Aquiring rights to make Chim / Griff.
Discussion
And if they offered it with the LSx engine in some guise (LS1 ... LS6) then it would be a winner. I can imagine many current owners considering a trade-up.
However, it wouldn't have a TVR badge on it.
(Although I'm sure it could be arranged after purchase
)
>> Edited by JonRB on Monday 1st August 11:21
However, it wouldn't have a TVR badge on it.
(Although I'm sure it could be arranged after purchase
) >> Edited by JonRB on Monday 1st August 11:21
bjwoods said:
...the badge would come with it...
Not sure why it would, the design could be licensed and a parts supply contract entered into (if needed, considering TVR sourced many Griff/Chim parts from major manufacturers and depending on engine choice) without any rights to use the TVR badge passing.
As it would be a third party-produced car, TVR would be highly unlikely to allow the use of its badge due to reputational risk etc.
Think about the Lotus 7/Caterham 7 - the Caterham never wore a Lotus badge...
JonRB said:No chance, we V8 owners wish TVR would move the S6 out of the way and replace it with a modern V8 from the likes of HSV.
And if they offered it with the LSx engine in some guise (LS1 ... LS6) then it would be a winner. I can imagine many current owners considering a trade-up.
bjwoods said:Err no it wouldn't, I can think several cars made under licence like the Caterham 7, the Morris Oxford oh and the Royal Enfield motor-bike but none of them use the original makers name. Why on Earth would TVR allow some other low volume manufacturer to make cars called TVRs?
But if the right were sold off, so would the parts supply have to be included, and the badge would come with it.
B
R...anonymous said:
[redacted]
I think so. Both the Chim and Griff have a classic, timeless design, a strong following and an almost cult status amongst British petrolheads. I think the thing which puts a lot of people off is the reputation surrounding the reliablity of TVRs. Maybe an LSx engine would go some way to address this*.
Obviously, a lot will depend on price too. Only those truly soaked in the anointed oil known as petrol will pick up a 'replica' Chim/Griff above a Boxter or similar machine with creature comforts and safety features.
*I ought to make clear that my view is that the RV8 is a venerable, hardy beast (which I love). What I'm talking about is public perception
There's certainly precedence. Lotus selling off the complete rights to the 7 to Caterham and the M100 Elan to Kia are the ones that spring most readily to mind.
As has been said, the new car(s) would have to improve on the old in some way. I think the Cammer or LSx (whether that be the vernerable 5.7L LS1 or the new cutting-edge 6L LS6) would go a long way. Rollbar and side impact bars also. I'd be wary of ABS and TC unless I had reason to believe that they had been properly implemented.
I'd also not want to see the styling changed too much either. I think this is where Kia failed on their Elan - it looked different, was heavier, had less power and was altogether less desirable.
As for badging, well I'm sure the scrappies and/or Leven would do a roaring trade in "TVR" and "Chimaera" / "Griffith" badges. Know what I mean?
As has been said, the new car(s) would have to improve on the old in some way. I think the Cammer or LSx (whether that be the vernerable 5.7L LS1 or the new cutting-edge 6L LS6) would go a long way. Rollbar and side impact bars also. I'd be wary of ABS and TC unless I had reason to believe that they had been properly implemented.
I'd also not want to see the styling changed too much either. I think this is where Kia failed on their Elan - it looked different, was heavier, had less power and was altogether less desirable.
As for badging, well I'm sure the scrappies and/or Leven would do a roaring trade in "TVR" and "Chimaera" / "Griffith" badges. Know what I mean?
GTvr said:No, you're right. There was somewhere in the Far East producing Chimaeras. They also had a one-make race series.
I seem to recall that Chimaeras were be produced in the Phillipines or some such place under licence I guess - or have i been sniffing TVR glue to much.
Edit: It's Malaysia, BTW.
>> Edited by JonRB on Monday 1st August 17:10
Easiest sale would be via a non compete agreement.
IE sell the rights to a US firm who would make the required changes to meet US regs (if possible), dump in a US power unit and flog it into that market.
If TVR had any sense they would retain a % share.
To be honest it a sale is very likely but probably not until it could have no impact on current sales.
Time will tell.
IE sell the rights to a US firm who would make the required changes to meet US regs (if possible), dump in a US power unit and flog it into that market.
If TVR had any sense they would retain a % share.
To be honest it a sale is very likely but probably not until it could have no impact on current sales.
Time will tell.
There is another aspect to consider...if the 'new' car is based on the chim/griff chassis/body...then owners of lets say 'well used' examples could have their cars upgraded to the new spec. rather than go for a standard rebuild (not that there is such a thing!)
A 400 hp V8, shocks/damper upgrade (jools?), brake upgrade (discs/calipers but no ABS!), nice set of alloys and tasteful interior up-date.
should provide additional income since you are looking at over 10 years production and about 8000 cars (6000 chims + 2000 griffs approx).
new car @ £40K...rebuild £10 to £20K depending on spec?
I like the idea or re-producing the chim/griff, like you say the designs are classics, where by i think the newer cars basic shapes are not as attractive and seem to be trying too hard in the spoilers and scoops department.
The sagaris is the best example...stunning, eye catching, etc but hardly a classic and no beauty. Think TVR should have an up-to-date, simple, clean design without reverting to see through spoilers, holes in the wings, and have a big V8. No shame in buying an engine in...as stated earlier in the thread...the LS6 would be a good bet.
I'm going to resign and start clearing out my shed ready to start my car building empire!
A 400 hp V8, shocks/damper upgrade (jools?), brake upgrade (discs/calipers but no ABS!), nice set of alloys and tasteful interior up-date.
should provide additional income since you are looking at over 10 years production and about 8000 cars (6000 chims + 2000 griffs approx).
new car @ £40K...rebuild £10 to £20K depending on spec?
I like the idea or re-producing the chim/griff, like you say the designs are classics, where by i think the newer cars basic shapes are not as attractive and seem to be trying too hard in the spoilers and scoops department.
The sagaris is the best example...stunning, eye catching, etc but hardly a classic and no beauty. Think TVR should have an up-to-date, simple, clean design without reverting to see through spoilers, holes in the wings, and have a big V8. No shame in buying an engine in...as stated earlier in the thread...the LS6 would be a good bet.
I'm going to resign and start clearing out my shed ready to start my car building empire!
Top Idea!!!
I can see it being done really well in low numbers, then the build quality would be stacks better, nice healthy order books to keep up demand and keep residuals nice and high. I have to agree with moving away from 6 engines, V8 is definately the TVR i fell in love with. You'll need someone with a name like TreVoR to make it work, how about KeViN or KeItH or CoLiN?? i would suggest RoGeR but that was just obvious......................
P.S. Keep them between £30k and £40k and you'll be raking it in. Thats what made TVR's so popular in the first place.
>> Edited by DodgeyRog on Tuesday 2nd August 14:18
I can see it being done really well in low numbers, then the build quality would be stacks better, nice healthy order books to keep up demand and keep residuals nice and high. I have to agree with moving away from 6 engines, V8 is definately the TVR i fell in love with. You'll need someone with a name like TreVoR to make it work, how about KeViN or KeItH or CoLiN?? i would suggest RoGeR but that was just obvious......................
P.S. Keep them between £30k and £40k and you'll be raking it in. Thats what made TVR's so popular in the first place.
>> Edited by DodgeyRog on Tuesday 2nd August 14:18
There is a company that takes Pug 205 GTi's and refurbishes them and/or track prepares them and then sells them as a package (bear with me).
Also, Litchfield take Subaru Imprezas, pull out the 2.0L European-spec engine and replace it with a tuned version of the US-spec 2.5L engine, and sell it as the Litchfield Type 25.
So, given the above two precedents, might there not be a business case for buying up second hand Chimaera and Griffiths, refurbishing and restoring them (as necessary) and dropping in an LSx engine and then selling it as the TVR Chimaera / Griffith MyCompanyName.
Mind you, the other idea is to take the basic design of the Chimaera, modernise it, put an LSx in it, and market it as, oh I dunno, the Marcos TSO.
Also, Litchfield take Subaru Imprezas, pull out the 2.0L European-spec engine and replace it with a tuned version of the US-spec 2.5L engine, and sell it as the Litchfield Type 25.
So, given the above two precedents, might there not be a business case for buying up second hand Chimaera and Griffiths, refurbishing and restoring them (as necessary) and dropping in an LSx engine and then selling it as the TVR Chimaera / Griffith MyCompanyName.
Mind you, the other idea is to take the basic design of the Chimaera, modernise it, put an LSx in it, and market it as, oh I dunno, the Marcos TSO.
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