Ranger Thunder Lack of Power
Discussion
90K on the clock 04 Truck, but seems gutless struggles to make 60 mph up small inclines.
No smoke from exhaust, can still hear turbo wine, clutch is fine as revs and picks up speed, just very slowly.....
Revs up in neutral ok.
Is it just worn out? , thought it would smoke a bit though.
Cheers
Joe T
No smoke from exhaust, can still hear turbo wine, clutch is fine as revs and picks up speed, just very slowly.....
Revs up in neutral ok.
Is it just worn out? , thought it would smoke a bit though.
Cheers
Joe T
just a thought...........check the pipe from the map sensor to the inlet manifold is still connected.
It's not common for Ranger to suffer problems, but I have seen a couple with the pipes adrift.
Your looking for a rubber pipe which connects to the front of the inlet manifold by the EGR valve and works back to a small black sensor fitted near some vacuum solenoids on top of the inlet manifold.
Also, if the fuel filter becomes blocked, the pump decides that it's got a problem and reduces the fuelling and doesn't always bother to inform the driver by way of the glow plug light.
It's not common for Ranger to suffer problems, but I have seen a couple with the pipes adrift.
Your looking for a rubber pipe which connects to the front of the inlet manifold by the EGR valve and works back to a small black sensor fitted near some vacuum solenoids on top of the inlet manifold.
Also, if the fuel filter becomes blocked, the pump decides that it's got a problem and reduces the fuelling and doesn't always bother to inform the driver by way of the glow plug light.
Thanks I will check that out.
I am beginning to think its the engine, got a bit of pressure/chuffing at the oil filler cap, but no smoke out the rear??
Its still really drivable but just seems down on power, are these engines crap I notice they are only just over 100 bhp, for something this weight just surprises me.
I am beginning to think its the engine, got a bit of pressure/chuffing at the oil filler cap, but no smoke out the rear??
Its still really drivable but just seems down on power, are these engines crap I notice they are only just over 100 bhp, for something this weight just surprises me.
iirc they were around 109Ps from new, i've seen some of these engines go through 300K, so 90k isn't a problem 
They do produce some crank pressure and it's designed to be fed back into the inlet system for reburning.
The lack of smoke on a free acceleration or when under load might suggest that the fueling isn't being increased to match the boosted inlet charge.
New Ranger is a nice drive too, 143Ps now with TDCi economy
They do produce some crank pressure and it's designed to be fed back into the inlet system for reburning.
The lack of smoke on a free acceleration or when under load might suggest that the fueling isn't being increased to match the boosted inlet charge.
New Ranger is a nice drive too, 143Ps now with TDCi economy
Right, got a bit more involved with it now, on start up no smoke, even from the oil filler, bit of pressure but no smoke, as it warms up you get a bit of smoke with the pressure. Checked out the Air Filter as I could see the breather pipe from the rocker cover heads that way and no Air filter installed!
But after checking all the small rubber hoses, and firing it up I noticed the valve actuater nearest the bulkhead on of 2 bolted on the inlet manifold is clicking away like a gooden sounds like an empty washer bottle motor is this normal, the one next to it is silent, unplugging it makes no difference to anything!
One other thing, bottom crank pulley is well pissed, runs out about 5mm, looks a bit scary but is tight etc, are they rubber centered or something.
I here you on the mileage, and glad you confrimed my thinking, the car has been well looked after, no towbar, seems everything is fine.
Is it worth getting a dealer to plug something in to it?
But after checking all the small rubber hoses, and firing it up I noticed the valve actuater nearest the bulkhead on of 2 bolted on the inlet manifold is clicking away like a gooden sounds like an empty washer bottle motor is this normal, the one next to it is silent, unplugging it makes no difference to anything!
One other thing, bottom crank pulley is well pissed, runs out about 5mm, looks a bit scary but is tight etc, are they rubber centered or something.
I here you on the mileage, and glad you confrimed my thinking, the car has been well looked after, no towbar, seems everything is fine.
Is it worth getting a dealer to plug something in to it?
Have you just got this vehicle or are looking at it for someone?
I assumed it was yours and you'd noticed a decline in performance.
It's common for the vacuum valves to do some random things, and usually it's an earth problem on the mounting plate. You should see a few wires going to the same place.
If the management system has decided that the emissions control systems have developed a fault, it can force reduced fuelling.
There is a way of retriving the fault codes by shorting 3 pins in the diagnostic socket and watching the glow plug light flash, but i haven't got info at home with me. you'll need an led and a couple of pieces of wire
I assumed it was yours and you'd noticed a decline in performance.
It's common for the vacuum valves to do some random things, and usually it's an earth problem on the mounting plate. You should see a few wires going to the same place.
If the management system has decided that the emissions control systems have developed a fault, it can force reduced fuelling.
There is a way of retriving the fault codes by shorting 3 pins in the diagnostic socket and watching the glow plug light flash, but i haven't got info at home with me. you'll need an led and a couple of pieces of wire
I will try and find the Mounting plate and clean up the connections. I reckon the vehicle has been steam cleaned recently so worth a look, does that sound wrong the actuater making that noise on tickover?
So things to try:
Changing or draining fuel filter? (which)
Clean up engine earths.
Fit Air Filter.
If the ECU has fualt codes in it wouldnt a light come on somewhere? I am familiar with limp home systems but most tell you its limping...
Otherwise need to start looking for Engine suppliers, any recomendations.
My comment on the BHP was based on say Citroens 1,9 turbo punching out 110 bhp, I would have thought a 2.5 turbo to be in the 130's etc its a 12 valve.
If the engine is knackered wouldnt it smoke out the exhaust ie oil burning etc.
Logic tells me when an engine dosent pull and smokes a little out the oil filler its knackered, but other than that there are no external signs.
Cheers
So things to try:
Changing or draining fuel filter? (which)
Clean up engine earths.
Fit Air Filter.
If the ECU has fualt codes in it wouldnt a light come on somewhere? I am familiar with limp home systems but most tell you its limping...
Otherwise need to start looking for Engine suppliers, any recomendations.
My comment on the BHP was based on say Citroens 1,9 turbo punching out 110 bhp, I would have thought a 2.5 turbo to be in the 130's etc its a 12 valve.
If the engine is knackered wouldnt it smoke out the exhaust ie oil burning etc.
Logic tells me when an engine dosent pull and smokes a little out the oil filler its knackered, but other than that there are no external signs.
Cheers
Although it's a 12 valve, it was quite a crude and fuel thirsty beast 
The system won't flash the MIL (glow plugs) for every fault.
I'd certainly replace the fuel filter element as a restriction in the fuel flow confuses the pump and it generates a timing code and reduces the fuel demand accordingly.
The system won't flash the MIL (glow plugs) for every fault.
I'd certainly replace the fuel filter element as a restriction in the fuel flow confuses the pump and it generates a timing code and reduces the fuel demand accordingly.
Well got a Fuel Filter and Air Filter for it today. Also sprayed up all the earth points I could find on the inner wing to give them a soak prior to stripping apart.
Wont get a chance to get at till monday I suspect, but will report back if it improves, also going to have a look at the turbo check it spins freely etc. Maybe try and hook up a pressure guage and see if there is any boost there somewhere.
Is it worth putting a bit of neat injector cleaner in the fuel filter when I reassmble it, done this in the past on some smokey cars to give them a flush.
Also discovered today that its got full service history, according to the garage I contacted, there posting me a copy of all the invoices. He had no idea it had a problem none had been reported recently and commented on expense was never an issue with getting the work done that was needed, all very strange and a bit dissapointing in one way as it sort of rules out neglect.(apart from weird bottom pulley)
Pulled the pipe off the noisy solenoid at the front where it fits to a dish shaped item no suction, but then I am guessing to the functionality, maybe its supposed to sound like an angry cricket.
I must say the amount of wiring and solenoids all over it don't make it look crude, someones suggested to look at the EGR system, as it can sap power if it gets clogged.
We will see.
Thanks again
Wont get a chance to get at till monday I suspect, but will report back if it improves, also going to have a look at the turbo check it spins freely etc. Maybe try and hook up a pressure guage and see if there is any boost there somewhere.
Is it worth putting a bit of neat injector cleaner in the fuel filter when I reassmble it, done this in the past on some smokey cars to give them a flush.
Also discovered today that its got full service history, according to the garage I contacted, there posting me a copy of all the invoices. He had no idea it had a problem none had been reported recently and commented on expense was never an issue with getting the work done that was needed, all very strange and a bit dissapointing in one way as it sort of rules out neglect.(apart from weird bottom pulley)
Pulled the pipe off the noisy solenoid at the front where it fits to a dish shaped item no suction, but then I am guessing to the functionality, maybe its supposed to sound like an angry cricket.
I must say the amount of wiring and solenoids all over it don't make it look crude, someones suggested to look at the EGR system, as it can sap power if it gets clogged.
We will see.
Thanks again
It might be worth some injector cleaner in the fuel tank, but i'd never try it neat in the filter.
The large dish shaped thing at the front of the inlet manifold with a vac pipe on it could be one of two things, the manifold throttle plate or the egr valve itself. The EGR valve has a metal pipe on the back of it which feeds exhaust gasses into the valve.
Rangers aren't known for EGR problems really, and you can see the diaphram move though the cut outs in the valve. if you apply a vacuum to it with a mityvac and then release it sharply, you should hear a nice metallic clunk as the valve closes almost straight away.
The crank pully will probably be OK as the engine is running, so that means the bit that counts is still inducing a signal at the crank sensor.
I didn't have time today to find the diagram of the self test rig, but i'll sort it tomorrow for you.
don't forget the earth by those solenoids as it's quite a crucial one for the engine control systems.
The large dish shaped thing at the front of the inlet manifold with a vac pipe on it could be one of two things, the manifold throttle plate or the egr valve itself. The EGR valve has a metal pipe on the back of it which feeds exhaust gasses into the valve.
Rangers aren't known for EGR problems really, and you can see the diaphram move though the cut outs in the valve. if you apply a vacuum to it with a mityvac and then release it sharply, you should hear a nice metallic clunk as the valve closes almost straight away.
The crank pully will probably be OK as the engine is running, so that means the bit that counts is still inducing a signal at the crank sensor.
I didn't have time today to find the diagram of the self test rig, but i'll sort it tomorrow for you.
don't forget the earth by those solenoids as it's quite a crucial one for the engine control systems.
Thanks for the reminder I havent found them yet, are they a bunch of wires actually bolted to the manifold or engine or do they go accross to the bulkhead.
I cant understand how a crank pulley gets that bent, if I sort out the running I suppose I better replace it, I bet that will be fun to undo.
I cant understand how a crank pulley gets that bent, if I sort out the running I suppose I better replace it, I bet that will be fun to undo.
Joe
Whats happened to the crank damper is anyones guess really, as long as it's going though i'd leave it.
the bottom end is all gear driven and so nothing major can happen.
There is an earth on the plate where the solenoid valves are fitted, thats the one you need to find.
If you want I can send you a section of the workshop manual which covers the fuel and emission systems, it includes all the diagnostic readings and how to take them.
It's around 5mb though and it's in pdf format.
Whats happened to the crank damper is anyones guess really, as long as it's going though i'd leave it.
the bottom end is all gear driven and so nothing major can happen.
There is an earth on the plate where the solenoid valves are fitted, thats the one you need to find.
If you want I can send you a section of the workshop manual which covers the fuel and emission systems, it includes all the diagnostic readings and how to take them.
It's around 5mb though and it's in pdf format.
Joe
I haven't had any Pm,s or emails from you and your not the first person who's said they've tried to contact me. I'll have to see whats going on as the mail addy listed here takes plenty of mail each day.
Can you try sending another mail outside of PH to b_w19@hotmail.com and i'll reply back with the sections you need.
the section you need is about 150 pages, so you'll not be short of reading material for a while
I haven't had any Pm,s or emails from you and your not the first person who's said they've tried to contact me. I'll have to see whats going on as the mail addy listed here takes plenty of mail each day.
Can you try sending another mail outside of PH to b_w19@hotmail.com and i'll reply back with the sections you need.
the section you need is about 150 pages, so you'll not be short of reading material for a while
Hello
I have sent you an email direct this time.
Well had a chance to get stuck in this morning, changed fuel filter airfilter, fuel filter looked a bit cruddy but no water or rust. Cleaned up all the engine earths I could find, removed both sides of the turbo piping to have a look at the turbo in action. All seemed fine, bit of oil on them but again I have seen that on cars working ok. Turbo spins freely. Had a could look at all the small piping it does have vacum to the valves at the front on tickover, it seems to hold the throttle butterfly one on full movement.
But still no power, from 2-3000 is painful on anything but the flat, I tried getting round to 4000 in 3rd still nothing, I can hear the turbo but very faintly.
I would hook up a boost gauge but with all the plumbing all over it not sure where to hook it up.
But its not looking good, I heard from someone that these modern diesels dont smoke much however bad they are due to the CAT etc, When I tried to get it to 4000 I did here a rev cutout type ticking from under the car? CAT overload??
I suppose its time to have a look at the ECU settings?
I have sent you an email direct this time.
Well had a chance to get stuck in this morning, changed fuel filter airfilter, fuel filter looked a bit cruddy but no water or rust. Cleaned up all the engine earths I could find, removed both sides of the turbo piping to have a look at the turbo in action. All seemed fine, bit of oil on them but again I have seen that on cars working ok. Turbo spins freely. Had a could look at all the small piping it does have vacum to the valves at the front on tickover, it seems to hold the throttle butterfly one on full movement.
But still no power, from 2-3000 is painful on anything but the flat, I tried getting round to 4000 in 3rd still nothing, I can hear the turbo but very faintly.
I would hook up a boost gauge but with all the plumbing all over it not sure where to hook it up.
But its not looking good, I heard from someone that these modern diesels dont smoke much however bad they are due to the CAT etc, When I tried to get it to 4000 I did here a rev cutout type ticking from under the car? CAT overload??
I suppose its time to have a look at the ECU settings?
Hi Joe
I've replied directly to your mail.
I'm unsure as to the ticking /rev limit thing with the information you've posted.
If the exhaust had a blockage, you'd have suffered lower down rev range imho.
In the email you asked where you could plumb in a boost gauge to check the turbos output, near the inlet manifold throttle butterfly there is a small bore rubber pipe leading back to a small black sensor, thats the MAP sensor, plumb the master gauge in somewhere along that pipework.
good luck and feel free to contact me outside of PH
Brian
I've replied directly to your mail.
I'm unsure as to the ticking /rev limit thing with the information you've posted.
If the exhaust had a blockage, you'd have suffered lower down rev range imho.
In the email you asked where you could plumb in a boost gauge to check the turbos output, near the inlet manifold throttle butterfly there is a small bore rubber pipe leading back to a small black sensor, thats the MAP sensor, plumb the master gauge in somewhere along that pipework.
good luck and feel free to contact me outside of PH
Brian
Thanks for the manual its excellelent, I took the decision to wipe the ECU codes clean as I could not really decipher them.
The thinking behind this was that if the fact that codes exist at all this might put it into "limp home mode" plus who knows what might have been pulled off to see if it made a difference etc. Any faults would just reappear anyway.
I checked again after clearing them and none were present, I drove it 5 miles and checked again but still no codes, I am assuming faulty valves and solenoids should fire up a code fault?
Back to mechanical failure of some sort, it does feel as though the turbo is not working as it starts to struggle at 2500 rpm.
I suppose I better check the boost on the turbo, but no visual signs of wear on the turbo. I would do a compression check on the engine but I doubt I will have a strong enough gauge, or be able to get the injectors out.
Any other oddities like valve clearance tightening up to reduce compression or other stuff to check.
Thanks
The thinking behind this was that if the fact that codes exist at all this might put it into "limp home mode" plus who knows what might have been pulled off to see if it made a difference etc. Any faults would just reappear anyway.
I checked again after clearing them and none were present, I drove it 5 miles and checked again but still no codes, I am assuming faulty valves and solenoids should fire up a code fault?
Back to mechanical failure of some sort, it does feel as though the turbo is not working as it starts to struggle at 2500 rpm.
I suppose I better check the boost on the turbo, but no visual signs of wear on the turbo. I would do a compression check on the engine but I doubt I will have a strong enough gauge, or be able to get the injectors out.
Any other oddities like valve clearance tightening up to reduce compression or other stuff to check.
Thanks
Not directly relevant I suppose, but for what its worth...
In this months Car Mechanic magazine, they are repairing an ex-taxi VW Sharan / Galaxy turbodiesel. It was giving generally sluggish performance, even more so than you might expect from a high mileage machine. Despite the usual checks, nothing definite was coming up and the mobile ECU analyser bloke said that although the turbo seemed to be ok, it was the only thing that could really be causing such poor performance. To cut a long story short, the turbo had ingested some metal in the past, which had turned over the turbine blades and hence it was still spinning but to virtually no effect.
In this months Car Mechanic magazine, they are repairing an ex-taxi VW Sharan / Galaxy turbodiesel. It was giving generally sluggish performance, even more so than you might expect from a high mileage machine. Despite the usual checks, nothing definite was coming up and the mobile ECU analyser bloke said that although the turbo seemed to be ok, it was the only thing that could really be causing such poor performance. To cut a long story short, the turbo had ingested some metal in the past, which had turned over the turbine blades and hence it was still spinning but to virtually no effect.
Latest update, after lots of testing and no real movement forward decided to give a Ford dealer a try, Oh boy, wont be doing that again in a hurry. Felt a bit sorry for them really, basically there whole knowledege is centered around the computer diagnostics no codes means they didn't really hava a clue or any enthusiasm for investigating the problem further, impling they would not be able to gaurentee there diagnosos. I suppose its a sign of the times.
Anyway its currently baffling a local diesel expert, who so far thinks some of the pipes are on the wrong way round, or at least thats how its behaving. He thinks something is causing it to under fuel.
Anyway its currently baffling a local diesel expert, who so far thinks some of the pipes are on the wrong way round, or at least thats how its behaving. He thinks something is causing it to under fuel.
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