What tyres would suit my preferences - coming from Mich PS2
Discussion
Hey folks,
I appreciate that tyres have been done to death, both here and across the ‘net in general. Being not long due for some replacements, I’ve spent hours reading and watching reviews but many are on track and what I’m most interested in as on-road subjectivity. I therefore didn’t think it’d hurt to see what the wisdom of PH thought.
I don’t do many miles; it’s something of a second car so I don’t want to get this wrong. I’m currently running Michelin Pilot Sport 2’s which I really like and seem to suit the car (BMW 130i). Prior to doing any research, I sort of assumed I would just go down the Michelin PS4 route but the more I read, the more I think they may be a bit too comfort orientated and may disappoint (note, I’m talking PS4 not PS4S). Seems the natural successor to PS2 was Pilot Super Sport (at which point PS3 became more comfort based) but I’ve heard they’re not so much fun in cold damp conditions and the Pilot Sport 4S starts at 19s I believe (I run 225/40/18 square set up).
I think where I am is that I’m trying to replicate as closely as possible the characteristics of the PS2. I like the direct, positive turn in, with a firm sidewall but with strong grip and traction in wet and dry conditions. I particularly don’t like feeling any undue ‘squidge’ which I’ve experienced before where the tyre wasn’t firm / focused enough. I believe you can still get them as they’re OE / N rated on some Porsches, but they’re a 20 year old design and unnecessarily expensive given the above mentioned N rating.
I’m currently thing that Goodyear Eagle f1 Supersports might be the answer but give me an hour and I’ll have read another review and I’ll have changed my mind again.
So, I guess what I’m asking is, does anyone have past experience of running PS2s and what did you progress on to? Does anyone have a 130i or similar and what do you use?
I appreciate that tyres have been done to death, both here and across the ‘net in general. Being not long due for some replacements, I’ve spent hours reading and watching reviews but many are on track and what I’m most interested in as on-road subjectivity. I therefore didn’t think it’d hurt to see what the wisdom of PH thought.
I don’t do many miles; it’s something of a second car so I don’t want to get this wrong. I’m currently running Michelin Pilot Sport 2’s which I really like and seem to suit the car (BMW 130i). Prior to doing any research, I sort of assumed I would just go down the Michelin PS4 route but the more I read, the more I think they may be a bit too comfort orientated and may disappoint (note, I’m talking PS4 not PS4S). Seems the natural successor to PS2 was Pilot Super Sport (at which point PS3 became more comfort based) but I’ve heard they’re not so much fun in cold damp conditions and the Pilot Sport 4S starts at 19s I believe (I run 225/40/18 square set up).
I think where I am is that I’m trying to replicate as closely as possible the characteristics of the PS2. I like the direct, positive turn in, with a firm sidewall but with strong grip and traction in wet and dry conditions. I particularly don’t like feeling any undue ‘squidge’ which I’ve experienced before where the tyre wasn’t firm / focused enough. I believe you can still get them as they’re OE / N rated on some Porsches, but they’re a 20 year old design and unnecessarily expensive given the above mentioned N rating.
I’m currently thing that Goodyear Eagle f1 Supersports might be the answer but give me an hour and I’ll have read another review and I’ll have changed my mind again.
So, I guess what I’m asking is, does anyone have past experience of running PS2s and what did you progress on to? Does anyone have a 130i or similar and what do you use?
First of all I have not used PS2's so I can't comment on them or how they compare.
I ran my M135i on MPSS, great tyres, drove the car in sun, rain, snow and ice. So long as you understand and respect you won't get warm summers day levels of grip in adverse conditions you will be fine, they also benefit from a few miles to get some heat into them. Drove Leeds to Manchester on the M621 in the snow a few years ago without any real drama, just drove with light feet. They lasted well 20,000+ miles a set front and rear.
My C63S runs MPS4S's again great tyres, drive the car in sun, rain, snow and ice. To be honest they are just as good as the MPSS and I would struggle to tell the difference. The C63S corners faster, turns harder accelerates faster but it cost 3x the price of the M135i with far wider tyres so that's kind of expected. It's truly rubbish at standing water but that might be the 265 front & 295 rear tyres more than the car. The C63S eats a set of MPS4S's in about 10,000 miles.
The M135i forums rated the MPS4S as better than the MPSS especially in wet weather but they are not available in all sizes so you need to check your wheel sizes.
I did have a go in a C63S which had cup2's on and they were awesome for grip on the warm summers day I drove on but looking at the tread pattern they are dry weather tyres only.
I ran my M135i on MPSS, great tyres, drove the car in sun, rain, snow and ice. So long as you understand and respect you won't get warm summers day levels of grip in adverse conditions you will be fine, they also benefit from a few miles to get some heat into them. Drove Leeds to Manchester on the M621 in the snow a few years ago without any real drama, just drove with light feet. They lasted well 20,000+ miles a set front and rear.
My C63S runs MPS4S's again great tyres, drive the car in sun, rain, snow and ice. To be honest they are just as good as the MPSS and I would struggle to tell the difference. The C63S corners faster, turns harder accelerates faster but it cost 3x the price of the M135i with far wider tyres so that's kind of expected. It's truly rubbish at standing water but that might be the 265 front & 295 rear tyres more than the car. The C63S eats a set of MPS4S's in about 10,000 miles.
The M135i forums rated the MPS4S as better than the MPSS especially in wet weather but they are not available in all sizes so you need to check your wheel sizes.
I did have a go in a C63S which had cup2's on and they were awesome for grip on the warm summers day I drove on but looking at the tread pattern they are dry weather tyres only.
LeeM135i said:
First of all I have not used PS2's so I can't comment on them or how they compare.
I ran my M135i on MPSS, great tyres, drove the car in sun, rain, snow and ice. So long as you understand and respect you won't get warm summers day levels of grip in adverse conditions you will be fine, they also benefit from a few miles to get some heat into them. Drove Leeds to Manchester on the M621 in the snow a few years ago without any real drama, just drove with light feet. They lasted well 20,000+ miles a set front and rear.
My C63S runs MPS4S's again great tyres, drive the car in sun, rain, snow and ice. To be honest they are just as good as the MPSS and I would struggle to tell the difference. The C63S corners faster, turns harder accelerates faster but it cost 3x the price of the M135i with far wider tyres so that's kind of expected. It's truly rubbish at standing water but that might be the 265 front & 295 rear tyres more than the car. The C63S eats a set of MPS4S's in about 10,000 miles.
The M135i forums rated the MPS4S as better than the MPSS especially in wet weather but they are not available in all sizes so you need to check your wheel sizes.
I did have a go in a C63S which had cup2's on and they were awesome for grip on the warm summers day I drove on but looking at the tread pattern they are dry weather tyres only.
Thanks for the reply. I think MPS4S would be ideal but I don’t believe they were ever produced in wheel sizes less than 19, or if they did they seem to be extremely difficult to find and, perhaps, a little too strongly priced. Interesting that you found the MPSS ok in the wet, so maybe I shouldn’t be too quick to discount. Think they were OE on the m135i weren’t they?I ran my M135i on MPSS, great tyres, drove the car in sun, rain, snow and ice. So long as you understand and respect you won't get warm summers day levels of grip in adverse conditions you will be fine, they also benefit from a few miles to get some heat into them. Drove Leeds to Manchester on the M621 in the snow a few years ago without any real drama, just drove with light feet. They lasted well 20,000+ miles a set front and rear.
My C63S runs MPS4S's again great tyres, drive the car in sun, rain, snow and ice. To be honest they are just as good as the MPSS and I would struggle to tell the difference. The C63S corners faster, turns harder accelerates faster but it cost 3x the price of the M135i with far wider tyres so that's kind of expected. It's truly rubbish at standing water but that might be the 265 front & 295 rear tyres more than the car. The C63S eats a set of MPS4S's in about 10,000 miles.
The M135i forums rated the MPS4S as better than the MPSS especially in wet weather but they are not available in all sizes so you need to check your wheel sizes.
I did have a go in a C63S which had cup2's on and they were awesome for grip on the warm summers day I drove on but looking at the tread pattern they are dry weather tyres only.
Heathwood said:
... and the Pilot Sport 4S starts at 19s I believe (I run 225/40/18 square set up).
Isn't this what you want? https://www.mytyres.co.uk/rshop/tyre/Michelin/Pilo... (I know it's out of stock, but presumably it exists if they have it on the site!)ETA: Camskill claim to have it in stock: https://www.camskill.co.uk/m61b5275s134p201566/Mic...
PS4 are the replacements for PS2.
I have gone from PS2 on my 911 to PS4 and the tyres are better in every way, they grip better and wear better. The ride is slightly better (I think) but the PS4 are certainly not comfort oriented.
Jon of tyre reviews did a test of PS4 against PS4S and another tyre. The difference in lap time between the PS4 and the PS4S was marginal.
I have gone from PS2 on my 911 to PS4 and the tyres are better in every way, they grip better and wear better. The ride is slightly better (I think) but the PS4 are certainly not comfort oriented.
Jon of tyre reviews did a test of PS4 against PS4S and another tyre. The difference in lap time between the PS4 and the PS4S was marginal.
Scrump said:
PS4 are the replacements for PS2.
I have gone from PS2 on my 911 to PS4 and the tyres are better in every way, they grip better and wear better. The ride is slightly better (I think) but the PS4 are certainly not comfort oriented.
Jon of tyre reviews did a test of PS4 against PS4S and another tyre. The difference in lap time between the PS4 and the PS4S was marginal.
Thanks for the response. I have gone from PS2 on my 911 to PS4 and the tyres are better in every way, they grip better and wear better. The ride is slightly better (I think) but the PS4 are certainly not comfort oriented.
Jon of tyre reviews did a test of PS4 against PS4S and another tyre. The difference in lap time between the PS4 and the PS4S was marginal.
As I understand it, Pilot Supersport was the replacement for the PS2, which itself was superseded by the PS4S.
PS4 are more comfort orientated, as is the newer PS5. I’m not saying they’re a touring tyre and I know lap times and grip are excellent; it’s just those reviews that say initial turn in is a little soft and gummy. I’m not discounting the PS4 to be honest, so would be interested as to whether you noticed any difference in turn in between PS2 and PS4.
kambites said:
Heathwood said:
... and the Pilot Sport 4S starts at 19s I believe (I run 225/40/18 square set up).
Isn't this what you want? https://www.mytyres.co.uk/rshop/tyre/Michelin/Pilo... (I know it's out of stock, but presumably it exists if they have it on the site!)ETA: Camskill claim to have it in stock: https://www.camskill.co.uk/m61b5275s134p201566/Mic...
Once upon time they didn't go below 19".If you can't find the size you need I'd get Goodyear Eagle F1 Supersport as an alternative to PS4S. I've run a set of them as well. Very similar feel and performance, probably wear a bit quicker (might just have been my commute at the time).
kambites said:
Heathwood said:
... and the Pilot Sport 4S starts at 19s I believe (I run 225/40/18 square set up).
Isn't this what you want? https://www.mytyres.co.uk/rshop/tyre/Michelin/Pilo... (I know it's out of stock, but presumably it exists if they have it on the site!)ETA: Camskill claim to have it in stock: https://www.camskill.co.uk/m61b5275s134p201566/Mic...
Zarco said:
kambites said:
Heathwood said:
... and the Pilot Sport 4S starts at 19s I believe (I run 225/40/18 square set up).
Isn't this what you want? https://www.mytyres.co.uk/rshop/tyre/Michelin/Pilo... (I know it's out of stock, but presumably it exists if they have it on the site!)ETA: Camskill claim to have it in stock: https://www.camskill.co.uk/m61b5275s134p201566/Mic...
Once upon time they didn't go below 19".If you can't find the size you need I'd get Goodyear Eagle F1 Supersport as an alternative to PS4S. I've run a set of them as well. Very similar feel and performance, probably wear a bit quicker (might just have been my commute at the time).
Heathwood said:
Interesting, thank you. Those prices mind! Although given the PS2 have been on for about 6 years, I suppose the cost difference is relatively insignificant over that timeframe.
Sadly, good tyres are rarely cheap! I doubt the Eagle Super Sport is much cheaper? ETA: OK having looked, the Eagle F1 SS is quite a lot cheaper!
Here's a comparison (albeit not a hugely in-depth one) of the Goodyear vs the Michelin: https://www.tyrereviews.com/Article/Michelin-Pilot...
Edited by kambites on Tuesday 3rd January 19:31
Heathwood said:
Zarco said:
kambites said:
Heathwood said:
... and the Pilot Sport 4S starts at 19s I believe (I run 225/40/18 square set up).
Isn't this what you want? https://www.mytyres.co.uk/rshop/tyre/Michelin/Pilo... (I know it's out of stock, but presumably it exists if they have it on the site!)ETA: Camskill claim to have it in stock: https://www.camskill.co.uk/m61b5275s134p201566/Mic...
Once upon time they didn't go below 19".If you can't find the size you need I'd get Goodyear Eagle F1 Supersport as an alternative to PS4S. I've run a set of them as well. Very similar feel and performance, probably wear a bit quicker (might just have been my commute at the time).
Heathwood said:
Thanks for the response.
As I understand it, Pilot Supersport was the replacement for the PS2, which itself was superseded by the PS4S.
PS4 are more comfort orientated, as is the newer PS5. I’m not saying they’re a touring tyre and I know lap times and grip are excellent; it’s just those reviews that say initial turn in is a little soft and gummy. I’m not discounting the PS4 to be honest, so would be interested as to whether you noticed any difference in turn in between PS2 and PS4.
I don’t think PSS were the replacements for PS2. At the time there was PS2 and PSS available, tje PSS was replaced by PS4S and the PS2 by PS4. I don’t find the turn in on PS4 any softer than PS2, I would say if it was any different then the PS2 was softer.As I understand it, Pilot Supersport was the replacement for the PS2, which itself was superseded by the PS4S.
PS4 are more comfort orientated, as is the newer PS5. I’m not saying they’re a touring tyre and I know lap times and grip are excellent; it’s just those reviews that say initial turn in is a little soft and gummy. I’m not discounting the PS4 to be honest, so would be interested as to whether you noticed any difference in turn in between PS2 and PS4.
Heathwood said:
LeeM135i said:
First of all I have not used PS2's so I can't comment on them or how they compare.
I ran my M135i on MPSS, great tyres, drove the car in sun, rain, snow and ice. So long as you understand and respect you won't get warm summers day levels of grip in adverse conditions you will be fine, they also benefit from a few miles to get some heat into them. Drove Leeds to Manchester on the M621 in the snow a few years ago without any real drama, just drove with light feet. They lasted well 20,000+ miles a set front and rear.
My C63S runs MPS4S's again great tyres, drive the car in sun, rain, snow and ice. To be honest they are just as good as the MPSS and I would struggle to tell the difference. The C63S corners faster, turns harder accelerates faster but it cost 3x the price of the M135i with far wider tyres so that's kind of expected. It's truly rubbish at standing water but that might be the 265 front & 295 rear tyres more than the car. The C63S eats a set of MPS4S's in about 10,000 miles.
The M135i forums rated the MPS4S as better than the MPSS especially in wet weather but they are not available in all sizes so you need to check your wheel sizes.
I did have a go in a C63S which had cup2's on and they were awesome for grip on the warm summers day I drove on but looking at the tread pattern they are dry weather tyres only.
Thanks for the reply. I think MPS4S would be ideal but I don’t believe they were ever produced in wheel sizes less than 19, or if they did they seem to be extremely difficult to find and, perhaps, a little too strongly priced. Interesting that you found the MPSS ok in the wet, so maybe I shouldn’t be too quick to discount. Think they were OE on the m135i weren’t they?I ran my M135i on MPSS, great tyres, drove the car in sun, rain, snow and ice. So long as you understand and respect you won't get warm summers day levels of grip in adverse conditions you will be fine, they also benefit from a few miles to get some heat into them. Drove Leeds to Manchester on the M621 in the snow a few years ago without any real drama, just drove with light feet. They lasted well 20,000+ miles a set front and rear.
My C63S runs MPS4S's again great tyres, drive the car in sun, rain, snow and ice. To be honest they are just as good as the MPSS and I would struggle to tell the difference. The C63S corners faster, turns harder accelerates faster but it cost 3x the price of the M135i with far wider tyres so that's kind of expected. It's truly rubbish at standing water but that might be the 265 front & 295 rear tyres more than the car. The C63S eats a set of MPS4S's in about 10,000 miles.
The M135i forums rated the MPS4S as better than the MPSS especially in wet weather but they are not available in all sizes so you need to check your wheel sizes.
I did have a go in a C63S which had cup2's on and they were awesome for grip on the warm summers day I drove on but looking at the tread pattern they are dry weather tyres only.
I have the same problem with the C63 on the MPS4S, it needs to be warmed up before driving it hard.
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