Old Lotuses and E10 fuel
Discussion
I'm trying to collate some information about E10 and the likely effects on older Lotus cars (mainly 900 series engine n/a).
So far - I've had a statement from Lotus that they don't recommend it for 900 series (engine & fuel system weren't designed for it) or K-series engined cars.
The Dell'orto distributor says that he has been informed that there should be no problems for the carbs as long they're used regularly, but that leaving them sitting too long could rot the diaphragm.
This report : http://info.ornl.gov/sites/publications/files/Pub2... seems to give some hope that effects on metals & polymers are not necessarily as bad as the "Qinetiq report" used by DfT and FBHVC seems to suggest.
I'd love to hear from anyone who has been running a 900 series engined car on fuel with a high ethanol content and what effects you've noticed.
If there's any interest - I'll report back here as well on the Excel site.
So far - I've had a statement from Lotus that they don't recommend it for 900 series (engine & fuel system weren't designed for it) or K-series engined cars.
The Dell'orto distributor says that he has been informed that there should be no problems for the carbs as long they're used regularly, but that leaving them sitting too long could rot the diaphragm.
This report : http://info.ornl.gov/sites/publications/files/Pub2... seems to give some hope that effects on metals & polymers are not necessarily as bad as the "Qinetiq report" used by DfT and FBHVC seems to suggest.
I'd love to hear from anyone who has been running a 900 series engined car on fuel with a high ethanol content and what effects you've noticed.
If there's any interest - I'll report back here as well on the Excel site.
Quick update on progress so far. This is all based on the Excel, but may well apply to the other 9xx engined cars.
i) Carbs - Dell'Ortos should be fine (opinion received from the manufacturers by two different routes). None of the perishable components are immersed in fuel as far as anyone knows.
ii) Engine components - since the fuel is only in there as vapour and combustion products there should be no problems.
iii) Fuel tanks - steel tanks will suffer from corrosion because of water build-up due to the hydroscopic effect of ethanol. Solution is to drive them regularly. If storing, keep the tank full and use a fuel stabiliser to stop the ethanol "going off". Check the fuel filter regularly to see if there's any sign of rust coming from the tank in the fuel.
iv) Fuel pipes - teflon pipes will be fine (i.e. the pipes in the engine bay on the Excel, unless they've been replaced).
Other fuel pipes are an unknown at the moment - investigation continues. They may need to be replace as the ethanol does attack some rubbers.
v) fuel pumps - diaphragms & seals may be damaged by ethanol and need to be replaced.
So - not a complete disaster, but some of the "minor" (as in cheaper and not very complicated to tackle) components will need to be monitored and may have to replaced sooner than would have been the case without E10.
Full sources and more detail are on the thread on the Excel forum.
i) Carbs - Dell'Ortos should be fine (opinion received from the manufacturers by two different routes). None of the perishable components are immersed in fuel as far as anyone knows.
ii) Engine components - since the fuel is only in there as vapour and combustion products there should be no problems.
iii) Fuel tanks - steel tanks will suffer from corrosion because of water build-up due to the hydroscopic effect of ethanol. Solution is to drive them regularly. If storing, keep the tank full and use a fuel stabiliser to stop the ethanol "going off". Check the fuel filter regularly to see if there's any sign of rust coming from the tank in the fuel.
iv) Fuel pipes - teflon pipes will be fine (i.e. the pipes in the engine bay on the Excel, unless they've been replaced).
Other fuel pipes are an unknown at the moment - investigation continues. They may need to be replace as the ethanol does attack some rubbers.
v) fuel pumps - diaphragms & seals may be damaged by ethanol and need to be replaced.
So - not a complete disaster, but some of the "minor" (as in cheaper and not very complicated to tackle) components will need to be monitored and may have to replaced sooner than would have been the case without E10.
Full sources and more detail are on the thread on the Excel forum.
Breadvan72 said:
I am shoving V-Power and Castril Valvemaster into my 1990 Excel SE. It seems OK so far.
It would be - E10 hasn't hit the UK in large quantities yet. You don't need a lead replacement additive, btw - the 9xx series engines were designed to run on unleaded.
LR additives don't counteract the effects of ethanol.
I did not see the post as curt, thanks. I hadn't been able to obtain reliable info re unleaded fuel for the Excel. (I should have rung Steve Morland, but forgot). Excel.net will not let me register (or, rather, the sleepy Mods will not validate my registration, so I can't post there).
Breadvan72 said:
I did not see the post as curt, thanks. I hadn't been able to obtain reliable info re unleaded fuel for the Excel. (I should have rung Steve Morland, but forgot). Excel.net will not let me register (or, rather, the sleepy Mods will not validate my registration, so I can't post there).
email sent. There's a single administrator with an over-active spam filter which sometimes loses new members - but I have a big stick and can poke him till he sorts things out.It is only some components in the fuel system that will be affected by the corrosive properties of ethanol in E10 fuel. The experience in France and the USA (15% ethanol is common) is that seals and gaskets are affected.
The hygroscopic properties are of more importance if the car is laid up.
E10 may cause reduced fuel economy.
There is a product widely used in France and USA to protect against the E10 fuel. It also gives a much improved fuel economy.
The hygroscopic properties are of more importance if the car is laid up.
E10 may cause reduced fuel economy.
There is a product widely used in France and USA to protect against the E10 fuel. It also gives a much improved fuel economy.
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