Speeding ticket and demerit points
Discussion
Hi all,
I'm from the UK but moved over to the North Shore Auckland in November with my Kiwi missus.
I got a ticket from an unmarked traffic cop a couple of days ago (68kph in a 50 zone) but he couldn't show me the photo as his mates sped off to knick some other poor c*nt. Now I know this is just a revenew generator as the little squirt who knicked me wouldn't last 5 minutes doing "proper" police work and I was on a non residential road going no faster than the other cars.
I've a couple of questions:
As I'm currently on my UK licence do the points count? Can I/is it worth contesting the ticket as the pig couldn't show me the photo of my speed?
Thanks in advance for any help.
PS - I love this country but the cops are c*nts - in the UK I'd have got a slapped wrist and did on many occasions
I'm from the UK but moved over to the North Shore Auckland in November with my Kiwi missus.
I got a ticket from an unmarked traffic cop a couple of days ago (68kph in a 50 zone) but he couldn't show me the photo as his mates sped off to knick some other poor c*nt. Now I know this is just a revenew generator as the little squirt who knicked me wouldn't last 5 minutes doing "proper" police work and I was on a non residential road going no faster than the other cars.
I've a couple of questions:
As I'm currently on my UK licence do the points count? Can I/is it worth contesting the ticket as the pig couldn't show me the photo of my speed?
Thanks in advance for any help.
PS - I love this country but the cops are c*nts - in the UK I'd have got a slapped wrist and did on many occasions
Welcome to the country 
How would you contest the ticket?
The way the law is, you have a case to answer. It is not a question of saying "there is no photographic evidence therefore I'm innocent".
The evidence that the Police (note the spelling) have is a statement from the officer. How would you oppose that? Would you swear that you were not speeding?
I'm not sure how the points apply to UK licenses. If you stay here long enough you will need to apply for an NZ licence anyway.
If you would like I can check to see if the road was properly resolved to be 50 kph. If it is non-residential it was almost certainly 70 kph at one stage.
How would you contest the ticket?
The way the law is, you have a case to answer. It is not a question of saying "there is no photographic evidence therefore I'm innocent".
The evidence that the Police (note the spelling) have is a statement from the officer. How would you oppose that? Would you swear that you were not speeding?
I'm not sure how the points apply to UK licenses. If you stay here long enough you will need to apply for an NZ licence anyway.
If you would like I can check to see if the road was properly resolved to be 50 kph. If it is non-residential it was almost certainly 70 kph at one stage.
You technicaly need to convert to an NZ licence 1 year after entering the country. Used to be 1st time so if you came in 1970 then you had to get one NOW..
I think technicaly you can have a day trip to oz every year & never get a kiwi licence. Mate got pulled after 2 years and got a telling off though, had to get a kiwi licence within 1 month & show it at a cop shop.
Points wont count, but you will pay more for insurance on a UK licence I think.
I think technicaly you can have a day trip to oz every year & never get a kiwi licence. Mate got pulled after 2 years and got a telling off though, had to get a kiwi licence within 1 month & show it at a cop shop.
Points wont count, but you will pay more for insurance on a UK licence I think.
Rob is correct, the 1 year rule for changing to a NZ license is per visit. However, if you are on a residency visa like me it may be classed more as a stay than a visit. I have a few months left to read the road code and do the test.
I'd be more worried about validity of insurance if you have an accident. I did make a claim, a month after I arrived in NZ, and the insurance company questioned why I had a UK license, along with a load of other irrelevant questions. They did pay out though.
The police are only doing their job, as their bosses tell them and as their bosses get funded to do. 68 in a 50 sounds like a fair cop to me. In Essex it would be a guaranteed fine, where in the UK were you?
Dan
I'd be more worried about validity of insurance if you have an accident. I did make a claim, a month after I arrived in NZ, and the insurance company questioned why I had a UK license, along with a load of other irrelevant questions. They did pay out though.
The police are only doing their job, as their bosses tell them and as their bosses get funded to do. 68 in a 50 sounds like a fair cop to me. In Essex it would be a guaranteed fine, where in the UK were you?
Dan
I had a scamera ticket - paid the fine which was a bargain $80 
and my (UK) licence wasn't asked for so no points.
Also, I got stopped by a policeman for doing 100 in an 80 limit, used to be a 100kph road. He used his discretion and advised me the limit had changed to 80kph, much better decision maker than a camera!!
I must get a NZ licence soon...
and my (UK) licence wasn't asked for so no points. Also, I got stopped by a policeman for doing 100 in an 80 limit, used to be a 100kph road. He used his discretion and advised me the limit had changed to 80kph, much better decision maker than a camera!!
I must get a NZ licence soon...
You don't get demerit points for camera tickets anyway something to do with not being able to prove who the driver is.
Theres a front page article in the local paper today (Timaru Herald) about a local guy who got done for 109km/h towing a trailer, despite the fact that he had cruise control set to 96 and his GPS said the same thing, and 2 cars had just passed him before the cop pulled him. Cops are refusing to back down, despite the cop who issued it being being unable to say in court that it was definitely his car doing that speed - when asked to he dodged the question with 'I'm a licenced radar operator'. Like that means anything...
something to do with not being able to prove who the driver is. Theres a front page article in the local paper today (Timaru Herald) about a local guy who got done for 109km/h towing a trailer, despite the fact that he had cruise control set to 96 and his GPS said the same thing, and 2 cars had just passed him before the cop pulled him. Cops are refusing to back down, despite the cop who issued it being being unable to say in court that it was definitely his car doing that speed - when asked to he dodged the question with 'I'm a licenced radar operator'. Like that means anything...
Fair enough - thanks for all your replies, guys. I guess I won't be getting out of 1st gear much on my motorbike and may have to swap the car for a shopping trolley
Seriously though, I know I was speeding (now) and I know the Police officer (note the spelling) was only doing his job but the offence was in a non-residential area and I wee bit of discretion would've been nice. I know for the future now.
I did check with my insurance company for both the car and bike that I was OK on a UK licence for 1 year - I will, however, convert long before then. I was more worried about the points than the fine so I guess I'll have to wait and see if they carry over when I convert.
PS - I'm from Chelsea, London.
PPS - The Cop was still an a*se!
Seriously though, I know I was speeding (now) and I know the Police officer (note the spelling) was only doing his job but the offence was in a non-residential area and I wee bit of discretion would've been nice. I know for the future now.
I did check with my insurance company for both the car and bike that I was OK on a UK licence for 1 year - I will, however, convert long before then. I was more worried about the points than the fine so I guess I'll have to wait and see if they carry over when I convert.
PS - I'm from Chelsea, London.
PPS - The Cop was still an a*se!
I was gonna bring the KTM but it worked out more cost effective to sell it in the UK (it was a year and a half old with 8K miles) and buy a new one here (the sterling to kiwi dollar was very good when I changed up) and was a lot less hassle too (no re-registration and emissions testing etc.). So I bought one here - I couldn't live without my KTM.....
I also had a 993TT in London which I sold 6 months before the big move. I hindsite I'm glad I did as I'd have lost my licence with an hour here and probably never got the car out of 1st.
I also had a 993TT in London which I sold 6 months before the big move. I hindsite I'm glad I did as I'd have lost my licence with an hour here and probably never got the car out of 1st.
Of course the cop was an a*se, I've never met one here who wasn't.
The police seem to think they can ticket their way to safer roads, but all they do is antogonize drivers. I frequently make a point of exceeding a speed limit where I won't get caught, and always drive past mobile camera vans at 20, three times if I have the time.
Anyway, licence first. Every time you go out of NZ it validates your overseas licence for 12 months - there in no point in rushing to get an NZ one unless you intend to drive in the UK soon.
The wan***s in Wellington - beat them at their own game by lawful means - some seriously good fun can be had by winding them up in such a way they can do nothing about it. Realize that they run a business to maximize profits and anything done to waste their time is of benefit to everybody. Never, ever, respond to any sort of ticket until three days before the due date of the reminder notice (the reminder notice has to be sent by law).
For a speed camera ticket the only thing to write is "without a photograph to assist with identifying the driver the allegation is denied and a hearing requested"
If stopped the wording is "without a copy of the original ticket to assist in identifying the offence the allegation is denied and a hearing requested".
The next stage of the letter war can depend on the circumstances of the allegation and how they respond, feel free to post on this forum for more advice. Basically the wankers have six months to get you into court, but it is essential to always reply otherwise you can end up with a notice of fine which can be difficult to evade.
Don't forget to always send the postage paid envelopes back with a blank sheet of paper, and write the freepost address on another one - every little helps.
The police seem to think they can ticket their way to safer roads, but all they do is antogonize drivers. I frequently make a point of exceeding a speed limit where I won't get caught, and always drive past mobile camera vans at 20, three times if I have the time.
Anyway, licence first. Every time you go out of NZ it validates your overseas licence for 12 months - there in no point in rushing to get an NZ one unless you intend to drive in the UK soon.
The wan***s in Wellington - beat them at their own game by lawful means - some seriously good fun can be had by winding them up in such a way they can do nothing about it. Realize that they run a business to maximize profits and anything done to waste their time is of benefit to everybody. Never, ever, respond to any sort of ticket until three days before the due date of the reminder notice (the reminder notice has to be sent by law).
For a speed camera ticket the only thing to write is "without a photograph to assist with identifying the driver the allegation is denied and a hearing requested"
If stopped the wording is "without a copy of the original ticket to assist in identifying the offence the allegation is denied and a hearing requested".
The next stage of the letter war can depend on the circumstances of the allegation and how they respond, feel free to post on this forum for more advice. Basically the wankers have six months to get you into court, but it is essential to always reply otherwise you can end up with a notice of fine which can be difficult to evade.
Don't forget to always send the postage paid envelopes back with a blank sheet of paper, and write the freepost address on another one - every little helps.
Sorry bud but I can't agree with you there. As much as I hate getting a ticket or appearing in court (I've had both 
) they have a job to do and I respect them for that. Not all cops are wankers. I have a couple of mates who are cops and are great guys.
It's like any organisation, group, club etc...there are good guys and bad guys.
I suppose you need to ask yourself the question of who your gonna call at 2am in the morning when 2 or 3 guys are on your property or worse in your house...probably those wankers
I beleive they need to use descretion but can you imagine how many excuses they are given each day? Save it for the track or a very deserted back road.
Stretching out the process and abusing freepost etc only comes at a cost to us the taxpayer and ties up valuable police resources.
I blame Helen
) they have a job to do and I respect them for that. Not all cops are wankers. I have a couple of mates who are cops and are great guys. It's like any organisation, group, club etc...there are good guys and bad guys.
I suppose you need to ask yourself the question of who your gonna call at 2am in the morning when 2 or 3 guys are on your property or worse in your house...probably those wankers
I beleive they need to use descretion but can you imagine how many excuses they are given each day? Save it for the track or a very deserted back road.
Stretching out the process and abusing freepost etc only comes at a cost to us the taxpayer and ties up valuable police resources.
I blame Helen
Edited by kiwi carguy on Sunday 21st January 06:52
jaybkay said:
. . . Don't forget to always send the postage paid envelopes back with a blank sheet of paper, and write the freepost address on another one - every little helps.
Are you clinically insane or have you just been drinking too much?
That doesn't 'cost' either the police or courts anything. It costs you for the second envelope and my taxes have paid for the FreePost on both envelopes.
I think I've got to agree with jaybkay - the majority of cops that I've come across (and that's a fair few) are wankers. They're either big meatheads who love a punch up or little squirts that were bullied at school and want revenge on anyone.
It's pretty obvious to me that the complete lack of discretion when dishing out tickets is due to the fact that this system is a revenew generator under the disguise of road safety. Better roads and better driver training would be much more effective.
Jaybkay - thanks for the tips. I'll check out the thing with leaving the country to keep my UK licence and they can f*ck their demerit points.
It's pretty obvious to me that the complete lack of discretion when dishing out tickets is due to the fact that this system is a revenew generator under the disguise of road safety. Better roads and better driver training would be much more effective.
Jaybkay - thanks for the tips. I'll check out the thing with leaving the country to keep my UK licence and they can f*ck their demerit points.
Ewan Oozarmy said:
I got a ticket from an unmarked traffic cop a couple of days ago (68kph in a 50 zone) but he couldn't show me the photo as his mates sped off to knick some other poor c*nt. As I'm currently on my UK licence do the points count? .... Can I/is it worth contesting the ticket as the pig couldn't show me the photo of my speed?
The police dont have video cameras in their cars that record speed, time/date and image. So there is no photo to show. Its their word against yours.
Only fixed speed cameras have photos and speed recorded. I dont think it was them that 'sped off to knick some other poor .....'
In my experience if you go into a situation thinking that all cops are w*nkers you'll get nicked every time. Just take it on the chin and be respectful - sometimes they'll be decent enough and let you off with a warning - if they are allowed! The days of your average PC being able to leave everything to their discretion have long gone.
To my knowledge your UK licence and the immigration department are seperate and cannot (currently) be cross-referenced. I drove on my UK licence for a number of years and if stopped (it happened once or twice) and they asked me how long I had been in the country I always assumed they meant 'this time'. Therefore I wasn't lying. Insurance is another matter though so if you can't afford to lose it........
You are more likely to be pulled-over if your vehicle is not registered against a kiwi licence - this has happened to me on a couple of occasions.
To my knowledge your UK licence and the immigration department are seperate and cannot (currently) be cross-referenced. I drove on my UK licence for a number of years and if stopped (it happened once or twice) and they asked me how long I had been in the country I always assumed they meant 'this time'. Therefore I wasn't lying. Insurance is another matter though so if you can't afford to lose it........
You are more likely to be pulled-over if your vehicle is not registered against a kiwi licence - this has happened to me on a couple of occasions.
I got pulled over in Hastings not so long ago in a licence spot check. It went like this: "how long have you been here? " she aked. "about 4 months ". "how do I know that? " You don't - you'll have to take my word for it." You really ought to carry your passport with you so we can check when you entered the country. " "I really don't want to do that in case it gets nicked out of the works ute, as it has all my visas and permits in it. " Ok, have a good day"!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! They don't seem that bad in Hawkes Bay.
Funnily enough I was chatting with an off duty Auckland traffic cop in a pub recently and we had a long discussion on the subject. He told me that the police are set quotas of traffic tickets which thay have to dish out which are set by the ACC payments they recieve and that is why they cannot generally show any discretion when they stop someone. He did not agree with this at all and said most of his colleagues feel the same.
He also said that he believed the reason the driving standards here are so bad (he was a cop in Europe before moving here) was that allowing a starting driving age of 15 was rediculous and the NZ driving test was the easiest in the civilised world.
So at the end of the day I'll take back what I said in anger at the beggining of this post and agree that on the whole most cops are generally OK (although I have come across some real f*ckers in my younger days) and are only doing what they're told but that it's obvious to all that quotas are in place.
He also said that he believed the reason the driving standards here are so bad (he was a cop in Europe before moving here) was that allowing a starting driving age of 15 was rediculous and the NZ driving test was the easiest in the civilised world.
So at the end of the day I'll take back what I said in anger at the beggining of this post and agree that on the whole most cops are generally OK (although I have come across some real f*ckers in my younger days) and are only doing what they're told but that it's obvious to all that quotas are in place.
Ewan Oozarmy said:
Funnily enough I was chatting with an off duty Auckland traffic cop in a pub recently and we had a long discussion on the subject. He told me that the police are set quotas of traffic tickets which thay have to dish out which are set by the ACC payments they recieve and that is why they cannot generally show any discretion when they stop someone. He did not agree with this at all and said most of his colleagues feel the same. . .
That's not quite right. The NZ Police / ACC / LTNZ contract requires a certain number of traffic enforcement hours (of different types) per region. It is then the regional & district commanders we set the 'quota' . . . oooops I meant 'performance target' . . . oooops I meant 'performance measure'.
I found N.Z police complete to@@ers when it came to speeding, you WILL have to tow the line or you WILL end up getting banned.You won`t ,can`t beat the system.....err...well unless you do what I did.
Got pinged "alledged" about 1/2 mile out of town on an empty road, I WAS out of site of the cops, he had no radar proof of me speeding , he had not photo of me speeding, his work against mine, he even got the make of car I was driving WRONG. Called it a Dodge not a Chrysler. Anyway I wrote to compian and ask for proof but I seems N.Z cops are pure as the driven snow, never lie and it was for ME to prove I wasn`t speeding.
Seeing as I only had a few weeks left in the country before me and car shipped out I just strung things along with a few letters. I don`t mind a fair Nick but to be honest they had been after the Viper for months and the cop just wanted the "scalp" .Well the last laugh was on them coz me and Viper scooted N.Z without paying the fine.
Just my 2p worth but in just over 2 years I got pinged for speeding 4 times yet in the U.K have never had a speeding ticket in almost 18 years of driving. I loved N.Z but the police state when it comes to being a few KM over the limit sucks.
The best time we got away with speeding was when the wife collected the Viper from McDonald Autos in Dunedin , it had been stuck in the work shop for almost 6 weeks waiting more "N.Z red tape" cleanance coz they felt a car fine for the U.S and the whole of Europe was unsafe for N.Z roads ( And that from a country with one of the highest rates of road death ) so she was very pissed to put it lightly with the idea of bring a car 14,000 miles to be told you can`t use it here! So being uninsured, un taxed and still on U.K plates she blasted it back to Mosgiel on the motorway at over 200kph!(thats about 3rd gear!) Got spotted and pinged by a cop car on the other side who couldn`t catch her and had no fix on the car as it didn,t have N.Z plates!
(I kinda think thats why they wanted the Viper "scalp" no matter what,the other tickets were in our Mitzi)
So all you pommes be warned! If you want to keep your well earned $$$$ drive like a ya granny!
Got pinged "alledged" about 1/2 mile out of town on an empty road, I WAS out of site of the cops, he had no radar proof of me speeding , he had not photo of me speeding, his work against mine, he even got the make of car I was driving WRONG. Called it a Dodge not a Chrysler. Anyway I wrote to compian and ask for proof but I seems N.Z cops are pure as the driven snow, never lie and it was for ME to prove I wasn`t speeding.
Seeing as I only had a few weeks left in the country before me and car shipped out I just strung things along with a few letters. I don`t mind a fair Nick but to be honest they had been after the Viper for months and the cop just wanted the "scalp" .Well the last laugh was on them coz me and Viper scooted N.Z without paying the fine.
Just my 2p worth but in just over 2 years I got pinged for speeding 4 times yet in the U.K have never had a speeding ticket in almost 18 years of driving. I loved N.Z but the police state when it comes to being a few KM over the limit sucks.
The best time we got away with speeding was when the wife collected the Viper from McDonald Autos in Dunedin , it had been stuck in the work shop for almost 6 weeks waiting more "N.Z red tape" cleanance coz they felt a car fine for the U.S and the whole of Europe was unsafe for N.Z roads ( And that from a country with one of the highest rates of road death ) so she was very pissed to put it lightly with the idea of bring a car 14,000 miles to be told you can`t use it here! So being uninsured, un taxed and still on U.K plates she blasted it back to Mosgiel on the motorway at over 200kph!(thats about 3rd gear!) Got spotted and pinged by a cop car on the other side who couldn`t catch her and had no fix on the car as it didn,t have N.Z plates!
(I kinda think thats why they wanted the Viper "scalp" no matter what,the other tickets were in our Mitzi) So all you pommes be warned! If you want to keep your well earned $$$$ drive like a ya granny!
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