What car for three children?
Discussion
And so, it has come to pass, PB Jr No3 is on their way. On its own, its great news, but it has seriously dented my search for an entertaining car to carry around the other two. I now need an entertaining car that can fit three child seats (two boosters and an infant capsule) and two adults. If I ask in the GG section, I'll get lots of suggestions of things we can't get here, like an S-Max or similar.
So, what do I want? Well, lets start with what I don't - CX9, Territory, Kluger, Tribeca are off - too big, auto only and, well, where's the fun? Mrs PB can't stand any of them either. So, on the current list is a Gen 4 Liberty wagon 3.0RB or GT, 2008-onwards Forester, Mazda6 wagon, and, er, that's it. What else is out there??? I'd like to think a V8 Commodore wagon would be good, but I've never enjoyed the V6s I've driven. A V8 Falcon would be fun, but that's sedan only and I need a wagon. Budget is around $20k.
In the meantime, if anyone fancies a low-kms, one-owner, 2007 Forester X with full Subaru service history, drop me a note. Would love to keep it, but its now too small...
So, what do I want? Well, lets start with what I don't - CX9, Territory, Kluger, Tribeca are off - too big, auto only and, well, where's the fun? Mrs PB can't stand any of them either. So, on the current list is a Gen 4 Liberty wagon 3.0RB or GT, 2008-onwards Forester, Mazda6 wagon, and, er, that's it. What else is out there??? I'd like to think a V8 Commodore wagon would be good, but I've never enjoyed the V6s I've driven. A V8 Falcon would be fun, but that's sedan only and I need a wagon. Budget is around $20k.
In the meantime, if anyone fancies a low-kms, one-owner, 2007 Forester X with full Subaru service history, drop me a note. Would love to keep it, but its now too small...
Have tried the new Territory and it just seemed like too much car. Most of the time it'll be me or Mrs PB with either two or three kids. We'll have a second car, so its only occasionally going to carry all five of us.
Might see if I can find a 530 wagon to have a look round though - I know over here they're auto only, which is not a selling point for me, but should be an entertaining drive. Good shout.
As for the Commodore, in ten years I've not driven one that I enjoyed. I've also got memories of following a VE V8 down McCarrs Creek Road in my MX5 and watching it slew around as the driver struggled to keep it on the narrow road, whilst I just sat back a safe distance. He was trying, could tell by the way he blasted away on the short straights, but it didn't look enjoyable. They make perfect sense on paper, I just can't get on with them.
Might see if I can find a 530 wagon to have a look round though - I know over here they're auto only, which is not a selling point for me, but should be an entertaining drive. Good shout.
As for the Commodore, in ten years I've not driven one that I enjoyed. I've also got memories of following a VE V8 down McCarrs Creek Road in my MX5 and watching it slew around as the driver struggled to keep it on the narrow road, whilst I just sat back a safe distance. He was trying, could tell by the way he blasted away on the short straights, but it didn't look enjoyable. They make perfect sense on paper, I just can't get on with them.
I spent quite a bit of time driving company Commodores. I found them remarkably good cars, much better than I had expected. With some minor stiffening of springs & shocks in the back, the better to tow a horse float, they were damn good.
I drove quite a few European things, of high repute, & could not imagine why people would pay a huge premium for cars which were very little better, & often much worse on the road. More show than go quite often.
I find personally the speed that most cars produce around a corner has more to do with the loose nut behind the steering wheel, than the car. In fact I have found the majority of drivers of up market European cars were of limited ability, & few could stay anywhere near a well driven commodore.
It is possible you are selling yourself short, if you were pushing one into trouble. Do try the V8, they are better, even if there is no logical reason for that.
I drove quite a few European things, of high repute, & could not imagine why people would pay a huge premium for cars which were very little better, & often much worse on the road. More show than go quite often.
I find personally the speed that most cars produce around a corner has more to do with the loose nut behind the steering wheel, than the car. In fact I have found the majority of drivers of up market European cars were of limited ability, & few could stay anywhere near a well driven commodore.
It is possible you are selling yourself short, if you were pushing one into trouble. Do try the V8, they are better, even if there is no logical reason for that.
Check the rear seat width.
Commodores will easily take a child seat/booster in the middle and 2 adults either side (been there, done it), so 3 child seats should be okay. Maybe worth going to a dealer and trying it though.
Not sure how wide something like a Mazda 6 is inside - they are roughly 60mm narrower than a Commodore externally.
Commodores will easily take a child seat/booster in the middle and 2 adults either side (been there, done it), so 3 child seats should be okay. Maybe worth going to a dealer and trying it though.
Not sure how wide something like a Mazda 6 is inside - they are roughly 60mm narrower than a Commodore externally.
As for fuel consumption:
I've run VE Commodore wagons for years - my commute is 57km each way, freeway with stop/start at the Melbourne end (Citylink) but I don't actually go in to the city. Fugures are over roughly 8000km on 91 RON.
3 V6 ATs have averaged 9.7.
3 V8 ATs have averaged 10.8
1 V8 MT has averaged 10.9 (but it was not fun in the stop/start traffic)
My VF V8 AT has so far averaged 10.9 from its first tank.
Show either a 6 or an 8 stop/start city/ town stuff and you are looking at mid-teens. Probably no worse than an SUV though.
I've run VE Commodore wagons for years - my commute is 57km each way, freeway with stop/start at the Melbourne end (Citylink) but I don't actually go in to the city. Fugures are over roughly 8000km on 91 RON.
3 V6 ATs have averaged 9.7.
3 V8 ATs have averaged 10.8
1 V8 MT has averaged 10.9 (but it was not fun in the stop/start traffic)
My VF V8 AT has so far averaged 10.9 from its first tank.
Show either a 6 or an 8 stop/start city/ town stuff and you are looking at mid-teens. Probably no worse than an SUV though.
Fuel consumption is more a personal thing. Figures from one driver in different cars are useful, but introduce different drivers, & it is meaningless.
We bought 2 new commodores, one a wagon, one a sedan. I had the wagon, my purchasing manager the sedan. However due to the nature of his work, he needed the wagon for longish periods, on occasions.
Our fuel account gave us a report each month, including furl consumption. It was interesting that which ever car I was driving gave about 12L/100Km, or a little more. The one my sedate purchasing officer drove would give better than 9L/100Km.
If anything my usage should have returned similar or better mileage than his. This was irrefutable evidence that the lead foot disease does cost money, worth it of course, but costly.
Depends what V8 wagon you get? Get a Omega and its not going to be engaging to drive...an SS maybe more so...the sedan is good and about the right price.
You said no to CX-9...would a CX-7 be too small? They do a nifty 2.5litre turbo version don't they? Supposed to be quite quick?
Subaru Liberty is a good shout. Forester turbo?
You said no to CX-9...would a CX-7 be too small? They do a nifty 2.5litre turbo version don't they? Supposed to be quite quick?
Subaru Liberty is a good shout. Forester turbo?
Hasbeen said:
Fuel consumption is more a personal thing. Figures from one driver in different cars are useful, but introduce different drivers, & it is meaningless.
We bought 2 new commodores, one a wagon, one a sedan. I had the wagon, my purchasing manager the sedan. However due to the nature of his work, he needed the wagon for longish periods, on occasions.
Our fuel account gave us a report each month, including furl consumption. It was interesting that which ever car I was driving gave about 12L/100Km, or a little more. The one my sedate purchasing officer drove would give better than 9L/100Km.
If anything my usage should have returned similar or better mileage than his. This was irrefutable evidence that the lead foot disease does cost money, worth it of course, but costly.
Agree 100% which is why I mentioned what sort of commute I do. Just thought any comparison between V6 and V8 would be of use. Worth noting that the 8s I've run do considerably better than the combined figure whereas the 6s are a lot closer.We bought 2 new commodores, one a wagon, one a sedan. I had the wagon, my purchasing manager the sedan. However due to the nature of his work, he needed the wagon for longish periods, on occasions.
Our fuel account gave us a report each month, including furl consumption. It was interesting that which ever car I was driving gave about 12L/100Km, or a little more. The one my sedate purchasing officer drove would give better than 9L/100Km.
If anything my usage should have returned similar or better mileage than his. This was irrefutable evidence that the lead foot disease does cost money, worth it of course, but costly.
PomBstard said:
And so, it has come to pass, PB Jr No3 is on their way. On its own, its great news, but it has seriously dented my search for an entertaining car to carry around the other two. I now need an entertaining car that can fit three child seats (two boosters and an infant capsule) and two adults. If I ask in the GG section, I'll get lots of suggestions of things we can't get here, like an S-Max or similar.
So, what do I want? Well, lets start with what I don't - CX9, Territory, Kluger, Tribeca are off - too big, auto only and, well, where's the fun? Mrs PB can't stand any of them either. So, on the current list is a Gen 4 Liberty wagon 3.0RB or GT, 2008-onwards Forester, Mazda6 wagon, and, er, that's it. What else is out there??? I'd like to think a V8 Commodore wagon would be good, but I've never enjoyed the V6s I've driven. A V8 Falcon would be fun, but that's sedan only and I need a wagon. Budget is around $20k.
In the meantime, if anyone fancies a low-kms, one-owner, 2007 Forester X with full Subaru service history, drop me a note. Would love to keep it, but its now too small...
Congratulations!So, what do I want? Well, lets start with what I don't - CX9, Territory, Kluger, Tribeca are off - too big, auto only and, well, where's the fun? Mrs PB can't stand any of them either. So, on the current list is a Gen 4 Liberty wagon 3.0RB or GT, 2008-onwards Forester, Mazda6 wagon, and, er, that's it. What else is out there??? I'd like to think a V8 Commodore wagon would be good, but I've never enjoyed the V6s I've driven. A V8 Falcon would be fun, but that's sedan only and I need a wagon. Budget is around $20k.
In the meantime, if anyone fancies a low-kms, one-owner, 2007 Forester X with full Subaru service history, drop me a note. Would love to keep it, but its now too small...
Question - if you have a 07 Forester now and its too small isnt the Liberty, new Forester or Mazda 6 going to be also too small?
For $20k if you need a wagon could you get a Passat?A6 Allroad (too old?). My vote would be Liberty by the way from that lot.
Pommygranite said:
Congratulations!
Question - if you have a 07 Forester now and its too small isnt the Liberty, new Forester or Mazda 6 going to be also too small?
For $20k if you need a wagon could you get a Passat?A6 Allroad (too old?). My vote would be Liberty by the way from that lot.
Thanks! Question - if you have a 07 Forester now and its too small isnt the Liberty, new Forester or Mazda 6 going to be also too small?
For $20k if you need a wagon could you get a Passat?A6 Allroad (too old?). My vote would be Liberty by the way from that lot.
The 07 Forester is a bit narrower than the S3 that replaced it. I can get three seats across but can't get to the buckles and a bit of extra width would be nice. Said the actress... Liberty is also a bit wider across the seat, if awkwardly shaped, and the new Libertys are wider again, so its the front runner for me. I'm already a Subaru fan, so its not a hard decision, but I wanted to see if there was anything else worth considering.
VW/Audi wagon stuff is all auto, as it the BMW previously suggested, otherwise they'd be on the shopping list too. Just don't like autos, and neither does Mrs PB.
Have now tried a V8 Commodore and (a) it felt a bit one-trick - lovely in a straight line, so I understand that bit, but really felt the mass through corners, and (b) Mrs PB hated it. Build quality also feels a bit behind the Japanese.
The only other choice that might appeal could be a manual Volvo 850R wagon, in yellow, with anthracite wheels, and I know a man on the Northern Beaches with a E34 M5 wagon...
TAS1981 said:
You said no to CX-9...would a CX-7 be too small? They do a nifty 2.5litre turbo version don't they? Supposed to be quite quick?
Subaru Liberty is a good shout. Forester turbo?
CX7 would be about the right size, but auto only. And, having just checked out the inside of a new Forester and confirmed two boosters and a capsule do indeed fit nicely, the idea of a bit of flat-four turbo goodness has surfaced. I reckon with a bit of man maths, I can get a Liberty wagon and a Forester XT. Not for $20k, granted, but there are ways...Subaru Liberty is a good shout. Forester turbo?
i had another post, saying that im in the same position as you. nothing available that is remotely interesting to drive, nothing with a manual. not convinced a first gen DSG anything is going to be reliable in the long run. trying to find something the princess and i can fit in is imposible. everything looks like a knited cardigin.
i looked at this last week.
in good knick, full service history, auto though
http://www.carsales.com.au/dealer/details/Audi-S4-...
in good knick, full service history, auto though
http://www.carsales.com.au/dealer/details/Audi-S4-...
WeirdNeville said:
Any love for Volvos?
Reckon so...PomBstard said:
...manual 850R in yellow with anthracite wheels...
As for the A4 - about the same size as a Gen4 Liberty inside but $ for $ I think you get less. My budget looks at a 2001'ish S4 2.7TT which will be a bit quicker than a Lib GT or R-B. Insurance is definitely higher, and I'll put money on parts being a bit pricier, being European and prestige and all that.Having said that, if I had the money, that RS2 would be on the drive and the kids in the boot.
In my time over here I've come to value the reliability, parts availability and pretty good build quality of Japanese cars, and Subaru seem to be some of the better ones, along with Toyota, Mazda and Honda. The fact that most Subarus can be had with manual boxes in a country that loves autos is also part of their appeal.
Which means that if you want a car with a fair sized boot or wagon, decent turn of pace, that can fit two boosters and an infant capsule across the back and comes with a manual box, then there are few choices. In fact, much as I have looked, and I really have, the list is (08-on) Forester XT, Liberty GT/R-B, Commodore SS, V70R/850R, S4/RS4, 9-5 Aero. I haven't yet found another mid- or large-sized wagon that fits the bill.
You can order the current 3 series with a manual as a no cost option according to the email I got from the rep the other day
As for size, I'm 6'5" and can get in the back of a b7a4 avant. Not roomy, but kids would be fine. Biggest problem is the length of a rear facing capsule. Was a stretch in a mazda 2. We had the front passenger seat well forward for the first 12 months. Width would be more of an issue I would think
My partner and I have been looking at a few over the last couple of weeks. Couldn't get many where the steering column would get out of the way of her knees as she is 5'4". The seat doesent go forward enough in the ve commodore for her but she fits ok in the vf. Only problem is that the vf only comes in an auto unless you buy a hsv version.
I can't think of anything else to add to your list, though I haven't looked into the 300c Chrysler yet.
Good luck
Ryan
As for size, I'm 6'5" and can get in the back of a b7a4 avant. Not roomy, but kids would be fine. Biggest problem is the length of a rear facing capsule. Was a stretch in a mazda 2. We had the front passenger seat well forward for the first 12 months. Width would be more of an issue I would think
My partner and I have been looking at a few over the last couple of weeks. Couldn't get many where the steering column would get out of the way of her knees as she is 5'4". The seat doesent go forward enough in the ve commodore for her but she fits ok in the vf. Only problem is that the vf only comes in an auto unless you buy a hsv version.
I can't think of anything else to add to your list, though I haven't looked into the 300c Chrysler yet.
Good luck
Ryan
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