EDP24

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c c

Original Poster:

7,905 posts

246 months

Sunday 29th October 2006
quotequote all
Guys!

The EDP24 want's to know if: Drivers of the most environmentally-polluting cars like 4x4s and some people carriers could be charged three times more for residents' parking permits under a scheme proposed by Richmond council in London.

Should Norwich City council charge owners of 4x4s more for parking permits?



vote

crankedup

25,764 posts

250 months

Sunday 29th October 2006
quotequote all
is there a valid argument supporting 4x4 in a rural community. At least we see plenty of mud and crap on jeeps around these parts and towbars to that are used. Not so sure about people carriers tho, but then we are all allowed to make our choice of vehicle, arn't we.

c c

Original Poster:

7,905 posts

246 months

Sunday 29th October 2006
quotequote all
What gets to me over this issue is; what mandate do local councils have to levy finical sanctions on people that don’t comply to their PC behaviour patterns.
Should this kind of thing go ahead what will be next? Will obese people or smokers have to pay more council tax because they don’t have the right life style?

Racingdude009

5,303 posts

254 months

Sunday 29th October 2006
quotequote all
Luckly Norwich City Council is not controlled by the Lib Dems so we are unlike to see it as a policy in Norwich well not this side of May any how.

steaming2uk

76 posts

223 months

Sunday 29th October 2006
quotequote all
My 4x4 is LESS poluting than my previous car, a diesel Mondeo Ghia X automatic!
It is now in a LOWER tax group than the Mondeo after the dear chancellors last tax hike!

So if some of these councils do jump on the band wagon they may find that they have bitten off more than they can chew.

m.lovell

822 posts

232 months

Tuesday 31st October 2006
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Yet another money making scheme by taxing better off people. Lets just tax people who can afford it more. Local government could take pictures inside your house then charge you more council tax, the Government could take millions of pounds out of private pension funds, they could charge congestion charges for city centres, put tolls on motorways...
The way things are going in this country it soon wont be worth running a business or having any aspirations of wealth. Seems to me if you havent got any thing the government gives it to you by taking it of the people who work the hardest to improve there life style/aspirations. Most country encourage wealth all we now do in the UK is try to take it from them with stupid stealth taxes.

c c

Original Poster:

7,905 posts

246 months

Thursday 2nd November 2006
quotequote all
Result: Should Norwich City council charge owners of 4x4s more for parking permits?
Yes 40%; No 60% (1443 votes)


This weeks Poll:


POLL

On the day a major report by Sir Nicholas Stern, of the Government's economic service and former World Bank chief economist, warns of the dangers of delaying action to halt climate change, the Government is considering a raft of green taxes to curb harmful carbon emissions.
Would you be prepared to pay more tax to save the climate?

Currently:




m.lovell

822 posts

232 months

Thursday 2nd November 2006
quotequote all
So how will Local councils charging 4x4 owners more to park save the environment ?

MTv Dave

2,101 posts

263 months

Thursday 2nd November 2006
quotequote all
Surely the council should be charging more to the owners of Electric vehicles - they create far more pollutants during their life cycle than a modernish 4x4; why the hell do people buy all the marketing crap about them being nice to vermin bunnies because they produce less emissions per mile?
They are designed as a consumable product and probably aren't expected to do more than 62,000 miles in their life time, so the actual environmental cost per mile may look low, but the creation and displosal of each car is going to be a fair whack of the environemental costs associated with it and are far more than those associated with traditional cars.
mad
Sorry, rant over...

m.lovell

822 posts

232 months

Thursday 2nd November 2006
quotequote all
The best way local councils could save the enviroment would be to start with one great big car crushing plant. Park it up at the side of the road, if the cars arnt taxed, or insured or the driver dosnt have the correct licence crush the cars. It would remove around 28% of all cars of the roads. End of congestion and a 28% cut in polution.
And it would get all the uninsured scum bags of the road
My rant I feel is only just starting.....

busta

4,504 posts

240 months

Monday 6th November 2006
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How will people in 1960s Landrovers fair in all of this?
Uneconomical? Certainly.
Polluting? Oh yes.
Total co2 footprint/lifespan? Probably one of the cleanest things out there.

Like everyone keeps saying, its the total carbon footprint of car, over its entire lifespan, thats the big issue. So a car thats 20 years old and done 200,000 miles is probably better for the environment than an 8 y/o shopping cart thats been scrapped.

Anyway, can't imagine it will happen in Norfolk for a while. Would i be right in assuming roadside permit parking doesnt affect many of us Phers either?

c c

Original Poster:

7,905 posts

246 months

Tuesday 7th November 2006
quotequote all

One way or another they're gonna getcha, they'll getcha, they'll getcha getcha getcha getcha


EDP said:

£500,000 study into Norwich road pricing

SHAUN LOWTHORPE

06 November 2006 07:45

Motorists could be paying to drive around the streets of Norwich within five years as ministers give the green light to a £500,000 project to look in detail at road user charging.

The government will today confirm that it will meet half of the costs of a study to look at how to charge drivers to use the city's roads - with Norfolk council taxpayers stumping up the rest.

Transport chiefs at the county council stressed that the study does not commit the county to charging drivers, but said it was an essential step to test public opinion.

The move also marks a significant shift in gear on developing Norfolk's first congestion charge - the proceeds of which could cover about a quarter of the costs of the controversial £100m Norwich northern bypass (NDR).

And unlike voters in Edinburgh who rejected a congestion charge in a referendum, County Hall appeared to be cool last night on the idea on holding a similar poll - with the final decision set to remain in the hands of politicians.

Transport is the largest single contributor to greenhouse gas emissions in Norfolk - with most occurring in the Norwich area.

And with 33,000 homes earmarked for the city in the next 20 years, traffic jams are also set to get worse.

Options to be explored in the two-year study include a London-style congestion charge based on a cordon around the city, tracking cars fitted with a black box by satellite for a pay as you drive scheme, introducing tolls on some roads, and a charge weighted against high emitting gas guzzling vehicles or discounts for greener cars.

The council is set to work closely with Aviva, parent company of Norwich Union, which has introduced a pay as you drive insurance scheme, to see if its black box technology can by used for mileage-based road charging.

Bus operator First, which is likely to be a big winner if commuters switch to public transport, is also keen to get on board.

The bid for government funding for the study also had the support of the carbon reduction (CRed) scheme, the Highways Agency, and Norfolk chief constable Carole Howlett, who believes that fewer cars could cut accident rates and also speed up officer response times.

But business leaders have given it the thumbs down amid fears charges could drive shoppers away from the city and into the car parks of the its regional retail rivals such as Ipswich and Peterborough or even edge of city retail centres such as the Broadland Business Park and Longwater Lane.

Mike Jackson, head of transport and planning at Norfolk County council, said the funding will enable the authority to explore road user charging options and test public opinion.

“We are looking at a London style cordon charge and distance based charging,” he said. “We are going to look at tolling.

“There is going to have to be a package of solutions and charging may well be required to make that package successful. I think it's right and the council thinks it's right to look at all the options available.

“I genuinely have an open mind about this,” he added. “What you would have to convince people is that the package that would go along with charging in terms of improved public transport is worth having.

“Getting people to pay for something they are getting for free is never going to be easy. We've got to sell them a vision of the future that's better, charging is part of that.”

The council's submission to ministers estimates that a scheme could be in place by 2009/10 “if a charging scheme is found to be feasible and publicly acceptable”.

But Mr Jackson said it was likely to take longer.

“There are some significant statutory processes to go through and they would take two to three years,” he said. “I think the earliest we would say is five years.”

Martin Macwhinnie, general manager at the Castle Mall and chairman of city centre management partnership, has told County Hall that the response would be “very firmly in the negative”.

In an email seen by the EDP he said: “The level of congestion in the city does not warrant such a scheme, indeed vehicle numbers have been falling consistently for the last 10 years. Any congestion scheme would undoubtedly reduce visitor numbers to the detriment of retail business.”

And the Federation of Small Businesses has warned that charging would “hinder small businesses in their day to day operations”.

Adrian Gunson, county council cabinet member for transport, said he was against increasing the burden on motorists if the money went straight to the Treasury. But he would support a scheme that helped tackle local transport issues such as new roads, better bus links or park and ride.

“I would only be in favour if it can be shown that this charge was to going to help road users by the provision of new roads such as the NDR, or in other ways like subsidising more buses,” he said. “If any road charging is introduced in the foreseeable future in Norfolk it would be very limited.

“I'm not in favour of referenda because it's very difficult to get a question that encompasses all the issues,” he added. “The public in Norfolk has shown that it can make its voice known and with elections they can vote for alternatives.”



New poll. Do you support a congestion charge for Norwich?

http://new.edp24.co.uk/default.aspx