Discussion
Everybody loves a 'What Car' thread...
So I moved to Sydney about 2.5 years back, selling the Mk5 Golf R32 and modified VX220 Turbo I had at the time. I was only coming for a year originally, and given the high price of cars here compared to the UK I was not in a rush to spend a lot on not a lot. Anyway, 2.5 years later I'm still here and looking at applying for Permanent Residency. And most importantly it's making me very unhappy not having a toy! I have come to terms with the high price of European cars, but as I'm not sure how long I am going to stay in the country I don't want to tie too much of my savings up in a car.
The Brief: Manual, convertible, preferably 4 seats, preferably German, ideally naturally aspirated, $30-50k, weekender not daily, special / fun but not too flash to worry about leaving on the street (Bondi Beach).
Originally I wanted an E46 M3 convertible, but nice one's are few and far between and manual cabs seem to be almost non-existant. I really want the pleasure of a manual shift rather than SMG or such. This got me looking at 996 convertibles, and Boxster S's- both cars I would have considered a few years ago to be a bit 'soft'. I guess that's getting older and needing different things from a car! 996 is probably my least favourite edition, and I have never been a fan of cooking spec Porsche's, but it is currently my favourite choice as it would be fun to cruise around in in the summer. I have been looking at a Boxster S to keep in the UK and the choice here is very limited. There are a couple of nice 986 S's in the price bracket, but the fact they are only a 2 seater is a bit of an inconvenience. I have also considered E90 series 335 cabs, but they do not feel special enough. A B7 RS4 came up but the colour combo was really not too my taste. I would like an older 930 series Porsche, but I worry about the air-cooled engines in sumer traffic and on longer trips as well as the lack of A/C. Has anyone had much experience running one? There are a few Elise's in the budget, but having owned the VX220 it's not a very practical proposition for this country especially as my only car that would live on the street.
As manual convertible car's seem to be few and far between, other options I have considered are E46 M3 Coupe, 996 Coupe and S3. If I was a bit more committed to being here longer term, an E92 M3 cab would probably be my 1st choice. As options that would be fun to cruise in and also go camping and haul my bicycles etc, I have looked at Range Rover Sports and Land Rovers.
I am not big into Jap cars, and given how stringent the traffic cops are out here I am looking for something that is swift and fun to cruise the beaches in with friends over the summer, rather than the the fastest possible machine for my money. Are there any other options I have overlooked? Is it easy to bring in cars from other states?
And if anyone suggests the default Pistonheads answer of MX5- they get a slap
Cheers
DC.
So I moved to Sydney about 2.5 years back, selling the Mk5 Golf R32 and modified VX220 Turbo I had at the time. I was only coming for a year originally, and given the high price of cars here compared to the UK I was not in a rush to spend a lot on not a lot. Anyway, 2.5 years later I'm still here and looking at applying for Permanent Residency. And most importantly it's making me very unhappy not having a toy! I have come to terms with the high price of European cars, but as I'm not sure how long I am going to stay in the country I don't want to tie too much of my savings up in a car.
The Brief: Manual, convertible, preferably 4 seats, preferably German, ideally naturally aspirated, $30-50k, weekender not daily, special / fun but not too flash to worry about leaving on the street (Bondi Beach).
Originally I wanted an E46 M3 convertible, but nice one's are few and far between and manual cabs seem to be almost non-existant. I really want the pleasure of a manual shift rather than SMG or such. This got me looking at 996 convertibles, and Boxster S's- both cars I would have considered a few years ago to be a bit 'soft'. I guess that's getting older and needing different things from a car! 996 is probably my least favourite edition, and I have never been a fan of cooking spec Porsche's, but it is currently my favourite choice as it would be fun to cruise around in in the summer. I have been looking at a Boxster S to keep in the UK and the choice here is very limited. There are a couple of nice 986 S's in the price bracket, but the fact they are only a 2 seater is a bit of an inconvenience. I have also considered E90 series 335 cabs, but they do not feel special enough. A B7 RS4 came up but the colour combo was really not too my taste. I would like an older 930 series Porsche, but I worry about the air-cooled engines in sumer traffic and on longer trips as well as the lack of A/C. Has anyone had much experience running one? There are a few Elise's in the budget, but having owned the VX220 it's not a very practical proposition for this country especially as my only car that would live on the street.
As manual convertible car's seem to be few and far between, other options I have considered are E46 M3 Coupe, 996 Coupe and S3. If I was a bit more committed to being here longer term, an E92 M3 cab would probably be my 1st choice. As options that would be fun to cruise in and also go camping and haul my bicycles etc, I have looked at Range Rover Sports and Land Rovers.
I am not big into Jap cars, and given how stringent the traffic cops are out here I am looking for something that is swift and fun to cruise the beaches in with friends over the summer, rather than the the fastest possible machine for my money. Are there any other options I have overlooked? Is it easy to bring in cars from other states?
And if anyone suggests the default Pistonheads answer of MX5- they get a slap
Cheers
DC.
Hi DC.
This post highlights something I have thought, & wondered about for some time. This fixation you Poms have with German cars.
It may make sense in the UK, where they I presume they are cheaper, & where cars rot so much more quickly, they are changed more quickly, but here I think it is crazy.
I can't find a single European car that is worth the money in Oz, new particularly, or second hand.
For you living in Bondi, so many kilometers from anywhere it is worth driving, even for a weekend car it may be more sensible to buy a cruiser than a more dynamic car.
I was in a similar situation recently, except I have better access to roads worth driving. I did not care too much about how many seats it had, but would have been happy with four if something worth having was available.
Not being dogmatic, & reading quite a bit here, I tried Porsche & BMW convertibles, but was very disappointed with them.
I ended up with a Honda S2000 as the only thing offering me close to what I wanted.
If I lived in a city, & wanted four seats, I think it would have had to be a yank tank. Although I do find them huge, they are not bad for cruising.
Interestingly we live in one of the weekend cruise areas out of Brisbane. I must admit I find the 60/70 topless yank tanks I despised in the day, rather charming today. Not yet enough to buy one, but I do admire them driving by.
This post highlights something I have thought, & wondered about for some time. This fixation you Poms have with German cars.
It may make sense in the UK, where they I presume they are cheaper, & where cars rot so much more quickly, they are changed more quickly, but here I think it is crazy.
I can't find a single European car that is worth the money in Oz, new particularly, or second hand.
For you living in Bondi, so many kilometers from anywhere it is worth driving, even for a weekend car it may be more sensible to buy a cruiser than a more dynamic car.
I was in a similar situation recently, except I have better access to roads worth driving. I did not care too much about how many seats it had, but would have been happy with four if something worth having was available.
Not being dogmatic, & reading quite a bit here, I tried Porsche & BMW convertibles, but was very disappointed with them.
I ended up with a Honda S2000 as the only thing offering me close to what I wanted.
If I lived in a city, & wanted four seats, I think it would have had to be a yank tank. Although I do find them huge, they are not bad for cruising.
Interestingly we live in one of the weekend cruise areas out of Brisbane. I must admit I find the 60/70 topless yank tanks I despised in the day, rather charming today. Not yet enough to buy one, but I do admire them driving by.
Hasbeen said:
Hi DC.
This post highlights something I have thought, & wondered about for some time. This fixation you Poms have with German cars.
It may make sense in the UK, where they I presume they are cheaper, & where cars rot so much more quickly, they are changed more quickly, but here I think it is crazy.
I can't find a single European car that is worth the money in Oz, new particularly, or second hand.
For you living in Bondi, so many kilometers from anywhere it is worth driving, even for a weekend car it may be more sensible to buy a cruiser than a more dynamic car.
I was in a similar situation recently, except I have better access to roads worth driving. I did not care too much about how many seats it had, but would have been happy with four if something worth having was available.
Not being dogmatic, & reading quite a bit here, I tried Porsche & BMW convertibles, but was very disappointed with them.
I ended up with a Honda S2000 as the only thing offering me close to what I wanted.
If I lived in a city, & wanted four seats, I think it would have had to be a yank tank. Although I do find them huge, they are not bad for cruising.
Interestingly we live in one of the weekend cruise areas out of Brisbane. I must admit I find the 60/70 topless yank tanks I despised in the day, rather charming today. Not yet enough to buy one, but I do admire them driving by.
Maybe its because they build some well engineered cars with soul, nice interiors and good looks?This post highlights something I have thought, & wondered about for some time. This fixation you Poms have with German cars.
It may make sense in the UK, where they I presume they are cheaper, & where cars rot so much more quickly, they are changed more quickly, but here I think it is crazy.
I can't find a single European car that is worth the money in Oz, new particularly, or second hand.
For you living in Bondi, so many kilometers from anywhere it is worth driving, even for a weekend car it may be more sensible to buy a cruiser than a more dynamic car.
I was in a similar situation recently, except I have better access to roads worth driving. I did not care too much about how many seats it had, but would have been happy with four if something worth having was available.
Not being dogmatic, & reading quite a bit here, I tried Porsche & BMW convertibles, but was very disappointed with them.
I ended up with a Honda S2000 as the only thing offering me close to what I wanted.
If I lived in a city, & wanted four seats, I think it would have had to be a yank tank. Although I do find them huge, they are not bad for cruising.
Interestingly we live in one of the weekend cruise areas out of Brisbane. I must admit I find the 60/70 topless yank tanks I despised in the day, rather charming today. Not yet enough to buy one, but I do admire them driving by.
There are very few Jap and American convertibles that fit the OP's mould.
Not too sure why you won't just buy the car you like and chew into your savings. Remember that while it costs a lot to buy any European barge in Australia you get more of your money back come the time to sell than you ever would in the UK.
I too have an S2000 and for the low end of your budget it would make a nice toy for summer cruising and prices now seem rock solid for face lift models. Get yourself a hardtop and it would be perfectly happy sitting on the roadside. Mine always feels special after 7k rpm
After having my roof slashed and seeing what the harsh summers do to cars here I wouldn't want any soft top that couldn't be garaged at night.
I too have an S2000 and for the low end of your budget it would make a nice toy for summer cruising and prices now seem rock solid for face lift models. Get yourself a hardtop and it would be perfectly happy sitting on the roadside. Mine always feels special after 7k rpm
After having my roof slashed and seeing what the harsh summers do to cars here I wouldn't want any soft top that couldn't be garaged at night.
Pommygranite said:
Maybe its because they build some well engineered cars with soul, nice interiors and good looks?
There are very few Jap and American convertibles that fit the OP's mould.
When my cousin was visiting recently he had to do a 160Km round trip, just to get the oil checked in his Audi. He had been worried for a few hundred kilometers when just 900 kilometers after his first service, that silly screen was telling him to check it.There are very few Jap and American convertibles that fit the OP's mould.
As he was coming up the new England from Sydney, there was nowhere to get it checked, & only one place on the coast road. If you wanted to cross the Nullarbor Plain in one, I suppose you could put it on a car transporter.
Fortunately it was reasonably nice inside. It had to be to allow you to forget how ugly it is from outside.
As he is the only person I know silly enough to buy one, I don't know if this was usual fare with them.
VW reliability does seem to be on a par with Korean reliability, or almost as good anyway, & I can't imagine why anyone would still buy Mercedes.
That just leaves Porsche. Their hardtops are damn good, if ridiculous expensive to run, but I don't want a tin top. Their convertibles are no better than BMW soft tops, so why buy one of either?
In fact I can really sympathise with the OP. I can't think of a single 4 seater convertible that is really appealing.
Hasbeen said:
Pommygranite said:
Maybe its because they build some well engineered cars with soul, nice interiors and good looks?
There are very few Jap and American convertibles that fit the OP's mould.
When my cousin was visiting recently he had to do a 160Km round trip, just to get the oil checked in his Audi. He had been worried for a few hundred kilometers when just 900 kilometers after his first service, that silly screen was telling him to check it.There are very few Jap and American convertibles that fit the OP's mould.
As he was coming up the new England from Sydney, there was nowhere to get it checked, & only one place on the coast road. If you wanted to cross the Nullarbor Plain in one, I suppose you could put it on a car transporter.
Fortunately it was reasonably nice inside. It had to be to allow you to forget how ugly it is from outside.
As he is the only person I know silly enough to buy one, I don't know if this was usual fare with them.
VW reliability does seem to be on a par with Korean reliability, or almost as good anyway, & I can't imagine why anyone would still buy Mercedes.
That just leaves Porsche. Their hardtops are damn good, if ridiculous expensive to run, but I don't want a tin top. Their convertibles are no better than BMW soft tops, so why buy one of either?
In fact I can really sympathise with the OP. I can't think of a single 4 seater convertible that is really appealing.
Based on your reqs I would by a manual bmw 330 ci convertible. Lots to pick from in that price range
http://www.carsales.com.au/private/details/BMW-330...
http://www.carsales.com.au/private/details/BMW-330...
You want a 4 seat convertible so you can pose about Bondi, in the summer, but you have nowhere to keep it except the street, and are happy to spend up to $50k?!!
$50k on something you are gong to dump on the street for 5 days out of 7, and will realistically be able to use for a few weekends a year because it will otherwise be too cold/wet, or hot (no roof on a 40 degree day won't be fun)?
It has to be German, and a manual.
In all honestly I'd suggest a SAAB 900 soft top - Euro style, pricing from dead cheap to about $25k, and you'll be able to leave it on the street without worrying about it.
Available in Auto and Manual, quite a few about, would be specialist only for servicing etc but then so would a Beemer or Porker.
Makes sense to me - I even found one in QLD with a towbar - how practical is that!
ETA Or what about a Volvo, if you want something from a manufacturer that still exists? The latest C70s have a folding hard top.
ETA or one of these? NO? Go on, you know you want to.....
$50k on something you are gong to dump on the street for 5 days out of 7, and will realistically be able to use for a few weekends a year because it will otherwise be too cold/wet, or hot (no roof on a 40 degree day won't be fun)?
It has to be German, and a manual.
In all honestly I'd suggest a SAAB 900 soft top - Euro style, pricing from dead cheap to about $25k, and you'll be able to leave it on the street without worrying about it.
Available in Auto and Manual, quite a few about, would be specialist only for servicing etc but then so would a Beemer or Porker.
Makes sense to me - I even found one in QLD with a towbar - how practical is that!
ETA Or what about a Volvo, if you want something from a manufacturer that still exists? The latest C70s have a folding hard top.
Edited by Jader1973 on Monday 25th August 11:07
ETA or one of these? NO? Go on, you know you want to.....
Edited by Jader1973 on Monday 25th August 11:11
Actually, ignore my previous post.
If it has to be German, and has to have 4 seats then you have two other choices:
German, hand built (converted from a hardtop by a bloke with a tin opener) and has 4 seats.
Or, how about:
German, 4 seats, folding hard top so no getting slashed. Admittedly doesn't have the x-factor on account of not being hand built like the Corsa, sorry Barina.
Of course, if by German you mean "BMW" then neither of these will work because they are badged as Holden........
If it has to be German, and has to have 4 seats then you have two other choices:
German, hand built (converted from a hardtop by a bloke with a tin opener) and has 4 seats.
Or, how about:
German, 4 seats, folding hard top so no getting slashed. Admittedly doesn't have the x-factor on account of not being hand built like the Corsa, sorry Barina.
Of course, if by German you mean "BMW" then neither of these will work because they are badged as Holden........
Don't knock the Capri Jader1973, they are quite sweet.
I bought one for my 20 year old daughter, when she had a foot operation & could not drive the Peugeot 306 convertible for almost 6 months.
It was perfect. Slow enough, particularly being auto, to keep her out of trouble, & she could still spend the weekend posing up & down the Goldcoast with her girlfriend in their bikinis.
I still have it, it is not worth enough to bother selling, & it is handy to loan to visitors, saving the good cars.
It is fun, sort of, having a car you can use your alarm clock to check it's 0 to 100 times.
I bought one for my 20 year old daughter, when she had a foot operation & could not drive the Peugeot 306 convertible for almost 6 months.
It was perfect. Slow enough, particularly being auto, to keep her out of trouble, & she could still spend the weekend posing up & down the Goldcoast with her girlfriend in their bikinis.
I still have it, it is not worth enough to bother selling, & it is handy to loan to visitors, saving the good cars.
It is fun, sort of, having a car you can use your alarm clock to check it's 0 to 100 times.
Hasbeen said:
Don't knock the Capri Jader1973, they are quite sweet.
I bought one for my 20 year old daughter, when she had a foot operation & could not drive the Peugeot 306 convertible for almost 6 months.
It was perfect. Slow enough, particularly being auto, to keep her out of trouble, & she could still spend the weekend posing up & down the Goldcoast with her girlfriend in their bikinis.
I still have it, it is not worth enough to bother selling, & it is handy to loan to visitors, saving the good cars.
It is fun, sort of, having a car you can use your alarm clock to check it's 0 to 100 times.
Wasn't knocking it at all - was being mildly sarcastic though as I suspect the OP has an aversion to anything non-Euro I bought one for my 20 year old daughter, when she had a foot operation & could not drive the Peugeot 306 convertible for almost 6 months.
It was perfect. Slow enough, particularly being auto, to keep her out of trouble, & she could still spend the weekend posing up & down the Goldcoast with her girlfriend in their bikinis.
I still have it, it is not worth enough to bother selling, & it is handy to loan to visitors, saving the good cars.
It is fun, sort of, having a car you can use your alarm clock to check it's 0 to 100 times.
I can see their appeal - dead cheap to buy and presumably maintain being a Ford.
My only problem would be that it isn't a proper Capri, like this:
I agree completely with you. I love those Pommy Capris. For me the only problem is I often need something without a roof, or as high as a 4WD to be able to get into them.
Don't forget the Capri is only as much a Ford as the Laser is. They are much more Mazda 323 than Ford. Ford have disowned them, I think they want to forget they ever made them. If it is not a Mazda bit, you have to go to the US, where bits are still available for the Mercury Capri, as it is known.
Come to think of it, this is a really international car, & as such should be very prestigious.
Don't forget the Capri is only as much a Ford as the Laser is. They are much more Mazda 323 than Ford. Ford have disowned them, I think they want to forget they ever made them. If it is not a Mazda bit, you have to go to the US, where bits are still available for the Mercury Capri, as it is known.
Come to think of it, this is a really international car, & as such should be very prestigious.
Hasbeen said:
I love those Pommy Capris.
And in the spirit of this thread, I think many were made in Germany, esp towards the end of production.Anyway, as for the OP, if you want an E46/E92 M3 convertible, just get one. Can't think of anything else that closely matches your criteria other than a 330Ci/335Ci or E36 M3. If you want to go older and cheaper, you might find a 944S2 for sale, though they're a bit tight in the back.
If I was looking to spend $30-50k on a car to cruise around Bondi with my mates, then I'd probably go old school Yank - 60s Mustang.
Hasbeen said:
Don't forget the Capri is only as much a Ford as the Laser is. They are much more Mazda 323 than Ford. Ford have disowned them, I think they want to forget they ever made them. If it is not a Mazda bit, you have to go to the US, where bits are still available for the Mercury Capri, as it is known.
I didn’t realise they were basically a Mazda, or that they were made here.PomBstard said:
And in the spirit of this thread, I think many were made in Germany, esp towards the end of production.
If I was looking to spend $30-50k on a car to cruise around Bondi with my mates, then I'd probably go old school Yank - 60s Mustang.
Original Capris were built in the UK, Belgium, Germany, South Africa (MK1 only) and Australia (pre-facelift Mk1 only).If I was looking to spend $30-50k on a car to cruise around Bondi with my mates, then I'd probably go old school Yank - 60s Mustang.
Mustang is a good idea. Not sure I’d want to leave it on the street though.
We just missed getting a Perana/Piranha, when a few of those V8 Capri things were brought in from South Africa.
They were worth about $18000/20000 at the time, but I think they are Ford GT HO price today. Never actually saw one, but have seen them competing in targa events, & reckon they would be fun.
They were worth about $18000/20000 at the time, but I think they are Ford GT HO price today. Never actually saw one, but have seen them competing in targa events, & reckon they would be fun.
Pommygranite said:
Thats a very subjective view and probably tainted by you living in the middle of nowhere. Some people dont live far from dealers/specialists and some cars dont break down and some Audi's even look quite nice.
Also not based in fact. Bob Greenes Auto repairs in N. Armidale has all Audi equipment etc
There is an Audi Dealership in Tamworth and Toowoomba.
There is a VW dealership in Tamworth, Warwick and Toowoomba.
There are countless mechanics in Armidale and tamworth that would be more than happy to work on a Audi or VW.
No. There's no Audi dealership in the Nullabor. But nor is there a Kia dealership. Nor a Honda dealership. Nor any dealerships.
Colonial said:
Pommygranite said:
Thats a very subjective view and probably tainted by you living in the middle of nowhere. Some people dont live far from dealers/specialists and some cars dont break down and some Audi's even look quite nice.
Also not based in fact. Bob Greenes Auto repairs in N. Armidale has all Audi equipment etc
There is an Audi Dealership in Tamworth and Toowoomba.
There is a VW dealership in Tamworth, Warwick and Toowoomba.
There are countless mechanics in Armidale and tamworth that would be more than happy to work on a Audi or VW.
No. There's no Audi dealership in the Nullabor. But nor is there a Kia dealership. Nor a Honda dealership. Nor any dealerships.
ACT: Audi = 1, Holden = 2
NSW: Audi = 14, Holden = 79
NT: Audi = 1, Holden = 2
QLD: Audi = 7, Holden = 49
SA: Audi = 1, Holden = 30
TAS: Audi = 2, Holden = 4
VIC: Audi = 11, Holden = 56
WA: Audi = 1, Holden = 30
So, fact is Holden (or a Toyota or Ford who have similar sized networks as far as I can tell) have significantly better coverage than Audi.
If you live in the middle of nowhere, or need to travel long distances then one of those 3 are the only sensible option.
If you live in a city and want to be able to cruise down the street in an overpriced European rep-mobile because it is a "premium brand" then Audi/BMW/Merc are a good option.
But then, if we were all sensible we'd all be driving Corollas, and the world would be very boring
Jader1973 said:
How about we compare the number of Audi Dealerships with the number of Holden dealerships?
ACT: Audi = 1, Holden = 2
NSW: Audi = 14, Holden = 79
NT: Audi = 1, Holden = 2
QLD: Audi = 7, Holden = 49
SA: Audi = 1, Holden = 30
TAS: Audi = 2, Holden = 4
VIC: Audi = 11, Holden = 56
WA: Audi = 1, Holden = 30
So, fact is Holden (or a Toyota or Ford who have similar sized networks as far as I can tell) have significantly better coverage than Audi.
If you live in the middle of nowhere, or need to travel long distances then one of those 3 are the only sensible option.
If you live in a city and want to be able to cruise down the street in an overpriced European rep-mobile because it is a "premium brand" then Audi/BMW/Merc are a good option.
But then, if we were all sensible we'd all be driving Corollas, and the world would be very boring
Indeed. Not disputing that. ACT: Audi = 1, Holden = 2
NSW: Audi = 14, Holden = 79
NT: Audi = 1, Holden = 2
QLD: Audi = 7, Holden = 49
SA: Audi = 1, Holden = 30
TAS: Audi = 2, Holden = 4
VIC: Audi = 11, Holden = 56
WA: Audi = 1, Holden = 30
So, fact is Holden (or a Toyota or Ford who have similar sized networks as far as I can tell) have significantly better coverage than Audi.
If you live in the middle of nowhere, or need to travel long distances then one of those 3 are the only sensible option.
If you live in a city and want to be able to cruise down the street in an overpriced European rep-mobile because it is a "premium brand" then Audi/BMW/Merc are a good option.
But then, if we were all sensible we'd all be driving Corollas, and the world would be very boring
But being scared about driving between Brisbane and Sydney is, well, a bit foolish. There are places to go.
Interesting that there is only one more Honda dealership on that road than Audi...
That is all very interesting, but Audi definitely don't or didn't tell their car owners of these service opportunities.
The only ones he had listed were Gold Coast, & one in Coffs Harbor.
Even worse, the drivers handbook gave him a picture of how to read the non existent dipstick.
One could be forgiven for assuming that the Oz market is of very little interest to Audi, if they can't even be bothered updating the drivers handbook for a new model.
Due to a total lack of desire, this was the only Audi I have driven. As a bloke who is impressed with ergonomics, rather than trim or perceived prestige, I could not see any reason to prefer it to my company Commodore at the time.
As for dealerships, I can assure you owning a Honda is a pain in the bum only bearable because nothing that would be less so, is attractive enough to own. We would not consider owning a Honda sedan, when we have Holden, Ford, Mazda, Nissan, Suzuki, Mitsubishi & Nissan all available in town. Anyone who can't find a shopping trolley from that lot deserves to spend 4 or 6 hours driving in lousy traffic, just to get the thing serviced.
The only ones he had listed were Gold Coast, & one in Coffs Harbor.
Even worse, the drivers handbook gave him a picture of how to read the non existent dipstick.
One could be forgiven for assuming that the Oz market is of very little interest to Audi, if they can't even be bothered updating the drivers handbook for a new model.
Due to a total lack of desire, this was the only Audi I have driven. As a bloke who is impressed with ergonomics, rather than trim or perceived prestige, I could not see any reason to prefer it to my company Commodore at the time.
As for dealerships, I can assure you owning a Honda is a pain in the bum only bearable because nothing that would be less so, is attractive enough to own. We would not consider owning a Honda sedan, when we have Holden, Ford, Mazda, Nissan, Suzuki, Mitsubishi & Nissan all available in town. Anyone who can't find a shopping trolley from that lot deserves to spend 4 or 6 hours driving in lousy traffic, just to get the thing serviced.
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