Discussion
As I posted earlier I have bought a bascket case 130/4, in Malaysia, one of only two cars in country. The more I look at it the more I fancy it as a daily driver, so my thoughts are to go Mazda MX5, for all the running gear.
The basic law here is I can't change the chassis, no problem there I can repair/replate the chassis, and I can not change the engine to one that increases the engine CC, although engine swap for same (oe close) cc is possible.
My thoughts are a 1600 MX5 to provide everything, diff, 5 speed, engine, uprights brakes and wheels. Fabricate new wishbones to go from the lotus chassis to the uprights, replica minilights, that would give me modern 4 pot brakes, decent wheels etc.
The rest of the car will be upgraded with leather interior. Now none of the work is a problem I can get it all done for a resonable cost. But does any one have experience of putting a MX5 into the chassis, does the gear box go?
I will then sell all the lotus bits uprights, hubs wheels etc, but I'm thinking of rebuilding the engine and putting into an Escort, I can get a MK1 2 door shell for peanuts, I've got loads of twin cam/crossflow bits as I have a caterham. I know real twin cam escorts fetch huge money but is there market in the UK for twin cam clones?
I've no problems shipping the car or parts to the UK i know people who do it all the time.
Comments advice appreciated,
The basic law here is I can't change the chassis, no problem there I can repair/replate the chassis, and I can not change the engine to one that increases the engine CC, although engine swap for same (oe close) cc is possible.
My thoughts are a 1600 MX5 to provide everything, diff, 5 speed, engine, uprights brakes and wheels. Fabricate new wishbones to go from the lotus chassis to the uprights, replica minilights, that would give me modern 4 pot brakes, decent wheels etc.
The rest of the car will be upgraded with leather interior. Now none of the work is a problem I can get it all done for a resonable cost. But does any one have experience of putting a MX5 into the chassis, does the gear box go?
I will then sell all the lotus bits uprights, hubs wheels etc, but I'm thinking of rebuilding the engine and putting into an Escort, I can get a MK1 2 door shell for peanuts, I've got loads of twin cam/crossflow bits as I have a caterham. I know real twin cam escorts fetch huge money but is there market in the UK for twin cam clones?
I've no problems shipping the car or parts to the UK i know people who do it all the time.
Comments advice appreciated,
Seems a shame to break up a car with all of it's original components and +2s are getting pretty rare these days (allegedly only about 450 left in the UK - probably much less than 1000 worldwide I'd guess)...
That said, it may help that the "chassis" is in fact a sub-frame not a proper chassis and the chassis number relates to the fibreglass monocoque itself there may or may not be a number stamped on the sub-frame but as far as the car's identity goes it's irrelevant (at least in the UK). People have made this mistake here in the past and, in error, changed the chassis number to that of the sub-frame when the original went rusty and was changed causing themselves/future owners all sorts of grief over reg. plates etc.
In the UK there's a company (Spyder engineering) that manufactures the bits to replace the original +2 running gear with ford parts. This includes a sub-frame modified to fit the zebec engine, wishbones, a ford diff etc. I don't know if a MX5/Miata engine would fit this but you may want to investigate further as they've already done all the hard work in terms of design/engineering and you can buy stiff, more or less, off the shelf. I've driven a 220bhp +2 zebec conversion and it was a lot of fun - massively quick (the body and chassis are in the region of 850kg) although not easy to use on the road as it was set up as a track car with competition brake pads and very stiff suspension.
I used my standard(isn) +2 130/5 as a daily driver for a while and, to be frank, it wasn't the engine and drive train that was the problem. In the winter/very wet weather the old-fashioned de-misting system and windscreen wipers means it's hard work and in the end the scary behaviour of other drivers (esp lorries) at rush hour in and around a car with minimal side impact protection that is also very low and hard to see meant that I went for more relaxing commuting options after a few near-misses with t***s that couldn't look to their side when changing lane.
That said, it may help that the "chassis" is in fact a sub-frame not a proper chassis and the chassis number relates to the fibreglass monocoque itself there may or may not be a number stamped on the sub-frame but as far as the car's identity goes it's irrelevant (at least in the UK). People have made this mistake here in the past and, in error, changed the chassis number to that of the sub-frame when the original went rusty and was changed causing themselves/future owners all sorts of grief over reg. plates etc.
In the UK there's a company (Spyder engineering) that manufactures the bits to replace the original +2 running gear with ford parts. This includes a sub-frame modified to fit the zebec engine, wishbones, a ford diff etc. I don't know if a MX5/Miata engine would fit this but you may want to investigate further as they've already done all the hard work in terms of design/engineering and you can buy stiff, more or less, off the shelf. I've driven a 220bhp +2 zebec conversion and it was a lot of fun - massively quick (the body and chassis are in the region of 850kg) although not easy to use on the road as it was set up as a track car with competition brake pads and very stiff suspension.
I used my standard(isn) +2 130/5 as a daily driver for a while and, to be frank, it wasn't the engine and drive train that was the problem. In the winter/very wet weather the old-fashioned de-misting system and windscreen wipers means it's hard work and in the end the scary behaviour of other drivers (esp lorries) at rush hour in and around a car with minimal side impact protection that is also very low and hard to see meant that I went for more relaxing commuting options after a few near-misses with t***s that couldn't look to their side when changing lane.
I do agree with you on breaking it, and I'm not decided, Thanks for the encouragement not to break it, that what I need its eassier to re-engine here maybe to easy.
I had a ELan Sprint and a JPS Europe in the 70's, and I currantly have a Lotus Carlton and a Caterham so I know about the Chassis issue, I remember all the fuss when people started to change chassis and eventually DVLA agreed the number was the body shell,
The problem is here we have a thing called JPJ, which is exactly the same as the DVLA there is no way I could get a chassis into the country, I would need an approval permit (AP)and that in nearly impossible, But as I say I have no big issues with the chassis I can repair the old one, I bet I could even get one made up as a copy from the original. A few months ago I shipped in a cyl head for my wifes Porsche you would not believe the custom problem, the duty was only 20 pounds, but they wanted an AP because they opened it up and treated it as an engine, because an engine has a number (like a chassis) it needed and AP. An AP cost about 200 pounds but are only given to certain people, on the back market they start at 2 grand, eventually we re-wrote the custom decleration as mechanical parts and got in no problem,
The problems I have are not the same as in the UK, I can get body/chassis repairs done easily, e.g I have a 400 BHp Sylva which is running my own design IRS, made locally, my caterham is carbon fiber, I know a guy with the moulds, I can get the interior done in leather for less than 500 pound. But getting engine parts takes for ever, and building a strange engine is not easy, I used to run an Esprit the engine was a nightmare.
But Japanese engines I can get anything done, and I can buy them cheap. We can buy 'half cuts' from Japan, so yesterday my mate bought a B10 Alpina as two 'Half Cuts' for 1500 pounds, that is all the Alpina riunning gear, engine trnsmission, diff brakes, ECU, he is now going to put in his E39. So I could buy a complet MX5 for a grand.
The twin cam I have has LCP2 cams and the car has spyder drive shafts, so its a good basis, as I say not decided yet. Long post but it lonley having classic lotus out here.
I had a ELan Sprint and a JPS Europe in the 70's, and I currantly have a Lotus Carlton and a Caterham so I know about the Chassis issue, I remember all the fuss when people started to change chassis and eventually DVLA agreed the number was the body shell,
The problem is here we have a thing called JPJ, which is exactly the same as the DVLA there is no way I could get a chassis into the country, I would need an approval permit (AP)and that in nearly impossible, But as I say I have no big issues with the chassis I can repair the old one, I bet I could even get one made up as a copy from the original. A few months ago I shipped in a cyl head for my wifes Porsche you would not believe the custom problem, the duty was only 20 pounds, but they wanted an AP because they opened it up and treated it as an engine, because an engine has a number (like a chassis) it needed and AP. An AP cost about 200 pounds but are only given to certain people, on the back market they start at 2 grand, eventually we re-wrote the custom decleration as mechanical parts and got in no problem,
The problems I have are not the same as in the UK, I can get body/chassis repairs done easily, e.g I have a 400 BHp Sylva which is running my own design IRS, made locally, my caterham is carbon fiber, I know a guy with the moulds, I can get the interior done in leather for less than 500 pound. But getting engine parts takes for ever, and building a strange engine is not easy, I used to run an Esprit the engine was a nightmare.
But Japanese engines I can get anything done, and I can buy them cheap. We can buy 'half cuts' from Japan, so yesterday my mate bought a B10 Alpina as two 'Half Cuts' for 1500 pounds, that is all the Alpina riunning gear, engine trnsmission, diff brakes, ECU, he is now going to put in his E39. So I could buy a complet MX5 for a grand.
The twin cam I have has LCP2 cams and the car has spyder drive shafts, so its a good basis, as I say not decided yet. Long post but it lonley having classic lotus out here.
minor5 said:
Speak to Andy Widnal at Spider engineering they used to do a refurbishment service(i.e. you are not replacing it)
From what the OP has said I guess that importing and exporting the "frame" might be an issue (plus by the time you've sent it from Malaysia to the UK and back you probably could have scratch-built a gold plated version locally)... OP - the reason I stressed the point about it being a sub-frame and not a chassis was to see if that would help in importing a new one, but I guess it's a fairly significant risk to take. If the existing chassis is saveable then that's probably the way forward. As you're probably aware though, one if the biggest issues is ensuring that you end up with a chassis that is to the right dimensions (the suspension dimensions are very important if you want the car to handle really well), also be very careful to flush out any petrol/vapour from the front cross member if anyone has to do any welding in and around it. Parts availability for the twin cam is amazingly good (although pricy if you need a new block/head) and if there well set up they seem pretty reliable (fingers crossed!).
I'd recommend the elan.net forum as a good source of advice - there will probably be people on there who have considered other engine options aside from the Ford Zetec one.
The Chassis not an issue, I am certain it can be repaired but I can get one made up if I needed one, same with the body I could get a new shell made, as I said my Sylva runs an IRS I designed, and has a body made locally, I also have a caterham which runs a carbon fiber body made locally. You would not belive what you can get made in Asia and if you pay a fair price and source material yourself the quality is fantastic, I can buy a carbon fiber Elese body almost of the shelf locally.
Same with parts I have a caterham super sprint, and a Lotus Carlton, so I know most of the contacts for lotus spares, first time I dealt with paul Matty he was in cradley Heath. I had an Elan Sprint in 74 and a JPS Europe in the Early 80's.
My real quustion is about fitting the MX5 engine and box, any one done it.
Same with parts I have a caterham super sprint, and a Lotus Carlton, so I know most of the contacts for lotus spares, first time I dealt with paul Matty he was in cradley Heath. I had an Elan Sprint in 74 and a JPS Europe in the Early 80's.
My real quustion is about fitting the MX5 engine and box, any one done it.
OP, as mentioned you're probably better asking the question in the élan.net forum. That said, I've done a quick search on it and the question has been asked before. Apparently the MX5/Miata engine is too tall and the engine/gearbox/gear lever dimensions don't work well. You might want to check yourself for certain thought.
Lotus 50 thanks for that, I think you've persuaded me to keep the twin cam, I opened the cam cover the weekend, top end looks good, engine is seized, but don't think that is major, oil is clean. Biggest problem to date has been removing rat skeletons, 4in the transmission, several behind grill and under back seats, 70years stood in the tropics.
For an escort shell look at Amudha.my 2door Mk 1 come up on regular basis, and the od 2door cortina, Malaysian British ford car group on face book also worth a look.
For an escort shell look at Amudha.my 2door Mk 1 come up on regular basis, and the od 2door cortina, Malaysian British ford car group on face book also worth a look.
Gassing Station | General Lotus Stuff | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff