Mk3 Focus ST as a high(ish) mileage daily
Discussion
After a few opinions from anyone running a Mk3 Focus ST 
Current car is a Mk3.5 Focus Zetec S diesel (148bhp), chosen because I do close to 20k miles a year. As much as I love the car, there's still a part of me which would like an ST. Didn't go for the diesel ST because I don't really feel it's a 'proper' ST, and at some point I could remap mine to a similar, if not higher power output. Mrs ZS is thinking about changing her car later this year, and as she really likes mine its possible she'd take mine and I could go for an ST (although at this stage she thinks diesel ST, but I'll worry about that later
)
I guess I'm asking if given the mileage I'd be doing, am I mad in considering a petrol ST? Obviously fuel costs would shoot up, at the moment I easily average 50mpg on my 'spirited' cross country commute, and although I can drive economically (I used to average 40-45ish mpg in my old 1.6 petrol focus, without dawdling), when you take into account the fun factor of an ST I imagine I'd be looking at much lower.
So my questions are:
1. roughly what mpg do you get in the real world? (and under what conditions?)
2. facelift ST-2 or pre-facelift ST-3 (my preference is facelift ST3, but might be a bit of a stretch)
3. depreciation/running costs
- might be able to reduce mileage a bit, but is even 15k a year a lot to put on one of these?
4. tangerine scream - was this shade changed when they did the facelift (older examples look 'more yellow' in photos, or is it just me
)
Current car is a Mk3.5 Focus Zetec S diesel (148bhp), chosen because I do close to 20k miles a year. As much as I love the car, there's still a part of me which would like an ST. Didn't go for the diesel ST because I don't really feel it's a 'proper' ST, and at some point I could remap mine to a similar, if not higher power output. Mrs ZS is thinking about changing her car later this year, and as she really likes mine its possible she'd take mine and I could go for an ST (although at this stage she thinks diesel ST, but I'll worry about that later
)I guess I'm asking if given the mileage I'd be doing, am I mad in considering a petrol ST? Obviously fuel costs would shoot up, at the moment I easily average 50mpg on my 'spirited' cross country commute, and although I can drive economically (I used to average 40-45ish mpg in my old 1.6 petrol focus, without dawdling), when you take into account the fun factor of an ST I imagine I'd be looking at much lower.
So my questions are:
1. roughly what mpg do you get in the real world? (and under what conditions?)
2. facelift ST-2 or pre-facelift ST-3 (my preference is facelift ST3, but might be a bit of a stretch)
3. depreciation/running costs
- might be able to reduce mileage a bit, but is even 15k a year a lot to put on one of these?4. tangerine scream - was this shade changed when they did the facelift (older examples look 'more yellow' in photos, or is it just me
)I drive a facelift ST3 in Tangerine Scream, which replaced a 2014 ST3.
As much as I love my car I would not have it if I had to drive 20000 miles per year because fuel costs would be a killer. If I drive fairly gently I can average high 30's on a longer run with a bit of urban driving at either end, but it would be very easy for this average to drop into the 20's with a change of driving style.
I would definitely recommend the facelift model because it drives better due to the suspension tweaks over the pre facelift and also has a nicer dashboard layout.
Tangerine Scream has not changed colour, but ever since I seen it on the facelift model it just seems to suit the car better than it did the pre facelift. I put this down to the more angular lines of the facelift model.
As much as I love my car I would not have it if I had to drive 20000 miles per year because fuel costs would be a killer. If I drive fairly gently I can average high 30's on a longer run with a bit of urban driving at either end, but it would be very easy for this average to drop into the 20's with a change of driving style.
I would definitely recommend the facelift model because it drives better due to the suspension tweaks over the pre facelift and also has a nicer dashboard layout.
Tangerine Scream has not changed colour, but ever since I seen it on the facelift model it just seems to suit the car better than it did the pre facelift. I put this down to the more angular lines of the facelift model.
Averaging 29mpg in my mk3 facelift but I do an awful lot of shorter journeys (my commute is less than 3 miles). I reckon you could easily average low to mid 30s with a more typical mix.
Yes, the seat bolsters are narrow but they seem more forgiving with the ST3 leather and they gradually adapt to your shape over the first few weeks. Pretty comfortable now and certainly not an issue (I'm 6-4 and over 16st).
Yes, the seat bolsters are narrow but they seem more forgiving with the ST3 leather and they gradually adapt to your shape over the first few weeks. Pretty comfortable now and certainly not an issue (I'm 6-4 and over 16st).
Finding it very hard to believe you're seeing 40+ mpg on occasions, Ron. You must be driving at 50mph on long downhill stretches of motorway with a good tail wind!
Doing 80-90mph over a prolonged motorway/dc drive will see mpg in the low 30s. 70-80 mid 30s and anything under 70 (which no true ST driver would be seen dead doing) probably high 30s, maybe low 40s if you're REALLY trying hard.
General tootling around locally/traffic/cold/odd traffic light grand prix expect to see high 20s. Most of my driving is short journeys but it gets a high speed workout on a nearby motorway when I'm feeling in the mood and my mpg has hovered around 26-27 for about a year now and I run it on V-power. It's a 2013 ST-3 estate. If I cut out the motorway blasts it'll sit around 28-29 long term from local tootling/traffic.
The seats are not suited for larger framed people. I'm 6'3 and 16.5st and while the seat does mold to your body as mentioned above, I find the right side leg bolster prevents me from getting a comfortable angle on the accelerator pedal and starts to give me cramp in my right knee on a long drive. I've tried pretty much every combination of seat adjustments available and nothing works. Moving the seat further forward would be the natural solution, but the lower dashboard shroud protrudes so much that for those with long legs you end up with your right knee resting on the headlight knob.
All that said, I love mine and have no intention of selling it, even though I hate the torque steer and how it completely fails to get the power down if there's the tiniest bit of moisture on the road.
Doing 80-90mph over a prolonged motorway/dc drive will see mpg in the low 30s. 70-80 mid 30s and anything under 70 (which no true ST driver would be seen dead doing) probably high 30s, maybe low 40s if you're REALLY trying hard.
General tootling around locally/traffic/cold/odd traffic light grand prix expect to see high 20s. Most of my driving is short journeys but it gets a high speed workout on a nearby motorway when I'm feeling in the mood and my mpg has hovered around 26-27 for about a year now and I run it on V-power. It's a 2013 ST-3 estate. If I cut out the motorway blasts it'll sit around 28-29 long term from local tootling/traffic.
The seats are not suited for larger framed people. I'm 6'3 and 16.5st and while the seat does mold to your body as mentioned above, I find the right side leg bolster prevents me from getting a comfortable angle on the accelerator pedal and starts to give me cramp in my right knee on a long drive. I've tried pretty much every combination of seat adjustments available and nothing works. Moving the seat further forward would be the natural solution, but the lower dashboard shroud protrudes so much that for those with long legs you end up with your right knee resting on the headlight knob.
All that said, I love mine and have no intention of selling it, even though I hate the torque steer and how it completely fails to get the power down if there's the tiniest bit of moisture on the road.
Old Tyke said:
Finding it very hard to believe you're seeing 40+ mpg on occasions, Ron.
I never said that so don't know where you're getting that from. In fact I've never seen a proper average in the 40's with either of my ST's.High 30's is what I said, which is perfectly achievable if you drive with economy in mind. This does not mean slow....I always at least keep up with the traffic.
Regarding the leather seats in an ST3....I initially found them quite uncomfortable after a short time in my pre facelift Mk.3, but no such problems in the facelift model. I have heard other people say the same thing so leads me to believe Ford made some adjustments to the seats.
Edited by Ron240 on Wednesday 15th March 13:26
I drove a Mk 2 Focus ST as a daily driver, doing 12-15K miles a year, for 9 years. I finally swapped it for a Mk3 ST3 in Tangerine Scream last week.
The Mk2 was even more thirsty than the Mk3. I could see mid-30s on a long motorway run if I kept it no higher than 70, but low 30s was more realistic and I could never get it to return more than 25-26 mpg around town and on my 15 mile mixed local roads and A-roads commute. For all that, I liked the car - and the lovely 5 pot engine noise made up (at least in part!) for the fact it was thirstier than Oliver Reed and had a distinctly Spartan utilitarian interior.
The Mk3 is a much more pleasant place to be, even if the engine noise is lacking and distinctly uninspiring. It's averaging low 30s over the first 500 miles, which is a roughly even mix of the commute as above and motorway/fast A-road driving.
I love the Tangerine Scream colour. I was never a fan of the Electric "Asbo" Orange of the Mk2 but TS is a much yellower shade and IMO rather more appealing. I'm not aware that TS changed between the original Mk3 and the facelift Mk3, so by "facelift" I'm guessing you're referring to the change from the Mk2 to the Mk3. If so, the orange colour did change - from EO to TS.
The Mk2 was even more thirsty than the Mk3. I could see mid-30s on a long motorway run if I kept it no higher than 70, but low 30s was more realistic and I could never get it to return more than 25-26 mpg around town and on my 15 mile mixed local roads and A-roads commute. For all that, I liked the car - and the lovely 5 pot engine noise made up (at least in part!) for the fact it was thirstier than Oliver Reed and had a distinctly Spartan utilitarian interior.
The Mk3 is a much more pleasant place to be, even if the engine noise is lacking and distinctly uninspiring. It's averaging low 30s over the first 500 miles, which is a roughly even mix of the commute as above and motorway/fast A-road driving.
I love the Tangerine Scream colour. I was never a fan of the Electric "Asbo" Orange of the Mk2 but TS is a much yellower shade and IMO rather more appealing. I'm not aware that TS changed between the original Mk3 and the facelift Mk3, so by "facelift" I'm guessing you're referring to the change from the Mk2 to the Mk3. If so, the orange colour did change - from EO to TS.
Ron240 said:
Old Tyke said:
Finding it very hard to believe you're seeing 40+ mpg on occasions, Ron.
I never said that so don't know where you're getting that from.Ron240 said:
I can average high 30's on a longer run
If you're averaging high 30s then in order to do that you're getting into the 40s, obviously!Old Tyke said:
If you're averaging high 30s then in order to do that you're getting into the 40s, obviously!
It is an average over a certain distance and the end result is just that.If you want to put it that way I could tell you at a given moment I seen 99.9 as the instant fuel consumption, but also single figures too.
I have achieved high 30's as an average over a 100 mile round trip between my home and the Glasgow Hydro arena.
Driving economically while still making progress is not an easy thing to do, it takes a lot of practice.
I hope we both understand each other now.
Edited by Ron240 on Wednesday 15th March 14:15
Thanks guys for the info, really helpful 
Re. the colour, I was referring to potential differences between the Mk3 and Mk3.5 tangerine scream (rather than 'Asbo Orange' on the Mk2), but looking again at a few over lunch I think any difference is due to different light conditions in the photos.
Ron - I agree the dash layout is much nicer in the facelift, and as my current Focus has the facelift I think it would be difficult to go back to the older design.
Not too worried about the seats as I'm only 5'9, but from what you all say the fuel costs are probably going to be too much in the long term. I could probably live with mid to high 30's, but as much of my commute is across fairly quiet B roads I can't see that being realistic
Think I'll probably stick with the current Focus for the time being, at least until I can find a job closer to home.
Re. the colour, I was referring to potential differences between the Mk3 and Mk3.5 tangerine scream (rather than 'Asbo Orange' on the Mk2), but looking again at a few over lunch I think any difference is due to different light conditions in the photos.
Ron - I agree the dash layout is much nicer in the facelift, and as my current Focus has the facelift I think it would be difficult to go back to the older design.
Not too worried about the seats as I'm only 5'9, but from what you all say the fuel costs are probably going to be too much in the long term. I could probably live with mid to high 30's, but as much of my commute is across fairly quiet B roads I can't see that being realistic
Think I'll probably stick with the current Focus for the time being, at least until I can find a job closer to home.
You also need to factor in the resale value if you buy an outlandish colour like TS. Yes it will appeal to a small number of people, but the majority will be looking for a less shouty colour which naturally limits your market and ultimately result in weekly reductions in price until you get a bite.
Long term average for most petrol mk3 ST owners seems to be around 29 mpg from reading owner forums. A long term average of mid to high 30s is pie in the sky.
Long term average for most petrol mk3 ST owners seems to be around 29 mpg from reading owner forums. A long term average of mid to high 30s is pie in the sky.
Ron240 said:
Old Tyke said:
A long term average of mid to high 30s is pie in the sky
As a long term average I would certainly agree with that. 
Ron240 said:
hy would you even want to do this? Even if it was possible you would need to keep the car forever to recoup your initial outlay.
Because 20,000 miles a year at 29mpg. Let me explain.690 gallons
3136 litres @£1:20/litre = £3762
LPG @60p/gallon = £1881 ( http://www.whatprice.co.uk/petrol-prices/recent-lp... )
Saving per year = £1881
Price of conversion £1000-£1400 So by the end of month 8, you are in profit.
Yes, LPG has a lower specific energy per litre, but turbo engines love LPG (higher effective octane) and you can run more aggressive timing and a de-cat, for a higher overall power output. It also doesn't smell of diesel and go takkatakkatakka.
Zad said:
Because 20,000 miles a year at 29mpg. Let me explain.
690 gallons
3136 litres @£1:20/litre = £3762
LPG @60p/gallon = £1881 ( http://www.whatprice.co.uk/petrol-prices/recent-lp... )
Saving per year = £1881
Price of conversion £1000-£1400 So by the end of month 8, you are in profit.
Yes, LPG has a lower specific energy per litre, but turbo engines love LPG (higher effective octane) and you can run more aggressive timing and a de-cat, for a higher overall power output. It also doesn't smell of diesel and go takkatakkatakka.
That's great! Presumably you never plan to change it and keep it til it's worth scrap money because that's all you'll get for if you try to sell it. The market for LPG STs is zero, hence why there aren't any. 690 gallons
3136 litres @£1:20/litre = £3762
LPG @60p/gallon = £1881 ( http://www.whatprice.co.uk/petrol-prices/recent-lp... )
Saving per year = £1881
Price of conversion £1000-£1400 So by the end of month 8, you are in profit.
Yes, LPG has a lower specific energy per litre, but turbo engines love LPG (higher effective octane) and you can run more aggressive timing and a de-cat, for a higher overall power output. It also doesn't smell of diesel and go takkatakkatakka.
dieseluser07 said:
Thread hijack.
Are these reliable motors?
And aslong as i get the 2.5 focus st am i going to get that lovely engine note?
I ran a Mk2 ST for 8 years and 100K miles. It was very reliable - the only real mechanical failure I had was the alternator. It had a couple of other minor issues during that time but on the whole, whatever else it could be criticised for, reliability wasn't an issue.Are these reliable motors?
And aslong as i get the 2.5 focus st am i going to get that lovely engine note?
(NB All bets are off if it has the ECU tinkered with and so there may well have been additional wear on the related components. Mine was chipped to around 260bhp for around half my period of ownership before I put it back to stock for the last 4 or so years)
Yes, the Mk 2 is the one with the 2.5 litre 5 cylinder engine, which has a much more inspring engine note than the Mk3 2 litre 4 pot.
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