Change of plans for me?
Discussion
Well I don't know if you've heard, but THIS might help to explain it a little. Basically as of Jan 1 next year, NZ will be adopting a Japanese emissions standard on all vehicles imported. Details can be found HERE.
Basically this will prohibit all Jap imports older than 2002 or so, and given that they're following a Japanese standard, it'll probably be an even harsher limit on European imports.
Now it's no secret that I want an S1 Exige, I had planned to save up and bring one in an about 18 months time, but as it's looking at the moment, if i don't bring one in by the end of December, I'll never be able to bring one in. JAPAN 00/02 is a rough equivalent to EURO2. The S1 Elise complies with this standard and the S1 Exige is MEANT to comply, but in reality (in a border test) it never would.... effectively banning the importation of S1 Exiges as of the end of the year.
This means that I'm either:
a) Going to have to get a chunky loan and bring the S1 Exige in (and just when I'd paid the Elise off too!)
b) Sell my Elise and with the proceeds, bring an S1 Exige in with little or no debt.
c) Hope that I'll be able to sneak an S1 Exige in later under radar and try to circumvent the emissions regs.
d) Give up on any hope of owning an S1 Exige in NZ.
Now, I DON'T want to sell the Elise.... to me the Exige will be a much more focussed toy. The Elise will be relegated to sunny Sunday afternoons and weekends away in the summer as well as handling any spirited road-driving, where the Exige will be a track toy and garage-warmer. If I sold the Elise, I'd be left with a much less-usable Lotus than I have now and one that's realistically no quicker on the road than what I have now, without the reliability.
The bonus is that if I bring in an Exige and the law changes I'll be left with the only S1 Exige in NZ (although there will be another here before the end of the year, so it'll be one of two)... and you won't be able to bring any more in, hence retaining BRILLIANT residuals and meaning that if I decided I'd made the wrong move, I could sell either the Elise OR the Exige (or both) at a later date, should I feel the need to liquidate.
What to do, what to do? At the moment it's looking increasingly like there's no chance the S1 Exige will pass border emissions testing, so it's looking like it's off to get me a loan, and I'll get hunting for S1 Exiges in the UK..... exciting times huh?
Basically this will prohibit all Jap imports older than 2002 or so, and given that they're following a Japanese standard, it'll probably be an even harsher limit on European imports.
Now it's no secret that I want an S1 Exige, I had planned to save up and bring one in an about 18 months time, but as it's looking at the moment, if i don't bring one in by the end of December, I'll never be able to bring one in. JAPAN 00/02 is a rough equivalent to EURO2. The S1 Elise complies with this standard and the S1 Exige is MEANT to comply, but in reality (in a border test) it never would.... effectively banning the importation of S1 Exiges as of the end of the year.
This means that I'm either:
a) Going to have to get a chunky loan and bring the S1 Exige in (and just when I'd paid the Elise off too!)
b) Sell my Elise and with the proceeds, bring an S1 Exige in with little or no debt.
c) Hope that I'll be able to sneak an S1 Exige in later under radar and try to circumvent the emissions regs.
d) Give up on any hope of owning an S1 Exige in NZ.
Now, I DON'T want to sell the Elise.... to me the Exige will be a much more focussed toy. The Elise will be relegated to sunny Sunday afternoons and weekends away in the summer as well as handling any spirited road-driving, where the Exige will be a track toy and garage-warmer. If I sold the Elise, I'd be left with a much less-usable Lotus than I have now and one that's realistically no quicker on the road than what I have now, without the reliability.
The bonus is that if I bring in an Exige and the law changes I'll be left with the only S1 Exige in NZ (although there will be another here before the end of the year, so it'll be one of two)... and you won't be able to bring any more in, hence retaining BRILLIANT residuals and meaning that if I decided I'd made the wrong move, I could sell either the Elise OR the Exige (or both) at a later date, should I feel the need to liquidate.
What to do, what to do? At the moment it's looking increasingly like there's no chance the S1 Exige will pass border emissions testing, so it's looking like it's off to get me a loan, and I'll get hunting for S1 Exiges in the UK..... exciting times huh?
IMO If you KNOW that it is unlikely you would be unable to import the S1 next year then start saving. The later you leave it the more you will have saved reducing the amount of interest you will have to pay with a smaller loan. At the same time tho I would be looking out for the deal of deals in the U.K between now and December. That way if a screaming deal comes up you are in the position to buy immediately. Sometimes it's swings and roundabouts. NZ $, good price on a car with mods that someones trying to get out of, interest rates, shipping fees etc. Are you looking for a mint unmodified S1 or one with all the goodies? Just make sure you don't leave it too late and it's delayed coming over and lands in NZ too late.
Hmmm.... interesting dilemma. The potential for rock solid residuals makes it a tempting time to import even if it is a financial stretch. Will this be yet another hurdle for late model TVRs too then? I guess it's now or never to bring in an '06 (less than 200 produced) Sagaris/Tuscan II/T350...
anonymous said:
[redacted]
That's what I'm thinking. I managed to pay the Elise off according to my financial plan, the Exige would probably be a similar kettle of fish. I COULD do it, although it'll mean another couple of years of sacrifice and living cheaply, but I'm happy with that for the time being, I'm in no hurry to buy a house or anything silly in the current market. I'm single and I dictate my own destiny, and my job future is looking VERY secure at the moment with (in all likelihood) that I could be doing financially pretty well in another year or two.So what does this all mean? I'd better get hunting for a good Exige then hadn't I?
Hairdressers car 
You'll have to try Jez's when it gets here in a few months. Ken is excited apparently. I've seen too many go 'pop' on track days to still love them. Collectors car though George - worth having I reckon. Jez's is the ex 1999 Lotus Motor Show car. You could eat your dinner off it.
You'll have to try Jez's when it gets here in a few months. Ken is excited apparently. I've seen too many go 'pop' on track days to still love them. Collectors car though George - worth having I reckon. Jez's is the ex 1999 Lotus Motor Show car. You could eat your dinner off it.
Richard Gee said:
Hairdressers car
You'll have to try Jez's when it gets here in a few months. Ken is excited apparently. I've seen too many go 'pop' on track days to still love them. Collectors car though George - worth having I reckon. Jez's is the ex 1999 Lotus Motor Show car. You could eat your dinner off it.
Worth having for sure... they've got to be pretty good value in the UK, and given the captive market that's looking like it'll eventuate here, it probably makes sense to have one of the only two that'll ever be registerable You'll have to try Jez's when it gets here in a few months. Ken is excited apparently. I've seen too many go 'pop' on track days to still love them. Collectors car though George - worth having I reckon. Jez's is the ex 1999 Lotus Motor Show car. You could eat your dinner off it.
In any case I'm going to get saving and keep one eye on the used Exige market and see what happens over the next few months with how the legislation progresses as it's hammered out into a final law... this is the goal though
Interesting dilemma. I have two thoughts:
1) The regulations need to be the most appropriate solution rather than excessively pragmatic. Looks like unless we can influence a change there is no possibility of me importing a Macca F1
2) I realize that the heart wants what it wants, but objectively why couldn't a Londa Elise v2 be as good as, or better than, an Exige?
1) The regulations need to be the most appropriate solution rather than excessively pragmatic. Looks like unless we can influence a change there is no possibility of me importing a Macca F1
2) I realize that the heart wants what it wants, but objectively why couldn't a Londa Elise v2 be as good as, or better than, an Exige?
Kiwi XTR2 said:
Interesting dilemma. I have two thoughts:
1) The regulations need to be the most appropriate solution rather than excessively pragmatic. Looks like unless we can influence a change there is no possibility of me importing a Macca F1
2) I realize that the heart wants what it wants, but objectively why couldn't a Londa Elise v2 be as good as, or better than, an Exige?
1) Well yeah, it certainly doesn't look like there'll be any exceptions, although it does say that "historic" vehicles would be exempt, but whether they define historic as in "pre 19XX", or "of historical significance" remains to be seen. I suspect the former... Strongly.1) The regulations need to be the most appropriate solution rather than excessively pragmatic. Looks like unless we can influence a change there is no possibility of me importing a Macca F1
2) I realize that the heart wants what it wants, but objectively why couldn't a Londa Elise v2 be as good as, or better than, an Exige?
2) Yes, well theoretically, an Elise can be made as quick or quicker than an Exige. An Exige is nothing more than an Elise with bigger, wider wheels, a VHPD engine (190bhp vs. 118bhp), a quicker steering rack on riased mounts, close ratio PG1 gearbox from the Elise 111S, Lotus Sport Suspension (which isn't all that good), Different seat, harnesses and interior trimming and a wider, fastback, hardtop body. So in effect there's no differences between the two that can't be addressed by bolt-ons (including the body which can be bought and retrofitted from aftermarket suppliers. A honda'd Elise on Nitron suspension with sticky tyres will be faster than an Exige in all areas as it'll have more power and be lighter. The only area of advantage the Exige has over the Elise potentially (without doing a body sawp) is improved aero as it generates a fair whack of downforce. The thing is, I've always wanted an Exige ever since they came out. But then again I've always wanted an Elise too. I's one of my dreams to have a "matching pair" since, to me, they embody all that I desire between them.
If I got an Exige, the plan would be to Honda-power it in the future, but would leave it VHPD powered for the time being, until well after it was paid off. Part of the attraction with the Exige too would be the exclusivity. I'm in no hurry to own one, but if this is my last chance to own one in NZ, I'll kick myself if I pass it up. Maybe I should just sell the Elise and trade up to the Exige, because that I could do rather comfortably, have it bought and paid for by the time the year's out and then begin the modding phase, getting it prepped for the K20 engine. That's still a very real possibility, for little other than the reason of not having the room to store two cars! I KNOW I'd miss the Elise, especially as mine's been such a good one, but I do have the hankering for more power and I just can't justify butchering my Elise because in base-spec it's economical, reliable and fun, if not the paciest thing on the road.
I've always wanted to build a Honda'd Exige (so has Dean/Londa) and if I built a Honda'd Elise, I just know I'd stand back at the end of it all and wish that I'd done it with an Exige.
Aargh... just took her out for a spin and the magic is still there, I want to keep her!
In all likelihood I'll borrow the cash, bring an Exige into the country, and play it by ear. Worst comes to worst I have to decide which one stays and which one goes.
Edited by Esprit on Saturday 26th May 13:47
Ffirg 005 said:
Hmmm.... interesting dilemma. The potential for rock solid residuals makes it a tempting time to import even if it is a financial stretch. Will this be yet another hurdle for late model TVRs too then? I guess it's now or never to bring in an '06 (less than 200 produced) Sagaris/Tuscan II/T350...
Is this now allowed?????
Hi George, I got your life sussed 
sit down.......sell your S1 while you can still get reasonable money for it, pay back whats owing on the S1. For the sale of the S1 you will get a tasty deposit for a property. Get advice on buying, buy it and rent it out. For you to live - rent a shared flat to negotiate a closed in garage for the Exige - a must for any supercar!! You can negative gear the rental property to work for you using a great accountant (can supply you ours) and have that spare cash (your work earnings) for you to live a normal life. In ten years time youll thank yourself for doing it. Youll punch yourself if you dont and miss the boat!!
So what about the Exige? You say you can borrow money off the parents. This is the cheapest form of borrowing ever and so long as both parties are happy that ends are being met, its better than any lending criteria out there.
You can do both George
sit down.......sell your S1 while you can still get reasonable money for it, pay back whats owing on the S1. For the sale of the S1 you will get a tasty deposit for a property. Get advice on buying, buy it and rent it out. For you to live - rent a shared flat to negotiate a closed in garage for the Exige - a must for any supercar!! You can negative gear the rental property to work for you using a great accountant (can supply you ours) and have that spare cash (your work earnings) for you to live a normal life. In ten years time youll thank yourself for doing it. Youll punch yourself if you dont and miss the boat!!So what about the Exige? You say you can borrow money off the parents. This is the cheapest form of borrowing ever and so long as both parties are happy that ends are being met, its better than any lending criteria out there.
You can do both George
Edited by Kylie on Saturday 26th May 23:14
Staying out of property for the next couple of years.... market is high and stagnant.... time for getting into property will be in 2-3 years. At the moment, I still flat with others in a shared situation, the rent I pay would barely cover rates on a place of my own! The wa it stands at the moment is my living costs are so low that getting into property in the current market makes no sense at all for me. I still should be saving for a property in years to come instead of buying sports cars, I know that, but I've spent a lot of my life doing the sensible things with my money (Elise being the only exception, and I've not really lost any money on that in retrospect), so the Exige is definitely on the cards.
The S1 is all paid off, and I could get decent money for it. Parental loan is good money because we have a good understanding, I've borrowed similar amounts from them before (Elise and Education) and every time I've paid it back before time and they've made money off of it, so it works out well for everyone..
The S1 is all paid off, and I could get decent money for it. Parental loan is good money because we have a good understanding, I've borrowed similar amounts from them before (Elise and Education) and every time I've paid it back before time and they've made money off of it, so it works out well for everyone..
Kylie is talking a lot of sense George. In five years time you could be looking at something a whole lot more impressive than an Exige if you invest wisely. Mind you, there's no reason you can't do both.
Put the Elise on the market now, it may take a while to sell as you can never judge these things. You need as much time as possible to source the perfect Exige and not grab the first one that comes up. Having the cash to pay for one means you'll be able to move quickly and strike a deal. Talk to your parents about the loan and if necessary take it now and purchase a property - the sooner you get a foot on the ladder the better. It's still the best form of investment in NZ by a long shot.
I wouldn't sell a car I enjoy as much as you enjoy the Elise to buy a car I was only going to use on the odd track-day. Actually, I would never buy a car I wouldn't be prepared to use day-in day-out. All of my TVRs have been used as sole transport at some point or another and they usually behave all the better for it. I'm sure the same could be said for an Exige. I'd also question the reasoning behind purchasing a car as specialised and rare as an Exige with plans to modify it - maybe you should start off with a replica or modified car in the first place?
I passed-up the opportunity to bring in my Cerbera when I first moved to NZ and I've regretted it ever since. I also regret not using the cash I brought with me to invest in a property or two at the same time!
For the love of God George, don't make the same mistakes I made!
Put the Elise on the market now, it may take a while to sell as you can never judge these things. You need as much time as possible to source the perfect Exige and not grab the first one that comes up. Having the cash to pay for one means you'll be able to move quickly and strike a deal. Talk to your parents about the loan and if necessary take it now and purchase a property - the sooner you get a foot on the ladder the better. It's still the best form of investment in NZ by a long shot.
I wouldn't sell a car I enjoy as much as you enjoy the Elise to buy a car I was only going to use on the odd track-day. Actually, I would never buy a car I wouldn't be prepared to use day-in day-out. All of my TVRs have been used as sole transport at some point or another and they usually behave all the better for it. I'm sure the same could be said for an Exige. I'd also question the reasoning behind purchasing a car as specialised and rare as an Exige with plans to modify it - maybe you should start off with a replica or modified car in the first place?
I passed-up the opportunity to bring in my Cerbera when I first moved to NZ and I've regretted it ever since. I also regret not using the cash I brought with me to invest in a property or two at the same time!
For the love of God George, don't make the same mistakes I made!
Thanks for the advice Jamie, and I dare say if I ended up with an Exige, it'd end up getting used a fair bit, if not quite as much as the Elise gets used now.
Again as far as the property market goes, I know it's not going to be a BAD investment long term, it's just that there's definitely no big gains to be made in the property market in the mid-short term. I don't think it'll be any harder for me to get my foot on the ladder in 3 years time than it will be now. If we were having this conversation 5 years ago when property was still semi-affordable, I'd definitely be looking at plugging some cash into a property, but for me right now, it makes no sense.
Good thing with the Elise is that I've got a motivated interested buyer should I decide to sell. The original owner desperately wants the car back, which is a good situation to be in. Also given the fact that there are no S1s for sale at the moment and there hasn't been for quite some time means that the current environment is a good one to sell in. Indeed I may put it up at a handsome price and just dangle the line in the water. I'm not fussed if I don't sell it as I don't need to, because in the short term at least I can bear the burden of both cars.
It comes back to the matter of fact that it's costing me almost nothing to live at the moment and while buying a rental makes sense in some ways, it's a hassle I'm not really sure I need at the moment. To be honest, if I had my sensible hat on, I'd just be saving money in term investments for the next 3-4 years, build up a couple hundred K in the bank and then buy into property once the market's cooled off.... the old "buy low, sell high" adage rings strong in my ears and you can't deny that at the moment the property market is "high".
Part of the attraction with the Exige thing is that this could very well end up being something that I can bring over, have a whole bunch of fun with and end up not losing any money on. The whole Elise experience for me has been more than I'd ever hoped for. The I've gotten back into the trackday scene, made a whole bunch of friends through, had a lot of fun, improved my driving and just had a BLAST with, and in the end, it's probably not cost me more than $4k over 2 years... I know some people that spend WAY more money in beer and fags than that!
All I know is that if I DO miss the chance to have an Exige here, it'll be something I regret until my last breath. Much like you with your Cerb Jamie... hell if you'd brought that in you could have had years of fun with it and sold up and probably made $20k on the deal!
Again as far as the property market goes, I know it's not going to be a BAD investment long term, it's just that there's definitely no big gains to be made in the property market in the mid-short term. I don't think it'll be any harder for me to get my foot on the ladder in 3 years time than it will be now. If we were having this conversation 5 years ago when property was still semi-affordable, I'd definitely be looking at plugging some cash into a property, but for me right now, it makes no sense.
Good thing with the Elise is that I've got a motivated interested buyer should I decide to sell. The original owner desperately wants the car back, which is a good situation to be in. Also given the fact that there are no S1s for sale at the moment and there hasn't been for quite some time means that the current environment is a good one to sell in. Indeed I may put it up at a handsome price and just dangle the line in the water. I'm not fussed if I don't sell it as I don't need to, because in the short term at least I can bear the burden of both cars.
It comes back to the matter of fact that it's costing me almost nothing to live at the moment and while buying a rental makes sense in some ways, it's a hassle I'm not really sure I need at the moment. To be honest, if I had my sensible hat on, I'd just be saving money in term investments for the next 3-4 years, build up a couple hundred K in the bank and then buy into property once the market's cooled off.... the old "buy low, sell high" adage rings strong in my ears and you can't deny that at the moment the property market is "high".
Part of the attraction with the Exige thing is that this could very well end up being something that I can bring over, have a whole bunch of fun with and end up not losing any money on. The whole Elise experience for me has been more than I'd ever hoped for. The I've gotten back into the trackday scene, made a whole bunch of friends through, had a lot of fun, improved my driving and just had a BLAST with, and in the end, it's probably not cost me more than $4k over 2 years... I know some people that spend WAY more money in beer and fags than that!
All I know is that if I DO miss the chance to have an Exige here, it'll be something I regret until my last breath. Much like you with your Cerb Jamie... hell if you'd brought that in you could have had years of fun with it and sold up and probably made $20k on the deal!
Edited by Esprit on Sunday 27th May 01:56
George, all the advise given so far is good advise. we all live differant lives, in differant circumstances with differant jobs and differant goals. I must say tho that things car wise truly changed when I brought my first home. We are differant from others in that we are still (9 years) in our first home as it's just what we wanted. Now since I brought a home things definately stepped up car wise as I now have an appreciating asset. Obviously slightly differant as we have other assets. I agree the housing market is hot at the moment but in 3 years property WILL be dearer for a number of reasons. It will become more and more difficult for younger people to buy their first home. You've got some thinking to do. If I had been "careful" with my money I would have never brought a $100K 911 when I was 27. Would I be further ahead financially...Yes...do I regret it...Heck NO. Would I have done it of I didn't own our own home...Nope.
I have trouble finding time driving and maintaning one sports car let alone two. Consider having only one as well and you may be able to buy that house too. Think about it. Nice house with garage, flat mates paying the morgage and a hotted up Lotus in the garage with money to mod it and the whole time the house is an appreciating asset
I have trouble finding time driving and maintaning one sports car let alone two. Consider having only one as well and you may be able to buy that house too. Think about it. Nice house with garage, flat mates paying the morgage and a hotted up Lotus in the garage with money to mod it and the whole time the house is an appreciating asset
George I know where your coming from you just want to cut loose and be free, hell we all feel like that. You can have both your choice. But if your smart you will do both and be happy. Dont rely on a business either to make your money if thats also the plan your taking. Throw your eggs around into proven investments.
There is plenty of opportunity in the future to cash in and do what ever you want to do in life with age on your side, you could be a rich man before you hit 40 or even 35!! at 35 your still pretty young. INFACT GUYS NEVER GROW UP
The cost of property is all relative trust us we know, been in the property market since I was 23 am in my 30's now, in that short time I have done alright!! When we bought in West Harbour nearly 3yrs back we were gutted that we paid waaaay too much for it even after neg them way down on the price. In that short time the value has gone up $300K based same houses in the street that have sold recently.
Shit if I were sell up my share of property blow it all on cars the mind boggles what kind of cars I could have now.
Anyway seems like your made up your mind, all we can do is help guide you
BTW when you get the Exige can I be high on the list to get a spirited ride?
Please
There is plenty of opportunity in the future to cash in and do what ever you want to do in life with age on your side, you could be a rich man before you hit 40 or even 35!! at 35 your still pretty young. INFACT GUYS NEVER GROW UP
The cost of property is all relative trust us we know, been in the property market since I was 23 am in my 30's now, in that short time I have done alright!! When we bought in West Harbour nearly 3yrs back we were gutted that we paid waaaay too much for it even after neg them way down on the price. In that short time the value has gone up $300K based same houses in the street that have sold recently.
Shit if I were sell up my share of property blow it all on cars the mind boggles what kind of cars I could have now.
Anyway seems like your made up your mind, all we can do is help guide you
BTW when you get the Exige can I be high on the list to get a spirited ride?
Please
Kiwi XTR2 said:
I need to find a way to make weekly drive-by visits to my rental properties in the Westie deductable.And if I can . . . I'm bying another one in Taupo
and IRD were happy "as long as I could conduct my business in it" which I did no problem. I also had to keep a log book for 3 or 6 months? Some people jump up and down and cry FBT but we were careful and it was all legit and run past IRD. I suppose if you don't run a business then it would be harder? Do you run your Rentals under a seperate entity?Gassing Station | New Zealand | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff