RE: GM confirms Proton rumours
Thursday 18th January 2007
Lotus: in GM's hands again?General Motors boss Rick Wagoner has confirmed that his cash-strapped company is in acquisition talks with similarly struggling Malaysian carmaker Proton, the owner of Lotus Cars.
GM confirms Proton rumours
Lotus' owner set to sell to the General?
Lotus: in GM's hands again?
He said he was interested in acquiring a stake, according tothe FT, although GM's the third such company to approach Proton. Volkswagen and Peugeot-Citroën have also been in talks, looking to expand their manufacturing bases in south-east Asia.
GM's also primarily interested in Proton for its strategic position, especially since it has underused car plants that have capacity for up to one million vehicles annually.
Were it to come to pass, what would happen to Lotus is anyone's guess...
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Discussion
At least our build quality might start to get better again
Gooby said:
GM should be selling not buying.
Sometimes you have to speculate to accumulate, a last throw of the dice maybe. I guess the're planning long term with this, I don't s'pose the're no gonna go down the pan any time soon!? Would be nice if they started chucking money at Lotus, but doubt it.
Gooby said:
At the moment there is no problem with build quality. What on earth would a basket case like GM bring to Lotus? Lets face it, they are a loss making pension firm with a loss making manufacturing arms. GM should be selling not buying.
great!
great!Come on Gooby, have you seen the state of those Europa's? they are a mess
Boggy
'Acquiring a stake' is a world away from 'buying a controlling interest'.
GM want access to cheap labour and factories in the east, Proton wants some cash and to keep those factories turning over. An exchange of equity would make sense, but from this angle it doesn't look like GM would end up having much say over what happens with Lotus.
GM want access to cheap labour and factories in the east, Proton wants some cash and to keep those factories turning over. An exchange of equity would make sense, but from this angle it doesn't look like GM would end up having much say over what happens with Lotus.
jpf said:
GM is through the worst of their problems. Smart move if they can pull it off.
Maybe GM will figure out a way to make the ingress/egress of the Elise "reasonable" for people over 6' who weigh 170 pounds or so.
Maybe GM will figure out a way to make the ingress/egress of the Elise "reasonable" for people over 6' who weigh 170 pounds or so.
Strange... 6'2", 205 lbs and no problems here.
You mean being skinnier makes your joins hard?
tricky 100 said:
I should think their after the cheap labour to build some of their models and havn't given a second thought to Lotus .
Is that why they were so keen to produce a VX220/Speedster then? They had Lotus once... and when they didn't have them, they realised that they were losing out in that market. VX220 didn't sell as well as they liked (not becasue it was a bad car, but becuase of marketing). There's an outside chance they may quite like the Lotus branding associated with them again... especially since the Elise has been 'Americanised'.
gorrieman said:
tricky 100 said:
I should think their after the cheap labour to build some of their models and havn't given a second thought to Lotus .
Is that why they were so keen to produce a VX220/Speedster then? They had Lotus once... and when they didn't have them, they realised that they were losing out in that market. VX220 didn't sell as well as they liked (not becasue it was a bad car, but becuase of marketing). There's an outside chance they may quite like the Lotus branding associated with them again... especially since the Elise has been 'Americanised'.
Maybe they never expected to sell many VX220's and just produced it as a loss leader to entice people to their brand ,
" yes its a Vauxhall meriva but its made by the same people that make that VX racing thingy "
Just like it works for Toyota
" Yes its Toyota boring corolla but its made by the same people that make Formula 1 cars "
GM sell the VX220 in the USA as a Pontiac Solstice. It was released around 18 months ago. They have sold over 19000 of them in the past 12 months, overtaking the MX-5 as the best selling small sports car. It may soon be sold as a Saturn Sky, that would be a shame 'cos Saturn is a shit badge to put on such a nice car. This may have something to do with it.
cat@10 said:
GM sell the VX220 in the USA as a Pontiac Solstice. It was released around 18 months ago. They have sold over 19000 of them in the past 12 months, overtaking the MX-5 as the best selling small sports car. It may soon be sold as a Saturn Sky, that would be a shame 'cos Saturn is a shit badge to put on such a nice car. This may have something to do with it.
Solstice is a totally different chassis to the VX220. Front engine position in the Kappa platform. It uses modified Astra parts, with Corvette style chassis construction. Sold on the continent as the Opel Gt, but can't be converted to RHD. Kappa II will be able to be RHD however, and should yield a Holden as well.
Imagine an Elise or an Europa with GM's new Ecotec turbo 2.0-liter four-
cylinder that makes 260 horsepower and 260 pound-feet of torque.
This engine is already being used in GM's Saturn SKY Red Line and the
Pontiac Solstice GXP here in the US. The only issue is the
transmission… if they could only use the transmission out of a Honda
S2000 –too bad that will not work - only a dream.
I don't think GM would allow Lotus to use any of the corvette engines
(LS7) in the Esprit because of the competition. Also these engines
are large and heavy… compared to Lotus last 3.5 V8. But how about an
Esprit that uses the Cadillac 4.4L Supercharged Northstar V8 VVT, the
same one out of the STS-V model? It puts out 469 hp @ 6,400 rpm /
439 lb-ft @ 3,900 rpm. I'm sure Lotus could bump it up to close to
500HP and then mate it up to the GM's 6-speed transaxle from the
corvette. So the only issue would be the bell housing for the
transmission. The Northstar engine has been very successful and is
very durable; my father has one with over 100,000 miles with no
issues but that one is not Supercharged.
Just my opinion
Good luck to both Lotus & GM if the deal goes through.
cylinder that makes 260 horsepower and 260 pound-feet of torque.
This engine is already being used in GM's Saturn SKY Red Line and the
Pontiac Solstice GXP here in the US. The only issue is the
transmission… if they could only use the transmission out of a Honda
S2000 –too bad that will not work - only a dream.
I don't think GM would allow Lotus to use any of the corvette engines
(LS7) in the Esprit because of the competition. Also these engines
are large and heavy… compared to Lotus last 3.5 V8. But how about an
Esprit that uses the Cadillac 4.4L Supercharged Northstar V8 VVT, the
same one out of the STS-V model? It puts out 469 hp @ 6,400 rpm /
439 lb-ft @ 3,900 rpm. I'm sure Lotus could bump it up to close to
500HP and then mate it up to the GM's 6-speed transaxle from the
corvette. So the only issue would be the bell housing for the
transmission. The Northstar engine has been very successful and is
very durable; my father has one with over 100,000 miles with no
issues but that one is not Supercharged.
Just my opinion
Good luck to both Lotus & GM if the deal goes through.
Lotus have been through crisis after crisis and they always manage to survive
the secret is the people that work at the factory - not the cars
as long as they don't try to move the development and design centre, then Lotus will always be strong
manufacturing the cars abroad may actually make sense
the secret is the people that work at the factory - not the cars
as long as they don't try to move the development and design centre, then Lotus will always be strong
manufacturing the cars abroad may actually make sense
Don't tell that to the guys @ Hethel thatDoes this mean the end of Hethel ie sell off the assets and move production to the US.
This is all dangerously close to diluting the brand, but I recon the new esprit with the V8 LS7 would be ideal. I suppose the elise would be dropped and the mid sized car would be dropped too.
Anybody got some insight to this?
HT
This is all dangerously close to diluting the brand, but I recon the new esprit with the V8 LS7 would be ideal. I suppose the elise would be dropped and the mid sized car would be dropped too.
Anybody got some insight to this?
HT
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