

229 months

Tuesday 4th November 2008
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I'm bias but id go for the 111r over the Rover powered S any day. The R is faster and if you really don't like the big bang power delivery at 6,200rpm you can get the ECU remap which drops the cam change to 5700rpm and makes for much smoother delivery. If I wanted the Rover K I'd buy an S1 as they are cheaper and lighter!

Chris49

1,121 posts

207 months

Tuesday 4th November 2008
quotequote all
Wow, you are getting told a lot of strange confusing info here!

In a nut shell most find the 111s easier to live with everyday, the R is a little more performance focused. I could go on and on but if you want to really get into this then post it in the Elise/Exige forum below although this subject has been covered (try a search).

Regardless welcome to Lotus ownership, its glorious and rest assured you have made a fine purchase, love that second cam!


Sonicboon

74 posts

206 months

Tuesday 4th November 2008
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The 111S is not just a rover engined car. I have a 111S and it's an '07 with a toyota lump in it. There are officially 2 111S cars. The rover engined one from a while back (circa 2002 ?) and the toyota one (circa 2006+).

S Works

10,166 posts

256 months

Wednesday 5th November 2008
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This has been done SO many times chaps. Do we really need a 50 page thread again?

The Pits

4,289 posts

246 months

Wednesday 5th November 2008
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S works it's a lot easier for you to just not read or contribute to this thread than for newbies to read all of the past threads.

I'm sure the S is a fine car but it's R for me all the way.

BadgerLad

Original Poster:

21 posts

191 months

Wednesday 5th November 2008
quotequote all
OK, so again I was given incorrect information about the 111S/Elise S and 111R models. Sorry corinnemartin, your ! key must be worn out. It was Lee I had the test drive with, very nice bloke but I failed to see his logic, hence my question. I thought this may had been discussed before but there's nothing like a fresh debate. Where would we be if we never readdressed things having had the benefit of time and experience?

Edited by BadgerLad on Wednesday 5th November 14:36

anonymous-user

60 months

Sunday 9th November 2008
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Sonicboon said:
The 111S is not just a rover engined car. I have a 111S and it's an '07 with a toyota lump in it. There are officially 2 111S cars. The rover engined one from a while back (circa 2002 ?) and the toyota one (circa 2006+).
Quite. It's a shame Lotus have, over time, made the simple Elise a tricky car for newcomers to understand.

As a general rule it seems the more Toyota there is in a Lotus the better.

L100NYY

35,458 posts

249 months

Monday 10th November 2008
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Elise 111S (156bhp Rover K Series) 2002-2005
Elise S (134bhp Toyota) 2006-
Elise 111R or R (189bhp Toyota) 2004-

carryondentist

77 posts

196 months

Tuesday 11th November 2008
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5 USA said:
As a general rule it seems the more Toyota there is in a Lotus the better.
If you want an engine that is heavier, less fuel efficient and (under the legislation at the time of certification) more polluting - then sure toyota is better. Although, I have to say the gear box is far superior to the rover.

Sorry I couldn't resist this thread.

The key message is that both cars have their pros and cons, you have to drive both and make the decision for yourself.

kambites

68,189 posts

227 months

Tuesday 11th November 2008
quotequote all
I drove both extensively before making the decision. I decided the 111S was the better car. Assuming you actually mean an "Elise 111S" (K-series engine) not an "Elise S" (Toyota engine).

ETA: Ah, you mean the "Elise S", in that case the R/111R is better.


Edited by kambites on Tuesday 11th November 11:30

anonymous-user

60 months

Thursday 13th November 2008
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carryondentist said:
5 USA said:
As a general rule it seems the more Toyota there is in a Lotus the better.
The key message is that both cars have their pros and cons, you have to drive both and make the decision for yourself.
I'm sure that's the right approach. Don't forget Toyota and Lotus go back a long way with increasing Toyota content in both Esprit and Excel as the quality of those cars improved. IIRC it was GM buying Lotus which led to the temporary cooling of that relationship. Toyota engines have enabled Lotus to sell cars in global markets today, benefitting from Toyota emissions compliance.

eowen

16,699 posts

271 months

Friday 14th November 2008
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some (correct) information here: http://wiki.seloc.org/a/SELOC_TechWiki

ad111s

978 posts

208 months

Friday 14th November 2008
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corinnemartin said:
BadgerLad said:
corinnemartin said:
the 111s is not a toyota engine???? its a k-series
Late 2004 onwards are MR2 engines.

Edited by BadgerLad on Tuesday 4th November 08:46
no there not mr2 engines!!!!!!!! 2004 the 111r came out it was a 189bhp out of a celica!!!! the elise s is a toyota engine which came out in 2006!!! which was a mr2 engine the 111s you refer to came out 2002 in a s2 elise and its a k-series 156 bhp!! sounds like where you bought your car from fed you a load of bull!!
My 05 plate 111s is a k series one of the last ones off the production line before they changed to the S with the yota engine