Sportmotive chassis

[ChilliWhizz]

Anyone got the latest on this? Particularly interested in how the revised suspension set up is working, has it made a big difference to Chim/Griff handling/levels of grip?

Cheers,
Chilli

[phazed]

I saw it at the growl last year, lovely bit of kit.

I can't help but think that is it that much better than the standard chassis that has been worked with new poly bushes good quality dampers stiffer anti-rollbars and bigger brakes.

In theory yes, but........... When I'm at my best on track, ( which is debatable I know) flat out on the tail of something decent, a proper Porsche, Exige or the like, will an Evolution chassis be that much better?

If my chassis was completely shot then I may consider one. But until that time and as my car performs as well as it does, I couldn't possibly justify the cost.

Just my tuppence worth.

[ClassiChimi]

I suppose the hubs etc are a bit lighter so less unsprung weight but if you can tell or feel the difference is another question!
I saw the same Chassis as Peter and it is impressive. Is it also stiffened up a bit, if so then It's def faster round bends I the dry I'd have thought???!!!!

[ClassiChimi]

Have they tweaked the suspension geometry also? It all helps I suppose.

[phazed]

Yes, the geometry is changed, especially the rear.

[WinstonWolf]

AIUI it's stiffer and they've also addressed the issue of the high roll centre.

[phazed]

I'm sure there is no doubt that the whole package is better than the original, that's progress.

Is it that much better to justify the cost?

If money wasn't an issue I'd have one tomorrow and thoroughly enjoy fitting it myself, but....................

As it stands now, I'm pretty sure that there wouldn't be much in it track time wise but if I had one fitted I would be smiling knowing that I had what looks like a superb upgrade that is technically superior.

[ClassiChimi]

^^^^
So you buy a wrecker with a rotton Chassis for peanuts then add the CHASSIS,,,,build a cracking engine, kick ass wherever you go,,,,,,
My only concern was the billet alley parts corroding with roads use,

It's a great addition to the options we have,,,, someone needs to prove it's faster?

Edited to add, maybe someone has shown it's actually better for all I know,,, it must be?

Edited by ClassiChimi on Wednesday 1st July 09:22

[jay-kay-em]

Be it right or wrong, unfair or otherwise, DVLA rules are quite clear.

You can only retain your registration mark when using a new chassis if that chassis is an EXACT replica of the original.

Any new chassis, designed and built with modifications, requires SVA type approval and/or a Q mark just like a kit-car. It is essentially a new car as the chassis (or a monocoque) is the identification point.

https://www.gov.uk/vehicle-registration/rebuilt-ve...

In practice, you probably will never have a problem - but when you start winning time trial events and you get some bitter competition, they may make your life hard.

Don't shoot the messenger... just food for thought.

[T4NGO]

jay-kay-em said:

Be it right or wrong, unfair or otherwise, DVLA rules are quite clear.

You can only retain your registration mark when using a new chassis if that chassis is an EXACT replica of the original.

Any new chassis, designed and built with modifications, requires SVA type approval and/or a Q mark just like a kit-car. It is essentially a new car as the chassis (or a monocoque) is the identification point.

https://www.gov.uk/vehicle-registration/rebuilt-ve...

In practice, you probably will never have a problem - but when you start winning time trial events and you get some bitter competition, they may make your life hard.

Don't shoot the messenger... just food for thought.

Never seems to bother the MK 1 / 2 escort boys lol. And they're generally complete re shells with the old plates riveted back on

[sportmotive]

Thanks for all the positive comments on the chassis gents and I understand the anticipation, we have been at this project; the Evolution chassis for over 4 years now, but that is just how long it takes to properly design, develop and test everything, we have virtually reworked the whole chassis, its not just a few extra tubes and some shiny light weight uprights. The uprights are the key to the chassis capabilities though, getting rid of that Sierra front upright with its 14 degrees of steering axis inclination was the first port of call and all the associated steering and wishbone geometry around it, but we didn't stop there the chassis needed dramatically stiffening and better materials, so all tubes are CDS rather than seamed tube and we added around 18 extra bracing tubes into the main back bone in critical areas, particularly around the engine bay. The engine bay and the front of the chassis have also been widened to more easily accommodate an LS engine with straight down exhaust manifolds and 6 speed gearboxes. Anti roll bars have been reworked and the rear bar now spans the full width of the chassis so actually has some effect! rear suspension geometry as been developed around Sagaris roll centres. I could go on and on as there is much much more we have done but simply put if you want your Griff or Chim to handle and drive as well and as precise and controllable as a Sagaris then you will want an Evolution chassis. The first car we completed which we are currently using to test and develop our own new dampers has a GM supercharged LSA engine pushing out 625hp and 640lbft peak torque and 500lbft of torque at 2000rpm and YES! its is DRIVABLE!

[sportmotive]

and just to address the registration issue, we contacted the Vehicle Certification Agency when we started this endeavour and explained what we were doing and were told that as the chassis retained the same basic design and layout that it wouldn't be an issue and it would be up to the owner if they wanted to take the car for a VOLUNTARY IVA test, the VCA had no concerns over it as the chassis is simply a new part, its not taken from another car and the car being built is retaining the majority of its original components......

[GTRene]

sounds good sportmotive, also that more then 600hp LSA engined car,
I would be satisfied with the LS480 me thinks...or maybe a bit more, but that also cost more
tempting it is, a complete build from the ground up 'new' Chimaera with such specs and a new better interior with
better seats and alcantara etc...MMM

[ChilliWhizz]

I can highly recommend Sportmotive, had my headlight conversion, front end respray (and some damage repair done... thanks Ian), and a full service done there... excellent job, really friendly people, and great value... As far I'm concerned when it's about my TVR it has to be people you can trust, who know what they're doing, and don't talk crap or try and overcharge... We must support our Indies.. Mat Smith is my nearest, he's first rate, and I fully support him, even down to spannering at the Dunlop challenge events ... If I lived Stoke way it would be the boys at Sportmotive... No question...

Just my personal opinion...






Ian, mate, can we discuss this new chassis price?

[neutral 3]

Ian, the standard Griff chassis is no where near stiff enough, but when your chassis is jacked up under the B post does the door gap stay the same / and the door can be opened with no latch fouling and closed easily ?

[jay-kay-em]

sportmotive said:

and just to address the registration issue, we contacted the Vehicle Certification Agency when we started this endeavour and explained what we were doing and were told that as the chassis retained the same basic design and layout that it wouldn't be an issue and it would be up to the owner if they wanted to take the car for a VOLUNTARY IVA test, the VCA had no concerns over it as the chassis is simply a new part, its not taken from another car and the car being built is retaining the majority of its original components......

The VCA have nothing to do with the management of registration marks. They manage type approval. Two totally different things. VCA would deal with the positioning of headlamps, angles of visibility from mirrors, drive-by noise etc. A new chassis doesn't really affect their work.

The VCA giving advice that a chassis is just another part of the car (like a door) may apply for their work, but shockingly short-sighted in other areas. The chassis (or monocoque) is intrinsic to vehicle identity in the eyes of both the Police, VOSA, DVLA and I would hope the TVRCC.

You can buy a new chassis made to the 'same specification' as the 90's TVR one, no problem, thus retaining an original VIN + reg mark.

Make a new chassis, that radically deviates from the original TVR design and DVLA will consider that a new-build kit-car that needs a Q + mandatory SVA. This is what it says on their website in the web link I quoted. You say in your own description "virtually reworked the whole chassis".

Google "new chassis needs a Q" and there are countless Land Rover forums discussing the same problem. You cant buy a new 'improved' Land Rover chassis for coil springs with TD5 engine mounting points and keep its much older leaf-spring identity and reg mark.

Unofficial advice amongst the Land Rover community is "keep stum" upon conversion, and don't tell the DVLA anything. However, it just takes one car to 'trip-up' and you have the owner of an immaculate 500 looking down the barrel of a Q mark. I don't care either way, but purchasers need to be well informed of often anal DVLA rules.

Edited by jay-kay-em on Thursday 2nd July 18:26

Edited by jay-kay-em on Thursday 2nd July 18:33

[eff eff]

So on that basis tubular wishbones and additional seat mounts welded to chassis require a Q plate,
Can you define what you mean by "a new chassis, that radically deviates from the original TVR design," what is considered radical?
I believe that "virtually reworked the whole chassis" refers to the materials used i.e. cold drawn seamless tube and heavier box sections. The other aspects of the changes are suspension geometry not chassis which was adjustable on the original as well.

Edited by eff eff on Thursday 2nd July 21:05

[andy43]

I think I would go down the triggers broom route and ask sportmotive to incorporate parts of my existing chassis - therefore making the 'new' chassis a very refurbished 'old' one

[macdeb]

I've seen it in the flesh being made, very tasty and I'd have one if,,,,,. Though I hope the guys who make it do a better job on a completion date than they did for me Or even a start date for that

Edited by macdeb on Thursday 2nd July 21:20

[jay-kay-em]

eff eff said:

Can you define what you *DVLA* mean by "a new chassis, that radically deviates from the original TVR design," what is considered radical?

Check the DVLA website here : https://www.gov.uk/vehicle-registration/rebuilt-ve...

To quote DVLA :

A rebuilt vehicle can keep its original registration number if you can prove you’ve used:

> the original unmodified chassis or monocoque bodyshell (car or light van)

> new chassis or monocoque bodyshell of the same specification as the original (car or light van)

Anything else is Q or 'new vehicle' route.

eff eff said:

I believe that "virtually reworked the whole chassis" refers to the materials used i.e. cold drawn seamless tube and heavier box sections. The other aspects of the changes are suspension geometry not chassis which was adjustable on the original as well.

To quote the design :

the chassis needed dramatically stiffening and better materials, so all tubes are CDS rather than seamed tube and we added around 18 extra bracing tubes into the main back bone in critical areas, particularly around the engine bay. The engine bay and the front of the chassis have also been widened to more easily accommodate an LS engine with straight down exhaust manifolds and 6 speed gearboxes.

So that's materials, methods, design plus dimensions to accommodate non original powertrains. Remember DVLA require a new chassis to be of the same specification as the original.

Just like you cant stick UPVC windows in an Elizabethan cottage, there is some logic in it. Its the closest thing in the automotive world we have to a 'listed building' so classic cars (with their identities) can be protected.

Its not so critical for the Griff (but will be in time) but it prevents road tax evasion having new cars on a modern chassis and passing it off as tax exempt (now rolling from '73 I think?). Unfortunately, to cover the older stuff, its one rule for all.

My working relationship with the DVLA over the years has taught me that their decision model is based on a tombola machine powered by a gerbil. They are more militant some days than others! I'm not here to argue with anyone (save it for the DVLA!); I just want to make people aware of the risks/rules, so people can make their own *informed* decisions and prepare accordingly.