touch up painting - clear on base
Discussion
Caught the painted bumper of my toy on the frame for the garage door. The metal frame was vertical to the bumper so it removed paint rather than dented the bumper. So I bought 3 aerosols ( undercaot in white, base in dark metallic blue, and lacquer) from a specialist company to the manufacturers paint code - the car maker doesn to touch up paints and it too specialist for the likes of Halfords.
Though I say it myself I'm not bad with aerosols and the end finish is excellent and glossy. Trouble is that the colour is a shade dark. Now before I phone the paint supplier I want to check whether I made a mistake, this being my first time with two pack.
Because of the nature of the damage I had to overlap so significant areas did not get the white primer and most areas got generous coats of base colour. Will that have made the result too dark?
Though I say it myself I'm not bad with aerosols and the end finish is excellent and glossy. Trouble is that the colour is a shade dark. Now before I phone the paint supplier I want to check whether I made a mistake, this being my first time with two pack.
Because of the nature of the damage I had to overlap so significant areas did not get the white primer and most areas got generous coats of base colour. Will that have made the result too dark?
Spectrometer scanners aren't foolproof,they only compare to a database.The alternative is matching with colour chips.
I'm shocked though that you're painting a Ferrari with rattle cans.
Incidentally unless you're using a clear aerosol with a button underneath it won't be 2k and 1k clear is dreadful stuff, highly likely your high gloss finish will disappear in a couple of months.
I'm shocked though that you're painting a Ferrari with rattle cans.
Incidentally unless you're using a clear aerosol with a button underneath it won't be 2k and 1k clear is dreadful stuff, highly likely your high gloss finish will disappear in a couple of months.
^^^^That.
If you want to get as close as possible then your best option would be to have the paint eyematched to the car by a motor factor with a good mixer (mixologist?). They would need a piece of the car.
That said, I have had the odd colour where even that hasn't given a close match.
Whether they can do it in an aerosol I don't know & you would need to ask them. The factor I use the minimum quantity is 1/2 a litre & spraygun applied.
If you want to get as close as possible then your best option would be to have the paint eyematched to the car by a motor factor with a good mixer (mixologist?). They would need a piece of the car.
That said, I have had the odd colour where even that hasn't given a close match.
Whether they can do it in an aerosol I don't know & you would need to ask them. The factor I use the minimum quantity is 1/2 a litre & spraygun applied.
Edited by paintman on Monday 26th June 13:13
Had no issues using a rattlecan on the previous Ferrari but that was Rosso Corsa. The colour match was really good - you couldnt see the fade from repainted to original part way down the GRP bumper the 430 had. This is a similar sort of scrape and again there is no feel for the join but the colour difference is marked.
I thought that some scanners analysed the colour and gave a mix of base colours to match rather than just saying " the nearest is Nissan xxxx".
Dont see whats special about paining a Ferrari. From sanding down the bumper area concerned its clear that my touch up wasnt the first though it is clear that the bulk of the car is original.
I thought that some scanners analysed the colour and gave a mix of base colours to match rather than just saying " the nearest is Nissan xxxx".
Dont see whats special about paining a Ferrari. From sanding down the bumper area concerned its clear that my touch up wasnt the first though it is clear that the bulk of the car is original.
It's just another box on wheels.
As has been said, it's very common for there to be a number of different shades of paint for any given colour name/colour code depending on which batch of paint was in use at the factory at the time the car was built & painted.
The colour will have the same name & code but that takes no account of the different batch shades & it then needs the matching as already described.
Even something as simple as a plain white. I stopped doing cars & vans at the start of the pandemic but for Ford Frozen White (Transit vans etc)I had colour chips for about 5 different shades & formulations for at least 20.
Ford Panther Black & VW Black Magic both had well in excess of 50 different formulations in both paint systems I used.
Even more problems if the car has had previous repairs as you've no idea which one was used & I've had vehicles where one side was different to the other.
The spectrowotsits are usually quite good, but they don't always get the exact match.
That's the realm of the specialist eyematcher but even then it doesn't always work even spraying out test cards & you won't know for certain until the paint is actually on the job.
As has been said, it's very common for there to be a number of different shades of paint for any given colour name/colour code depending on which batch of paint was in use at the factory at the time the car was built & painted.
The colour will have the same name & code but that takes no account of the different batch shades & it then needs the matching as already described.
Even something as simple as a plain white. I stopped doing cars & vans at the start of the pandemic but for Ford Frozen White (Transit vans etc)I had colour chips for about 5 different shades & formulations for at least 20.
Ford Panther Black & VW Black Magic both had well in excess of 50 different formulations in both paint systems I used.
Even more problems if the car has had previous repairs as you've no idea which one was used & I've had vehicles where one side was different to the other.
The spectrowotsits are usually quite good, but they don't always get the exact match.
That's the realm of the specialist eyematcher but even then it doesn't always work even spraying out test cards & you won't know for certain until the paint is actually on the job.
Edited by paintman on Tuesday 4th July 10:08
Interesting. I did check with the specialist refinishing company ( recommended on here) whether there were any variants and there werent. I suspect my darker colour comes because I ended up with multiple base coats rether than just a couple on the white primer. It was a matter of how I handled the joint ( I had 3 sharp panel edges and one mid flat surface join) and I couldnt see how to get the primer and base coat ending at the same spot. So I applies base past the end of the primer and onto the top of the old base.
Anyway, its fun to try and I can always take it to a pro if I fail.
Any recommendations?
Anyway, its fun to try and I can always take it to a pro if I fail.
Any recommendations?
Possibly the paint system they use doesn't show any, but another system might.
As you say though heavy application can also be responsible.
As can an unsuitably coloured primer, esp on low hiding colours such as reds.
Primer needs to cover just beyond the filled/sanded area of the base material (metal, plastic etc).
Once sanded smooth & the edges feathered the colour coats go beyond that & onto the original painted & clearcoated surface.
Don't mask on a flat surface & colour coat to the masking. The new paint needs to be faded out as you go onto the original surface or you'll never get a satisfactory blend, just a sharp highly visible edge where the new finishes.
If the panel has a swage line in it you can often take the colour to the line & it will work due to the angle change.
Finishing the new colour coats at the edge of a panel generally highlights a difference in shade between that & the adjacent panel & that's why it's usually best to blend onto the adjacent panel. Pale metallics can be a PITA.
The new clearcoat then goes beyond that onto the old clearcoat. Again, don't hard mask as you will finish up with a ridge. Backtaping might work.
Unfortunately with some colours you may get a thin dull line where the new clear finishes & the only way to avoid it is to take the clear to the edge of the panel.
ETA Put your location if you want recommendations.
As you say though heavy application can also be responsible.
As can an unsuitably coloured primer, esp on low hiding colours such as reds.
Primer needs to cover just beyond the filled/sanded area of the base material (metal, plastic etc).
Once sanded smooth & the edges feathered the colour coats go beyond that & onto the original painted & clearcoated surface.
Don't mask on a flat surface & colour coat to the masking. The new paint needs to be faded out as you go onto the original surface or you'll never get a satisfactory blend, just a sharp highly visible edge where the new finishes.
If the panel has a swage line in it you can often take the colour to the line & it will work due to the angle change.
Finishing the new colour coats at the edge of a panel generally highlights a difference in shade between that & the adjacent panel & that's why it's usually best to blend onto the adjacent panel. Pale metallics can be a PITA.
The new clearcoat then goes beyond that onto the old clearcoat. Again, don't hard mask as you will finish up with a ridge. Backtaping might work.
Unfortunately with some colours you may get a thin dull line where the new clear finishes & the only way to avoid it is to take the clear to the edge of the panel.
ETA Put your location if you want recommendations.
Edited by paintman on Tuesday 4th July 12:58
I am OK with swage lines. My problem is that unless I do the whole bumper I am going to have to blend new into old on a flattish surface. Now if I understand what you are saying, I prime from the area I am painting to just overlap the old paint. In this case do I flat the gloss on the edge of the old paint? Do I flat the edge of the join to get smooth at this stage?
When I have done that I apply the base going from 2 coats on the primed area to a mist over the edge of the old paint. Again gentle flatting to avoid a phsical edge.
Then clear coat.
Is this broadly correct?
My location is SE Wales near Chepstow.
When I have done that I apply the base going from 2 coats on the primed area to a mist over the edge of the old paint. Again gentle flatting to avoid a phsical edge.
Then clear coat.
Is this broadly correct?
My location is SE Wales near Chepstow.
Any area that is to receive anything incl base & clearcoats needs to be at the very least scuffed - scotchpad - to give a uniform dull appearance. If you don't then the new paint won't have anything to grip onto & is likely to peel off.
Do this at the start before you do any painting & you won't need to do it again, better to go further than to try & keep it too confined.
Sand primer smooth feathering primer edge onto the surface - which might be the old colour coat or the old clear.
Basecoat as required to achieve uniform coverage blending out onto the old surface - which is going to be the old clear. Don't get hung up
about 2 coats, that may not be sufficient to cover up the primer.
Only sand the basecoat if you need to sand any lumps or nibs out. You will then need to apply more basecoat as required to achieve uniform coverage.
Apply clearcoat as detailed on the product's TDS. How & number of coats can vary from paint maker to paint maker. This will go beyond the new basecoat & out onto the old clear.
Do this at the start before you do any painting & you won't need to do it again, better to go further than to try & keep it too confined.
Sand primer smooth feathering primer edge onto the surface - which might be the old colour coat or the old clear.
Basecoat as required to achieve uniform coverage blending out onto the old surface - which is going to be the old clear. Don't get hung up
about 2 coats, that may not be sufficient to cover up the primer.
Only sand the basecoat if you need to sand any lumps or nibs out. You will then need to apply more basecoat as required to achieve uniform coverage.
Apply clearcoat as detailed on the product's TDS. How & number of coats can vary from paint maker to paint maker. This will go beyond the new basecoat & out onto the old clear.
Edited by paintman on Tuesday 11th July 18:02
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