New G4 & G12 Makers or is it Dare?

[Snapper7]

New G4 & G12 Makers or is it Dare?

http://www.ginetta-g4-g12.com

Anyone know what is going on because their website has very little details and only states the following:

Ginetta G4 and G12 are sports cars born in 1960s. Only our company, Ginetta G4 & G12 (UK) Ltd solely holds the manufacturing right for those 2 models and currently the productions are temporarily stopped due to the new project.

All cars built somewhere else without our knowledge are fakes and it is illegal to sell cars using the names Ginetta G4/Ginetta G12 or with the Ginetta badges on.

Our official G12s produced 1990s onwards all have Cosworth YAC engines and the cars with other type of engines are not genuine G12s.

We keep all the chassis numbers from the first G4 and G12 built by Ginetta Cars and please contact us if you have any doubt about your car

[Foolish Dave]

http://www.ginetta-g4-g12.com/about_us.html

about page said:

About us

Only company who can officially make, modify and sell Ginetta G4 and Ginetta G12.

Ginetta G4 and G12 (UK) Ltd was set up in 1995 to supply genuine G4s and G12s. Our cars have been sold through our official agents. Just one genuine G4 had been delivered in the UK back in 1997 since we acquired the exclusive right for G4 and G12.

We are currently developing our brand new G4 and G12, and further information will be published in due course.

???

Very (very) cheap looking and feeling site too - There is no company information at all - no registered addresses, etc... all very odd. Looks like somebody has just registered the address with a.n.other hosting company and stuck that there - I'll check out who is registered for the address...

Registered on 28th May 2008, with register.com (based in Florida) by BT Business Internet Servies.

Registration contat is "kumiko english" in Colchester (there is a full address and telephone number if you want it PM me and I'll send you the URL with all these details).
Technical contact is BT and the name is locked (cannot be moved to another hosting platform).

[Foolish Dave]

Also odd as they quote Ford Zetec as the engine in the G4, but they also imply there has been only one car since 1997... wasn't that before the Zetec platform was launched?

[B-T]

Just to let you know, it is NOT me! I am BT (from Palm Beach Gardens, Florida), but am only a G20 owner and Ginetta enthusiast!
GO CANES!
BT

[geeeman]

This has obviously been put together by a Japanese.
The rights are still owned by someone out there, and maybe what with all the recent happenings they are rightly feeling they should put their mark on the G4/G12 brand...
The agent(s) are DARE of course

[Davyde]

And the company G4 & G12 (UK) Ltd is not registered at companies House - curious!

[dandarez]

Ms Kumiko does indeed act on behalf of the legal owner of the rights!!

Warning shot across the bows mesuspects

Bit like the Beeb, think they can get away with anything...

then all hell breaks loose

Edited by dandarez on Wednesday 29th October 22:12

[captainsensible]

I agree - it’s a pretty blunt reminder that the copyright is still active. I would not be surprised if it’s not a precursor to some kind of 'example' legal action - it would only take one case (which would be undefendable from what I've seen and would have to be settled out of court ££££££) to see off any other builders for many years. Just to speculate a bit more the damages would be assessed on the profit made from plagiarising their copyright which judging by the rubbish built and the consequent profit made would be a mighty sum.

[jamesG20V6]

Speculation often leads to trouble in my experience.
I'm not sure branding it 'rubbish built' is such a good idea either, irrespective of what is going on which only time will tell.

[captainsensible]

jamesG20V6 said:

Speculation often leads to trouble in my experience.

So we must all be in "trouble" along with everybody else on pistonheads. Or did you mean in this instance?

[captainsensible]

Davyde said:

And the company G4 & G12 (UK) Ltd is not registered at companies House - curious!

Thats incorrect. Company was Registered in 1995 at an address in Colchester. Kumiko English is a Director. He's also a Director of Chevron Cars UK Ltd. The plot thickens!!

[dandarez]

'He's'??????? Read my earlier reply

Ms Kumiko

She's a Lady (as the Tom Jones hit went in 1971)

Edited by dandarez on Friday 31st October 22:41

[Davyde]

Evening Captain s - what's the company's registration number? I can then do a quick search at Companies House.

[Broomsticklady]

The 'sub contractor' the site refers to is DARE - at least it would appear so as the picture of a G4 interior has the 'DARE' embossed leatherette panel above the gearbox tunnel.

My guess is that this has been put together in response to Ginetta Heritage - and consequently Ginetta Cars Ltd - offering these cars.

It begs the question whether the copyright owners regard the more recent G4/G12 production from DARE as being 'legitimate'. Not that I care much, as the cars are great, and I care more about the cars than the politics...

[geeeman]

I think the copyright owners regard the Dare cars as the only legitimate ones produced in the last 10 years, as they are the only ones commissioned by the copyright owners to build them..

[captainsensible]

it's my understanding that Dare were commissioned by the copyright holders to modify the G4 to accept the zetec and bring the rear suspension up to modern standards after the failure of Phaff's Ginetta Company. The majority of the subsequent Dare built G4's were sent to Japan.

[dandarez]

they did a tad more than 'modify'...
the Dare G4 was completely re-engineered - it may 'look' similar to the original but is different in so many ways, not least the detailing and quality.

[captainsensible]

My understanding of the word modify surely is the same as yours and anybody else's......i.e. alter, change, adapt, adjust, become, convert, correct, customise, doctor, mutate, recast, redo, refashion, reform, remodel, reorganize, repair, reshape, revise, rework, transfigure, transform, transmogrify, transmute, vary. I think that covers the changes that Dare made - it was not a new car!

BUT my actual point is that the modifications were commissioned by the copyright holders making the cars made totally within copyright. Dare are clearly the official builders and agents.

[dandarez]

'Modify' still conjures up pictures of someone adding wide wheels, an air dam and cone filter etc (lol), but fair enough I can see where you are coming from.

However, you can tell Ivor they didn't make a new car in the Dare G4, they just took an original to 'modify'.
Me? I wouldn't!

Incidentally, Dare weren't commissioned to put in the Zetec either. In fact, the first lot cars had 1700cc Ford xflows and live rear axles.
If I remember right it wasn't until later in 95 the Zetec was fitted along with the rear independent set up.

Edited by dandarez on Sunday 23 November 02:19

[geeeman]

was Dare around for long before '95?